Any Core I7 users yet?

Jeff Harper · March 24th, 2009, 03:38 PM

OK, I'm rendering a 1:45 (that's one minute and forty five seconds) clip for Blu Ray (8mbps) with MB effect and it is scheduled to take 52 minutes.

Unblievable. And I mean that in a bad way.

Darren Burns · March 24th, 2009, 04:47 PM

I am in the process of putting a proposal together for a new NLE computer and could use some advice as I am pretty much a novice. I work for a non-profit so the budget isn’t bottomless but I have been asked what I need, so strike while the iron is hot. I was looking at the system Gary put together (post #203 March 4th) but think I will have a lot of trouble justifying a $400 video card especially as I am using Vegas Pro 8 which doesn’t utilize GPU. I am only editing SD video and not doing anything too complex/tricky. Most of the videos are about an hour to two hours. I do need to render to PAL occasionally so rendering speed is important. With my current system 25min of SD video took 4 hrs to render from NTSC source to PAL.

I was thinking:
* Intel i7 920 processor
* Asus P6T Deluxe X58 based motherboard
* 6GB RAM triple channel
* 64 bit OS (XP Pro or Vista????)
* ASUS EN9600GT video card
* 850w power supply??
* 2x1TB drives – 1xSystem/Media, 1xRender Drive
or
* 3x500GB drives – 1xSystem, 1xMedia, 1xRender Drive

I read on another site about using three drives in the system, as described above. Is there any real benefit to that or is two larger drives adequate? I run a very lean system so space on the system drive really isn’t an issue.

Is anything above overkill, future proofing taken into consideration? I am working with donated money after all.

Now to potentially open a can of worms… XP Pro 64 bit or Vista 64 bit?

Gary didn’t mention what speed RAM he used in their system. If I am looking at overclocking the system do I need 1600MHz or will the 1333MHz be sufficient. With the fact that they are the same price on TigerDirect does it really matter?

Will an 850w power supply be ok or should I go smaller/larger?

Thanks in advance.

Jeff Harper · March 24th, 2009, 06:15 PM

If I may recommend:

OS drive (media never should be on same drive)
Get a Western Digital Velociraptor (they are runing about $150 or so). Its only 150GB but I challenge anyone to fill an OS drive more than 30 -40GB. It doesn't make sense any way shape or form to think you need more than 150GB for a OS drive. Newegg.com - Western Digital VelociRaptor WD1500HLFS 150GB 10000 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive (bare drive) - Internal Hard Drives

Media drive: Western Digital Black (no you do not need a separate drive for rendering, though there are those who disagree) I run 10GB of hard drives and would never waste a drive for rendering only. Render to your project file, wherever you put it.

Newegg.com - Western Digital Caviar Black WD1001FALS 1TB 7200 RPM 32MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - Internal Hard Drives

Backup Drive 1TB same as above

Ram could be G.SKILL 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 $95 . This RAM has among the highest ratings on Newegg, for good reason, its great and its cheap. Not the fastest timings, but I love it. I'm overclocking a 920 at 3.8 with it. At $95 there is no need to get slow ram.

Newegg.com - G.SKILL 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Triple Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Desktop Memory

Darren Burns · March 25th, 2009, 08:55 AM

Thanks Jeff. I have separate OS and Media drives at the moment. After reading that it might improve rendering speed having separate media/render drives I wondered if putting the source media on the OS drive would have the same effect. The more I think about it now I don't know why I let my brain wonder off down that track.

Jeff Harper · March 25th, 2009, 09:09 AM

Well, good luck with your new build! It will be great.

Joe Bowey · March 25th, 2009, 12:51 PM

I am also thinking of building a i7 system. I recently put a new harddrive and memerory into my wifes laptop and reinstalled everything including the OS. I had no problems so I was wondering if I should attempt to build a system myself?

Jeff Harper · March 25th, 2009, 01:17 PM

As the other more experienced people around here will tell you, building your own has advantages, and pitfalls even if you're experienced.

Before building your own look at this page: Intel i7

I cannot recommend the company because I don't know them, but their prices appear to be excellent, and their $995 system appears to be a lot for the money. I would look at them very hard it I were going i7.

Sam Renkin · March 25th, 2009, 02:10 PM

This message is for those of us having problems with (a) Dell XPS Studio 435MT eSATA ports or (b) Vegas Pro 8.1 running on 64-bit Vista, or worse, BOTH ... which is me.

Dell has now replaced my computer, but the new one still does not recognize an HD connected with eSATA. I have returned both my external HD and eSATA cable for replacement, to rule out the possibility that it's the other components - but I fear it's an inherent Dell design problem.

For those having freeze/crash problems with 8.1, I've also experienced this and it's really frustrating. I built a 4 minute SD video from scratch on my i7 using 8.1. Of course, I was using my external HD connected via USB 2.0 instead of eSATA. The file began locking up (not responding) after I'd placed about 30 of the project media clips in the timeline. After that, all efforts to launch the .veg file failed - it would freeze while loading the project media.

Fortunately, I was able to move the source media and .veg file to my other PC (32-bit Vista with Vegas Pro 8.0c) and open it. I re-linked the project media files, and finished the video without problem.

The luster of i7 and Vegas Pro potential is wearing off quickly for me.

Jeff Harper · March 25th, 2009, 03:14 PM

Sam, sorry to hear about your issues, very frustrating.

Vegas 8.1 is not working well for lots of folks (me included). Your problem there is easily solved by abandoning it for now. It works fine for many, but for some it doesn't work at all.

As for your PC it is unfortunate Dell has put out so many of these systems with poor estata controlers or MBs or whatever the issue is.

As I have suggested in the past to others, you can ditch the onboard esata if necessary and use a $50 card that even has built in raid, it is the 1430SA by adaptec. The only catch is it is PCIe so you would need a slot for it.

While you may have been burned on the esata aspect of your PC, unless you find another solution, the only way you might be able to move on would be to go this route. In other words accept that the built in esata on the Dell is worthless and buy a card.

If you have a slot, the good news is this card has built in RAID and TWO connectors. I paid $100 for my card over a year ago, so these cards are really are inexpensive and are a better esata solution anyway since you have raid and dual connectors.

Frankly, from all of the complaints about the estata with the Dells I am sure I would take the bullet and move on.

Alastair has got his going, I believe, so there may be hope. Good luck.

Gary Bettan · March 25th, 2009, 08:42 PM

Videoguys DIY 7 - Intel Core i7 w/ Vista64

New Intel Core i7 processor makes 64 bit computing a reality!

Videoguys Blog - Videoguys' DIY7: Intel Core i7

Gary

Sam Renkin · March 26th, 2009, 09:26 AM

Thanks Jeff and I'm sorry to hear you've had the same issues with 8.1.

Can I install 8.0c on my 64-bit machine?

I can live without eSATA for a while, I've got 2 internal drives going. And I'll definitely look at a PCI-E solution.

Jeff Harper · March 26th, 2009, 10:42 AM

8.0c run fine on 64 bit. Its what I run. My rendering speeds are excellent. You are not losing much by using 32 bit version, don't be bummed about it.

Some get much better speed with 8.1, some get slower, or so I've read.

8.1 is so hit and miss I don't consider it a loss to run 8.0c instead.

Hopefully next release will be more reliable for us.

Nick Krause · March 26th, 2009, 10:59 AM

In response to Jeff's comment about buying from the referenced company. I ordered mine from them yesterday. I researched a lot and since I have never built my own computer, decided to order from them. Will let you know how it goes.

Jeff Harper · March 26th, 2009, 02:12 PM

Nick, a LOT of people will be waiting to hear how it goes! Their prices are insanely low for a pre-built pc with the ASUS MB. They look to be of great quality.

Let us know!

Terry Esslinger · March 30th, 2009, 01:06 PM

An update on my i7 435MT eSATA fiasco.

After all the hours with tech support and failing to correct the problem (eSATA does not recognize external HD) Dell sent me a new mother board and sent a tech to install it. After a couple of hours of work ended up with the same problem. It looks like Dell is putting out a DEFECTIVE product that will not work, of course they will never say that! I will be looking into Jeffs PCIe board work around but my belief in Dell, which had been fairly solid, has been shattered. This is now two blatently defective products that I have purchased from Dell, the other being an LCD TV - a huge mistake.

March 24th, 2009, 06:15 PM	#258
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	If I may recommend: OS drive (media never should be on same drive) Get a Western Digital Velociraptor (they are runing about $150 or so). Its only 150GB but I challenge anyone to fill an OS drive more than 30 -40GB. It doesn't make sense any way shape or form to think you need more than 150GB for a OS drive. Newegg.com - Western Digital VelociRaptor WD1500HLFS 150GB 10000 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive (bare drive) - Internal Hard Drives Media drive: Western Digital Black (no you do not need a separate drive for rendering, though there are those who disagree) I run 10GB of hard drives and would never waste a drive for rendering only. Render to your project file, wherever you put it. Newegg.com - Western Digital Caviar Black WD1001FALS 1TB 7200 RPM 32MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - Internal Hard Drives Backup Drive 1TB same as above Ram could be G.SKILL 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 $95 . This RAM has among the highest ratings on Newegg, for good reason, its great and its cheap. Not the fastest timings, but I love it. I'm overclocking a 920 at 3.8 with it. At $95 there is no need to get slow ram. Newegg.com - G.SKILL 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Triple Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Desktop Memory Last edited by Jeff Harper; March 24th, 2009 at 11:25 PM.

March 25th, 2009, 08:42 PM	#265
Gary Bettan Sponsor: Electronic Mailbox Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Glen Cove, NY Posts: 757	Videoguys DIY 7 - Intel Core i7 w/ Vista64 New Intel Core i7 processor makes 64 bit computing a reality! Videoguys Blog - Videoguys' DIY7: Intel Core i7 Gary __________________ Check out http://www.videoguys.com 800 323-2325 We are the video editing and live video production experts! DV InfoNet members save 5%! Use Coupon Code DVINFO5OFF

March 30th, 2009, 01:06 PM	#270
Terry Esslinger Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Sacramento, Elk Grove. Calif Posts: 306	An update on my i7 435MT eSATA fiasco. After all the hours with tech support and failing to correct the problem (eSATA does not recognize external HD) Dell sent me a new mother board and sent a tech to install it. After a couple of hours of work ended up with the same problem. It looks like Dell is putting out a DEFECTIVE product that will not work, of course they will never say that! I will be looking into Jeffs PCIe board work around but my belief in Dell, which had been fairly solid, has been shattered. This is now two blatently defective products that I have purchased from Dell, the other being an LCD TV - a huge mistake. __________________ Puttin the wet stuff on the red stuff!

March 24th, 2009, 03:38 PM	#256
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	OK, I'm rendering a 1:45 (that's one minute and forty five seconds) clip for Blu Ray (8mbps) with MB effect and it is scheduled to take 52 minutes. Unblievable. And I mean that in a bad way.

March 24th, 2009, 04:47 PM	#257
Darren Burns Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Colorado Springs, CO Posts: 29	I am in the process of putting a proposal together for a new NLE computer and could use some advice as I am pretty much a novice. I work for a non-profit so the budget isn’t bottomless but I have been asked what I need, so strike while the iron is hot. I was looking at the system Gary put together (post #203 March 4th) but think I will have a lot of trouble justifying a $400 video card especially as I am using Vegas Pro 8 which doesn’t utilize GPU. I am only editing SD video and not doing anything too complex/tricky. Most of the videos are about an hour to two hours. I do need to render to PAL occasionally so rendering speed is important. With my current system 25min of SD video took 4 hrs to render from NTSC source to PAL. I was thinking: * Intel i7 920 processor * Asus P6T Deluxe X58 based motherboard * 6GB RAM triple channel * 64 bit OS (XP Pro or Vista????) * ASUS EN9600GT video card * 850w power supply?? * 2x1TB drives – 1xSystem/Media, 1xRender Drive or * 3x500GB drives – 1xSystem, 1xMedia, 1xRender Drive I read on another site about using three drives in the system, as described above. Is there any real benefit to that or is two larger drives adequate? I run a very lean system so space on the system drive really isn’t an issue. Is anything above overkill, future proofing taken into consideration? I am working with donated money after all. Now to potentially open a can of worms… XP Pro 64 bit or Vista 64 bit? Gary didn’t mention what speed RAM he used in their system. If I am looking at overclocking the system do I need 1600MHz or will the 1333MHz be sufficient. With the fact that they are the same price on TigerDirect does it really matter? Will an 850w power supply be ok or should I go smaller/larger? Thanks in advance.

March 25th, 2009, 08:55 AM	#259
Darren Burns Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Colorado Springs, CO Posts: 29	Thanks Jeff. I have separate OS and Media drives at the moment. After reading that it might improve rendering speed having separate media/render drives I wondered if putting the source media on the OS drive would have the same effect. The more I think about it now I don't know why I let my brain wonder off down that track.

March 25th, 2009, 09:09 AM	#260
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Well, good luck with your new build! It will be great.

March 25th, 2009, 12:51 PM	#261
Joe Bowey Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Glendale, AZ Posts: 217	I am also thinking of building a i7 system. I recently put a new harddrive and memerory into my wifes laptop and reinstalled everything including the OS. I had no problems so I was wondering if I should attempt to build a system myself?

March 25th, 2009, 01:17 PM	#262
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	As the other more experienced people around here will tell you, building your own has advantages, and pitfalls even if you're experienced. Before building your own look at this page: Intel i7 I cannot recommend the company because I don't know them, but their prices appear to be excellent, and their $995 system appears to be a lot for the money. I would look at them very hard it I were going i7.

March 25th, 2009, 02:10 PM	#263
Sam Renkin Major Player Join Date: May 2008 Location: Atlanta GA Posts: 211	This message is for those of us having problems with (a) Dell XPS Studio 435MT eSATA ports or (b) Vegas Pro 8.1 running on 64-bit Vista, or worse, BOTH ... which is me. Dell has now replaced my computer, but the new one still does not recognize an HD connected with eSATA. I have returned both my external HD and eSATA cable for replacement, to rule out the possibility that it's the other components - but I fear it's an inherent Dell design problem. For those having freeze/crash problems with 8.1, I've also experienced this and it's really frustrating. I built a 4 minute SD video from scratch on my i7 using 8.1. Of course, I was using my external HD connected via USB 2.0 instead of eSATA. The file began locking up (not responding) after I'd placed about 30 of the project media clips in the timeline. After that, all efforts to launch the .veg file failed - it would freeze while loading the project media. Fortunately, I was able to move the source media and .veg file to my other PC (32-bit Vista with Vegas Pro 8.0c) and open it. I re-linked the project media files, and finished the video without problem. The luster of i7 and Vegas Pro potential is wearing off quickly for me.

March 25th, 2009, 03:14 PM	#264
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Sam, sorry to hear about your issues, very frustrating. Vegas 8.1 is not working well for lots of folks (me included). Your problem there is easily solved by abandoning it for now. It works fine for many, but for some it doesn't work at all. As for your PC it is unfortunate Dell has put out so many of these systems with poor estata controlers or MBs or whatever the issue is. As I have suggested in the past to others, you can ditch the onboard esata if necessary and use a $50 card that even has built in raid, it is the 1430SA by adaptec. The only catch is it is PCIe so you would need a slot for it. While you may have been burned on the esata aspect of your PC, unless you find another solution, the only way you might be able to move on would be to go this route. In other words accept that the built in esata on the Dell is worthless and buy a card. If you have a slot, the good news is this card has built in RAID and TWO connectors. I paid $100 for my card over a year ago, so these cards are really are inexpensive and are a better esata solution anyway since you have raid and dual connectors. Frankly, from all of the complaints about the estata with the Dells I am sure I would take the bullet and move on. Alastair has got his going, I believe, so there may be hope. Good luck.

March 26th, 2009, 09:26 AM	#266
Sam Renkin Major Player Join Date: May 2008 Location: Atlanta GA Posts: 211	Thanks Jeff and I'm sorry to hear you've had the same issues with 8.1. Can I install 8.0c on my 64-bit machine? I can live without eSATA for a while, I've got 2 internal drives going. And I'll definitely look at a PCI-E solution.

March 26th, 2009, 10:42 AM	#267
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	8.0c run fine on 64 bit. Its what I run. My rendering speeds are excellent. You are not losing much by using 32 bit version, don't be bummed about it. Some get much better speed with 8.1, some get slower, or so I've read. 8.1 is so hit and miss I don't consider it a loss to run 8.0c instead. Hopefully next release will be more reliable for us.

March 26th, 2009, 10:59 AM	#268
Nick Krause Tourist Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Sykesville, MD Posts: 4	In response to Jeff's comment about buying from the referenced company. I ordered mine from them yesterday. I researched a lot and since I have never built my own computer, decided to order from them. Will let you know how it goes.

March 26th, 2009, 02:12 PM	#269
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Nick, a LOT of people will be waiting to hear how it goes! Their prices are insanely low for a pre-built pc with the ASUS MB. They look to be of great quality. Let us know!