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What Happens in Vegas...
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Old May 6th, 2009, 12:29 PM   #16
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First thing really is to get precise specifications from the client, as to what is acceptable for delivery (NTSC and/or PAL,codec/container, media, etc.). It might be a REALLY good idea to consult directly with the broadcaster also (especially if the client is not crystal clear on what the broadcaster will accept).

So long as you are delivering digital video, it is simply a sequence of zeros and ones (at the core). Whether it is on tape or disk, the zeros and ones are the same (so long as there are no media errors). Find out what the client (and/or broadcaster) will accept.

The serious issue with video shot at a 16:9 aspect ratio, is how it will be broadcast. I assume it will be broadcast in analog - SD at a 4:3 DAR (display aspect ratio). Assuming that is correct, the question is, do they want to broadcast a letterboxed version, or do they want to broadcast a fullscreen version (requiring pan and scan editing). Make sure you are clear on what they expect in that regard also.

initally they asked me for this (cut pasting it from email i recieved) "(720 x 576 DV PAL AVI / MOV), to ensure good resolution for broadcast."

but now i asked them if i can send video in NTSC to maintain quality and they will get back to me on that , letterboxed version is fine with them so i wont be needing to go pan and scan editing gladfully .. any other pointers?

so tape or DVD souldnt matter quality wise?
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Old May 6th, 2009, 12:40 PM   #17
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Maintaining quality is really a matter of how well the NTSC to PAL conversion is done. I would think the broadcaster can probably do that well (if they are willing). If you do deliver NTSC material, don't letterbox it. That would result in two resizings - downsizing to letterbox in NTSC fullscreen format, and then another to upsize the image to fit a PAL screen (which will soften the image). Let them do it as a single resizing (downsizing) and the result should be a sharp image.
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Old May 6th, 2009, 12:43 PM   #18
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Maintaining quality is really a matter of how well the NTSC to PAL conversion is done. I would think the broadcaster can probably do that well (if they are willing). If you do deliver NTSC material, don't letterbox it. That would result in two resizings - downsizing to letterbox in NTSC fullscreen format, and then another to upsize the image to fit a PAL screen (which will soften the image). Let them do it as a single resizing (downsizing) and the result should be a sharp image.

I am hoping they let me deliver NTSC ... so that means i should check the Stretch video to fill output frame size (do not letter box) option when rendernig correct?
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Old May 6th, 2009, 12:52 PM   #19
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If you are delivering an AVI, using DV as the codec, I don't think it really matters what aspect ratio you specify in the project settings. I don't think the DAR information is stored in the stream. If the person doing the NTSC to PAL conversion is competent, it won't really matter anyway. The number of pixels you deliver, and their color, will be exactly the same. DAR simply determines whether the image is stretched or compressed horizontally, upon display.

To answer your other question about DVD disk or tape. It doesn't matter which one (quality wise), if you are delivering digital video. Personally, I'd prefer delivering a file on a DVD disk (it's easier).
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Old May 6th, 2009, 12:56 PM   #20
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If you are delivering an AVI, using DV as the codec, I don't think it really matters what aspect ratio you specify in the project settings. I don't think the DAR information is stored in the stream. If the person doing the NTSC to PAL conversion is competent, it won't really matter anyway. The number of pixels you deliver, and their color, will be exactly the same. DAR simply determines whether the image is stretched or compressed horizontally, upon display.

To answer your other question about DVD disk or tape. It doesn't matter which one (quality wise), if you are delivering digital video. Personally, I'd prefer delivering a file on a DVD disk (it's easier).
Yes i think delivering on DVDs is easier as well! ... one thing i noticed if my project settings in DV NTSC and i render with DV NTSC windscreen my letterbox windows on 4:3 Tvs becomes even smalls (i mean the viewable part gets smalls ...smalls box) ... is this cause my project is not windscreen and rendiing is ?
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Old May 6th, 2009, 01:08 PM   #21
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Yes i think delivering on DVDs is easier as well! ... one thing i noticed if my project settings in DV NTSC and i render with DV NTSC windscreen my letterbox windows on 4:3 Tvs becomes even smalls (i mean the viewable part gets smalls ...smalls box) ... is this cause my project is not windscreen and rendiing is ?
I'm not sure exactly what you are saying. You are rendering 720x480 pixel frames. How that gets displayed on a television depends on what DAR is specified in the file (if at all) and then how the player sends out the signal and how the television interprets the signal.
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Old May 6th, 2009, 01:13 PM   #22
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I'm not sure exactly what you are saying. You are rendering 720x480 pixel frames. How that gets displayed on a television depends on what DAR is specified in the file (if at all) and then how the player sends out the signal and how the television interprets the signal.
IF i render DV NTSC Widescreen and play back the box appears smaller on 4:3 display (area where video is being displayed), and black area on top and bottom gets bigger covering more are.

but if i reneder DV NTSC(no widescreen) the letter box appers fine .

what am i doing wrong?
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Old May 6th, 2009, 01:24 PM   #23
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I'm not sure exactly what you are doing. Are you talking about rendering an MPEG-2 file, and then creating a DVD from it, and then popping that into a DVD player and watching on a standard definition, analog television?
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Old May 6th, 2009, 01:47 PM   #24
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I'm not sure exactly what you are doing. Are you talking about rendering an MPEG-2 file, and then creating a DVD from it, and then popping that into a DVD player and watching on a standard definition, analog television?

ok this is what i am doing

shot footage in 16:9 , 30 p with Canon XL2

project in vegas which is NTSC DV

renderding .AVI , NTSC DV widescreen.

when i watch video the black part of the letter box takes most of the screen .

if i reneder .AVI NTSC DV the video looks fine , meaning letterbox black area looks normal.

playing it any where windows media player, or draving the rendered video on timeline and displaying on 2nd monitor .. same output ...
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Old May 6th, 2009, 02:04 PM   #25
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It's been a long time since I used Vegas. Without reinstalling Vegas or asking more questions, I can't be 100% sure, precisely what the project and rendering settings might be doing (or not doing) with the aspect ratio and letterboxing, and I've got to get ready to get out the door here. Somebody who is currently using Vegas specifically, might be able to help you with figuring out what is happening with this better.
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Old May 6th, 2009, 02:25 PM   #26
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i want to make sure when i render and watch footage in widescreen there is no box and when played on a 4:3 display it should letterbox ...

my footage is in 16:9 how can i make sure this happens?

in the "render as" 4th box at the bottom should be CHECKED? right
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