Vegas Video discussions from 2005 (Q3Q4)

Colby Knight · November 16th, 2005, 12:53 PM

A good friend of mine is interested in the Dell laptop, Inspiron 6000.... 512MB of RAM... 60GB hard drive... 1.6GHz. His plan is to do some editing with Vegas here and there... nothing big or fancy. He's ordering it straight from Dell, so he can add on or change what he needs.

I'm too ignorant to tell him exactly what he needs and he doesn't want to shell out 1200 bucks for a laptop that won't support the software. Vegas users... chime in. What would make it work well?

Edward Troxel · November 16th, 2005, 01:00 PM

It will do the "whole thing" - just in 10 second increments (12 seconds for PAL users). More precisely, most pre-render files will be 300 frames. You'll notice it does the same thing on a print to tape. For example, if you have a 15 second title, it will render 10 seconds in one file and 5 seconds in another file.

If you want to do the whole section as ONE file, you might try the "Render to New Track" option. Be aware that you'll have to watch out on the audio, though, or you might end up with DOUBLE.

Bill Grant · November 16th, 2005, 01:09 PM

The Curves option really did the trick. I was hoping I would find something.

bill

Don Bloom · November 16th, 2005, 02:00 PM

I have an old Dell that is a P3 600mhz with 128m of RAM and a 10gig system drive. I've used an 80gig FWHDD for capture and working the project(s) and for rendering and Vegas worked just fine. A bit slow (to say the least) but I was able to do everything I needed to on road trips with that setup, so anything faster and with more RAM will be OK

Don

Peter Sieben · November 16th, 2005, 04:27 PM

There is something I want to add to this matter.

25P progressive video (PAL) is nothing more than 25 frames per second, each consisting of 2 interlaced fields. Both interlaced fields have the SAME sampled image from the ccd's used as a source, this image is 1 moment in time. One of the two fields shows the even lines of this image, the other fields the other lines. That's why progressive video can be recorded on VHS tapes, mini-dv tapes (DVX100, XL2) and normal dvd's. During playback on normal tv your eyes notices a different cadans compared to non-progressive video (that uses 50 different images in time per second, where progressive uses 25). It both plays as interlaced video, but it's source is different. Just like a normal feature film played back on tv from cable, VHS or dvd.

Creating progressive video from 'interlaced'= normal video in Vegas is tricky. Because the software somehow has to go back to 25 images per second, where the source is originally 50. And combining 2 fields gives problems with movements, so it somehow has to interpolate the combined image and filling all lines with texture. And then this new image has to be written back to 2 fields, with the even and odd lines in the one or another.
This interpolation gives the troubles you see. Not the fact that you do a playback on an interlaced tv.

I do have a progressive scan playback from my dvd to a progressive scan Loewe tv, using component cables. This gives great results with my progressive video of the DVX100, editing as progressive video in Vegas and rendered to a progressive video dvd with DVD-A. But the same video/dvd also plays back greatly on a normal interlaced CRT tv. The progressive mode unleashes a quality I had never seen before with my camera and MPEG2 rendering.

Working with progressive video has the same aspects as with a real film camera. Fast movements gives motion problems (stroboscope), so you have to do slow pannings, or you have to follow a subject moving through the environment (like actors entering a building and walking to the stairs or something). The eye of the viewer is trained to look at the subject and does not register the motion problems in the background.

Peter Sieben · November 16th, 2005, 05:08 PM

Hi everybody,

I just finished a short film, edited with Vegas 6 and created a dvd with DVDA3. In DVDA I added two different subtitle tracks, that can be chosen from the menu by the viewer. I imported the subtitles each from a txt file a translater gave me and it was just a matter of syncing them on the timeline with the video, which was a lot of work but DVDA is fairly handy with it. All is fine now.

I want to share a internetcopy of our movie on the internet (MOV or WMV format), but I want to add the English subtitles from DVDA to it. Is there any way that I can insert them into the Vegas file, using the export subtitles option in DVDA3? So far no luck. I don't want to spend another evening syncing all the dialog lines to the actual audio again....

Thanks for any help or suggestion!

Steve Crisdale · November 16th, 2005, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colby Knight

A good friend of mine is interested in the Dell laptop, Inspiron 6000.... 512MB of RAM... 60GB hard drive... 1.6GHz. His plan is to do some editing with Vegas here and there... nothing big or fancy. He's ordering it straight from Dell, so he can add on or change what he needs.

I'm too ignorant to tell him exactly what he needs and he doesn't want to shell out 1200 bucks for a laptop that won't support the software. Vegas users... chime in. What would make it work well?

Ah... We are dealing with HD/HDV and Vegas here.

If you are indeed wondering if your good friend will be able to work with HDV on such a laptop... he'll be wanting to throw it through the nearest window after a few sessions of working with HDV stuff, unless he has the patience of a Saint that is!!

If you know he's using DV... then maybe it'll do just fine, no doubt slower than the new laptops that are now out and about, but useable.

If your friend is using HDV, then he might need to consider a 16:9 screened P-IV of at least 2.8Ghz with a 7,200rpm Hard Disk 80Gig minimum.

Bottom line: HDV needs more grunt, DV he can take a punt...

Douglas Spotted Eagle · November 16th, 2005, 06:44 PM

Steve is correct in that faster/bigger is better, but at the same time, a DV Proxy or CineForm intermediary in the newest/latest versions will edit HDV very nicely on a 3.4 system or faster. Faster drives are definitely helpful

Gary Kleiner · November 16th, 2005, 07:48 PM

Just to clarify a bit -

The 'selectively' part of 'selectively pre-render' means that it is on;y going to render the parts that need rendering, not any unchanged parts of the DV avi file.

So, for example, if you have two video events that you do not apply filters to or otherwise change, that are overlapped for a one-second transition, the selective pre-render will only render the transition.

Gary

Colby Knight · November 16th, 2005, 07:49 PM

I'd wager the rent money that no HD is involved, just straight DV. I didn't see that I posted this in the HD section until it was too late. D'oh!

Thanks for the responses... I'll pass them along!

Glenn Chan · November 16th, 2005, 07:56 PM

I've seen Vegas work with that version of the Tascam unit. Very neat.

The faders adjust the volume on each audio track. The buttons can mute the track or arm it to record. Feedback seems to be instantaneous.

Laurence Kingston · November 16th, 2005, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colby Knight

A good friend of mine is interested in the Dell laptop, Inspiron 6000.... 512MB of RAM... 60GB hard drive... 1.6GHz. His plan is to do some editing with Vegas here and there... nothing big or fancy. He's ordering it straight from Dell, so he can add on or change what he needs.

I'm too ignorant to tell him exactly what he needs and he doesn't want to shell out 1200 bucks for a laptop that won't support the software. Vegas users... chime in. What would make it work well?

I'm guessing that this is a Centrino (Pentium M processor) system, in which case the 1.6 processor speed as efficient as a Pentium 4 3.2 GHz system so processor speed wise he's probably going to be fine.

Lance Spratt · November 16th, 2005, 10:55 PM

Thanks for your reply Glenn! I am curious how it can be configured to be used for other (video) edit functions.

DSE, have you had any experience with this unit to compare to the Mackie control surface?

Thanks again!

Lance

Douglas Spotted Eagle · November 16th, 2005, 11:30 PM

Lance, I've seen it work, and played with it a bit....no real difference. I mean, a control surface is a control surface...it just depends on what look, feel, and features you want. The Tascam is a great tool, no doubt. I happen to prefer the Mackies, but then again, they gave me a great price on several seconds/Bstock, and so we have 4 of the Mackies.

Don Donatello · November 17th, 2005, 12:09 AM

i have a averatec 4265 with a m1.6 that i use on the road.
it works good with V6 on SD .. HDV ?? not so good ..for HDV i switch to HP AMD 3700 laptop ...

from my experience a M 1.6 doesn't come close to a PIV 3.2 when editing video or using combustion .. it might be as fast using word or other software that doesn't require alot of CPU power but M's just can't handle massive CPU consumption

November 16th, 2005, 12:53 PM	#1111
Colby Knight Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Huntsville, Alabama Posts: 111	Laptop Question A good friend of mine is interested in the Dell laptop, Inspiron 6000.... 512MB of RAM... 60GB hard drive... 1.6GHz. His plan is to do some editing with Vegas here and there... nothing big or fancy. He's ordering it straight from Dell, so he can add on or change what he needs. I'm too ignorant to tell him exactly what he needs and he doesn't want to shell out 1200 bucks for a laptop that won't support the software. Vegas users... chime in. What would make it work well?

November 16th, 2005, 01:00 PM	#1112
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	It will do the "whole thing" - just in 10 second increments (12 seconds for PAL users). More precisely, most pre-render files will be 300 frames. You'll notice it does the same thing on a print to tape. For example, if you have a 15 second title, it will render 10 seconds in one file and 5 seconds in another file. If you want to do the whole section as ONE file, you might try the "Render to New Track" option. Be aware that you'll have to watch out on the audio, though, or you might end up with DOUBLE. __________________ Edward Troxel [SCVU] JETDV Scripts/Scripting Tutorials/Excalibur/Montage Magic/Newsletters

November 16th, 2005, 01:09 PM	#1113
Bill Grant Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Columbia,SC Posts: 806	Got it The Curves option really did the trick. I was hoping I would find something. bill

November 16th, 2005, 04:27 PM	#1115
Peter Sieben Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 345	There is something I want to add to this matter. 25P progressive video (PAL) is nothing more than 25 frames per second, each consisting of 2 interlaced fields. Both interlaced fields have the SAME sampled image from the ccd's used as a source, this image is 1 moment in time. One of the two fields shows the even lines of this image, the other fields the other lines. That's why progressive video can be recorded on VHS tapes, mini-dv tapes (DVX100, XL2) and normal dvd's. During playback on normal tv your eyes notices a different cadans compared to non-progressive video (that uses 50 different images in time per second, where progressive uses 25). It both plays as interlaced video, but it's source is different. Just like a normal feature film played back on tv from cable, VHS or dvd. Creating progressive video from 'interlaced'= normal video in Vegas is tricky. Because the software somehow has to go back to 25 images per second, where the source is originally 50. And combining 2 fields gives problems with movements, so it somehow has to interpolate the combined image and filling all lines with texture. And then this new image has to be written back to 2 fields, with the even and odd lines in the one or another. This interpolation gives the troubles you see. Not the fact that you do a playback on an interlaced tv. I do have a progressive scan playback from my dvd to a progressive scan Loewe tv, using component cables. This gives great results with my progressive video of the DVX100, editing as progressive video in Vegas and rendered to a progressive video dvd with DVD-A. But the same video/dvd also plays back greatly on a normal interlaced CRT tv. The progressive mode unleashes a quality I had never seen before with my camera and MPEG2 rendering. Working with progressive video has the same aspects as with a real film camera. Fast movements gives motion problems (stroboscope), so you have to do slow pannings, or you have to follow a subject moving through the environment (like actors entering a building and walking to the stairs or something). The eye of the viewer is trained to look at the subject and does not register the motion problems in the background. __________________ Peter / Orphic Film www.orphicfilm.nl and www.myspace.com/orphicfilm

November 16th, 2005, 05:08 PM	#1116
Peter Sieben Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 345	Export DVDA subtitles to Vegas? Hi everybody, I just finished a short film, edited with Vegas 6 and created a dvd with DVDA3. In DVDA I added two different subtitle tracks, that can be chosen from the menu by the viewer. I imported the subtitles each from a txt file a translater gave me and it was just a matter of syncing them on the timeline with the video, which was a lot of work but DVDA is fairly handy with it. All is fine now. I want to share a internetcopy of our movie on the internet (MOV or WMV format), but I want to add the English subtitles from DVDA to it. Is there any way that I can insert them into the Vegas file, using the export subtitles option in DVDA3? So far no luck. I don't want to spend another evening syncing all the dialog lines to the actual audio again.... Thanks for any help or suggestion! __________________ Peter / Orphic Film www.orphicfilm.nl and www.myspace.com/orphicfilm

November 16th, 2005, 02:00 PM	#1114
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	I have an old Dell that is a P3 600mhz with 128m of RAM and a 10gig system drive. I've used an 80gig FWHDD for capture and working the project(s) and for rendering and Vegas worked just fine. A bit slow (to say the least) but I was able to do everything I needed to on road trips with that setup, so anything faster and with more RAM will be OK Don

November 16th, 2005, 06:44 PM	#1118
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	Steve is correct in that faster/bigger is better, but at the same time, a DV Proxy or CineForm intermediary in the newest/latest versions will edit HDV very nicely on a 3.4 system or faster. Faster drives are definitely helpful __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

November 16th, 2005, 07:48 PM	#1119
Gary Kleiner Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Fort Collins, Colorado Posts: 166	Just to clarify a bit - The 'selectively' part of 'selectively pre-render' means that it is on;y going to render the parts that need rendering, not any unchanged parts of the DV avi file. So, for example, if you have two video events that you do not apply filters to or otherwise change, that are overlapped for a one-second transition, the selective pre-render will only render the transition. Gary

November 16th, 2005, 07:49 PM	#1120
Colby Knight Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Huntsville, Alabama Posts: 111	I'd wager the rent money that no HD is involved, just straight DV. I didn't see that I posted this in the HD section until it was too late. D'oh! Thanks for the responses... I'll pass them along!

November 16th, 2005, 07:56 PM	#1121
Glenn Chan Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 4,750	I've seen Vegas work with that version of the Tascam unit. Very neat. The faders adjust the volume on each audio track. The buttons can mute the track or arm it to record. Feedback seems to be instantaneous.

November 16th, 2005, 10:55 PM	#1123
Lance Spratt Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Devon, Alberta, Canada Posts: 47	Thanks for your reply Glenn! I am curious how it can be configured to be used for other (video) edit functions. DSE, have you had any experience with this unit to compare to the Mackie control surface? Thanks again! Lance __________________ Lance Spratt

November 16th, 2005, 11:30 PM	#1124
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	Lance, I've seen it work, and played with it a bit....no real difference. I mean, a control surface is a control surface...it just depends on what look, feel, and features you want. The Tascam is a great tool, no doubt. I happen to prefer the Mackies, but then again, they gave me a great price on several seconds/Bstock, and so we have 4 of the Mackies. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

November 17th, 2005, 12:09 AM	#1125
Don Donatello Hawaiian Shirt Mogul Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: northern cailfornia Posts: 1,261	i have a averatec 4265 with a m1.6 that i use on the road. it works good with V6 on SD .. HDV ?? not so good ..for HDV i switch to HP AMD 3700 laptop ... from my experience a M 1.6 doesn't come close to a PIV 3.2 when editing video or using combustion .. it might be as fast using word or other software that doesn't require alot of CPU power but M's just can't handle massive CPU consumption