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Old April 14th, 2010, 03:08 PM   #1
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Why does 32-bit produce awful harsh contrast?

Am I doing something wrong? I edit in 8-bit (Cinfeform Neo mostly and some PNGs) then, as I've read hear, switch to 32-bit for render. But when I do, many of the clips look very hard and contrasty. Should I have a pplied a filter first? Wrong 32-bit version (though I've tried both)?
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Old April 14th, 2010, 04:17 PM   #2
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Have you tried changing the compositing gamma in Vegas project properties to video levels (2.222)? If it's set to 1.000 it will get "contrasty".
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Old April 14th, 2010, 07:00 PM   #3
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Paul,

I have the same problem with Cineform, that is why I use Canopus HQ. The quality, the sharpness and the color I think is much better than Cineform.

Try it.


Matthew
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Old April 14th, 2010, 08:56 PM   #4
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Thanks guys. I'm so confused about this Color Space stuff. I'd appreciate any help in confirming, or refuting my beliefs.

I thought that all TV now show 0-100 IRE, is that correct? So, can my video go from 0-100?
When do I use the RGB scale of 0-255 if I'm working with video?
What does 2.22 and 1.00 mean as it relates to color space, and for that matter, what is color space?

Thanks
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Old April 14th, 2010, 10:24 PM   #5
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Paul,

I still use video levels (16-235) for HD video editing which will end up on DVD. I set my Vegas scope preferences to studio RGB and then set blacks to 0IRE and whites to 100IRE. If I need to put it on the web I use the Vegas CC with the setting (video levels to computer levels) on the web version. If I'm editing only for the web I uncheck studio RGB on my scope preferences since for the web video should be at 0=black and 255=white. You will notice on your waveform that your raw footage from HD cameras still uses video levels (16=black and 235=white). I also use Cineform by the way. Not sure how this all translates to Blu-Ray since I don't use it yet but using this system gets me consistent results.

If I was to use 32bit mode I would set it to video gamma (2.222) for a DVD project and I guess 1.000 for a web project and it should match up ok unless Cineform is not working right with Vegas. You might have to play with your color settings in the Cineform codec options. For the record I never use 32bit however because Vegas always crashes on me if I try.

Marc
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Old April 14th, 2010, 10:46 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Salvatore View Post
Paul,

I still use video levels (16-235) for HD video editing which will end up on DVD. I set my Vegas scope preferences to studio RGB and then set blacks to 0IRE and whites to 100IRE. If I need to put it on the web I use the Vegas CC with the setting (video levels to computer levels) on the web version. If I'm editing only for the web I uncheck studio RGB on my scope preferences since for the web video should be at 0=black and 255=white. You will notice on your waveform that your raw footage from HD cameras still uses video levels (16=black and 235=white). I also use Cineform by the way. Not sure how this all translates to Blu-Ray since I don't use it yet but using this system gets me consistent results.

If I was to use 32bit mode I would set it to video gamma (2.222) for a DVD project and I guess 1.000 for a web project and it should match up ok unless Cineform is not working right with Vegas. You might have to play with your color settings in the Cineform codec options. For the record I never use 32bit however because Vegas always crashes on me if I try.

Marc
I generally work just the opposite. I am in 32bit mode all the time and 1.000 gamma. Doing so, my computer based preview is showing me exactly what I will get when I render to AVC/Mpeg4 for the web, or WMV. When I get ready to go to DVD, I add the cRGB to sRGB filter, and change my project to 2.222 gamma and I'm done.

The problem with Cineform, is that it converts EVERYTHING to sRGB. Even if you don't want it to. This is not defeatable. Therefore, if you are trying to deliver to the internet, it is doing the exact opposite of what you want it to do.

Also note that working in 1.000 composting gamma affects how several filters and effects work. It changes the behavior of cross-fades and some other things so they behave more like film. I prefer that since I am often trying to replicate film effects, so I just stay in that mode.

I suspect most people are delivering video to the web FAR more often than to broadcast or DVD. And for that work, staying in 1.000 gamma and working in 32bit mode makes excellent sense. Working in 8-bit mode is faster, but truncates so much, and destroys the richness of colors. I only do my cutting in that mode then switch to 32bit mode immediately.
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