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Old November 12th, 2004, 02:24 PM   #1
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Why Would Final Cut Pro Be Better?

I know this is a loaded question, and a familiar one--plus, I'm very happily a Vegas 5 user. But there's such a plethora of raves and support from the FCP crowd about their platform and software that I'm wondering what hard differences there are between Vegas 5 and FCP that give one or the other the advantage. Any users here who deal with both?
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Old November 12th, 2004, 02:54 PM   #2
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In general

I am answering this question as someone who is invested in using Vegas, trying hard to to see the advantages of using FCP.

In general any software running on controlled hardware produced by the same company on an rock-solid operating system based on UNIX (BSD) (co)developed by the same company will potentially run smoother than software produced to fit countless variations of hardware running a less-than-perfect OS.

Apart from that, Apple has an interesting offering in Motion (for Motion Graphics) which is, yes, an external ($300) package but integrates very well in the FCP interface/workflow.

Another advantage is that FCP is widely used in the video industry - I have a friend who cuts a regular TV show on FCP here in LA and he is not alone.

Personally, when asked me whether I use FCP, I reply that I use Vegas Video which is its equivalent on the PC.

I wouldn't move to FCP unless a project requires it and in my case such a move would have the disadvantages of retraining.

I find Vegas to be fast, flexible, full-featured, rock-solid and intuitive - an ideal tool for real-world editing tasks which require a job done well, yesterday.

So here you are.

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-- Andre
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Old November 12th, 2004, 03:49 PM   #3
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One works on a PC - the other works on a Mac. If I had a Mac, I'm sure I'd be running FCP. Since I'm using a PC, I'm using what I think is best - Vegas.

Bottom line - they both edit video very well. Most think Vegas has the faster workflow.
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Old November 12th, 2004, 03:54 PM   #4
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Actually, that's my take also--Vegas is easily the FCP counterpart on the PC. If I wasn't using Vegas, I would most likely be more vulnerable to switching platforms.

Interesting to see what Vegas will continue to offer.

:D
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Old November 12th, 2004, 04:28 PM   #5
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One of the reasons people choose FCP or Avid is market penetration. More indy shops run FCP than Vegas, so more chance of working if you know that platform. More industry shops run Avid than anything else, more chance of working there if you know that platform.

Of course, more chance of working ANYWHERE if you are fluent on all platforms.
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Old November 12th, 2004, 05:00 PM   #6
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Hardware Support is extensive in the MAC/FCP Scheme. There are many options of supported capture cards and devices from AJA, Decklink, Atto and others that allow for a total integration of machine control and performance excelleration.

I own and use both Vegas and FCP. If working solely in DV - it's Vegas. Betacam - FCP.

So, my advice is that if you do not have a hardware related reason to migrate to FCP - stay with Vegas.

Drivers for Decklink cards will be available for Vegas, soon.

Jay Mitchell
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Old November 12th, 2004, 06:05 PM   #7
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I think Jay is correct.

I've listened to good advice - first analyze your needs, then look for the software that fills that need, then buy the hardware that runs that software.

I have a friend that recently spent about $10K on a couple of G5's, FCP and some of the gorgeous Apple displays. For his end market, he doesn't do anything I can't do in Vegas (for a total outlay of less than $5K).

Run win 2000 of XP Pro on a good machine and stability will not be a factor.
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Old December 22nd, 2004, 12:00 PM   #8
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Is there any update info about Decklink and Vegas. We've been hearing 'real soon now' for quite awhile. I'm not being sarcastic, nor am I upset, just wondering.
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Old December 22nd, 2004, 01:33 PM   #9
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Ironicly enough I got in an argument *ehhh-hemmm* "discussion", with a fellow member of my videographer's associtation last night. The topic was Mac vs PC in regards to price. He cliamed a comparable PC will be just as much as a Mac, which I know is incorrect. Needless to say he dug his own hole slipping and saying "there's a reason why we pay more". I knew that Mac elitist attitude couldn't be contained.

I don't think one is "better" than the other- however it IS true most Mac people think their platform is superior. The best way to make them eat their words is simply ask them "Why?". Sit back with some pop-corn and enjoy the show, while they proceed to grasp straws. lol
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Old December 22nd, 2004, 02:44 PM   #10
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I have both platforms but prefer my Mac. Yes you can build "A" PC for less money but I haven't found many (or any) really comparable (all the same specs and equipment) PC's for less than a Mac. I know Windows users always "claim" they can but it's usually someone who builds their own and shops for the rock bottom price from all over the internet (did you figure in your labor to find everything and assemble it as well?). I'd rather not fuss with it. It's like Andre said, they (Apple) make the hardware AND the software so it has a better chance of being stable right out of the box. That's what I'm interested in, otherwise I could care less who makes it as long as it works.
It does also have a bit to do with the industry as well, there are a lot of FCP boxes out there in production environments.

The bottom line though is, if it works for you, use it!

-as for the grasping at straws comment, I don't particularly care if if a Windoze user doesn't see my point of view, I know better and would just as well leave them in the dark trying to figure out how to patch their latest virus!
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Old December 22nd, 2004, 03:04 PM   #11
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-as for the grasping at straws comment, I don't particularly care if if a Windoze user doesn't see my point of view, I know better and would just as well leave them in the dark trying to figure out how to patch their latest virus!

See- told you guys...lol Break out the pop-corn!
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Old December 22nd, 2004, 11:04 PM   #12
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Here's my two cents:

A- They haven't used Vegas, or don't know how to use it. If you start out cutting on Final Cut, Vegas makes no sense at all. To me, Premiere Pro is more like the PC version of Final Cut. Premiere Pro and FCP are very similar... and Vegas is different.

Final Cut also has greater momentum going for it (bigger user base), and better advertising. Apple has a good user base because it came out with a solid non-linear editing (more stable than Premiere) that was significantly cheaper than other products on the market (i.e. Avid).

B- Final Cut handles formats Vegas can't do easily: DVCPRO50, DVCPRO HD, other HD, film/35mm, uncompressed.

For DV cutters, this obviously doesn't apply.

C- OMF export (for audio editing in your program of choice), and Avid compatibility via Automatic Duck.

If your audio post guy has Vegas then there's no reason to export OMF and there's advantages to staying within Vegas.

Avid compatibility is neat, but you can stay within Vegas as Vegas has great color correction and compositing (if you know how to use it).

D- Mac VS PC things:
Mac is supposedly more stable. In my experience, Final Cut unpatched is really crashy and Vegas rock solid in comparison.

On Macs, you don't have to worry about viruses or spyware (spyware is just a big a problem as viruses, except most people don't know about it and let spyware infect their computers and slow it down and make it unstable)

Macs are arguably easier to use. In my *opinion*, this is true.

E- Better workflow.
Final Cut has better media management.

You may also really prefer the Final Cut workflow for cutting. I personally really like the way Final Cut handles snapping. When you're moving a clip around, it snaps to the edges of clips on other tracks. Vegas doesn't do this.

Final Cut may take less button pushing for you.

It also has nicer scrubbing tools. Scrubs are much smoother and let you quickly skim through footage.


That's what I could figure out.
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Old December 23rd, 2004, 08:35 AM   #13
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As I always say- FCP, PPro, Vegas- it doesn't matter. What DOES matter is what you DO with these tools!

Sure each of them have their strong points and weaknesses but in regards to the highest majority of what's relevant to most users- ie Standard DV. They are on par. Sure FCP might be able to work with more formats- but then you can turn and say Vegas has better audio tools.

I never claimed one was better than the other- I just claimed that one was NOT better than the other. Some Mac users have an issue with that.
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Old December 23rd, 2004, 11:02 AM   #14
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Couple of points:

"Vegas is easily the FCP ",

I don't know how you can say that because they are totally different programs. Premiere Pro 1.5 is closer to Final Cut and in fact Premiere programmers were used to write FCP. Vegas re-invents the wheel.

"As I always say- FCP, PPro, Vegas- it doesn't matter. What DOES matter is what you DO with these tools!"

Sorry but it does matter! It only matters if you're editing in your basement for your own stuff and don't have clients.

The editing program used, matters in the minds of your clients, it matters in your workflow and the need to port editing lists and data from one enviroment to another. It matters if one program has strong media management and the other doesn't, or if one has a features you depend on for your work and another doesn't. Example, if you're video project needs extensive audio post, Vegas is the clear winner. here.

In my personal opinion though,

I think that Final Cut is better than Vegas, however, it's not that much better. Final Cut has to be the most overhyped program to come out ever!!!!




MB
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Old December 23rd, 2004, 12:11 PM   #15
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<< Premiere Pro 1.5 is closer to Final Cut and in fact Premiere programmers were used to write FCP. >>

I don't know if that's a good thing though.

<<"As I always say- FCP, PPro, Vegas- it doesn't matter. What DOES matter is what you DO with these tools!" Sorry but it does matter! It only matters if you're editing in your basement for your own stuff and don't have clients. >>

In my neck of the world content rules. If your jobs are partially dictated on the faux bragging-rights of a FCP editing system then more power to you. I've been shooting and editing video professionally for about 3 years now, and I SEVERELY disagree that "it only matters if your editing in your basement for your own stuff and don't have clients"- bit. That's one heck of a broad statement Moe.


<< In my personal opinion though, I think that Final Cut is better than Vegas, however, it's not that much better. Final Cut has to be the most overhyped program to come out ever!!!! >>

You said it- key word being "opinion".

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