CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Windows / PC Post Production Solutions > What Happens in Vegas...

What Happens in Vegas...
...stays in Vegas! This PC-based editing app is a safe bet with these tips.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old November 3rd, 2013, 09:50 PM   #1
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 8,222
CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

Hi Guys

When using the Colour Corrector for exposure control (like a clip that has a bit of backlighting and the subject faces are a little under-exposed) is there a preferred sequence when setting the Gamma/Gain and Offset sliders???

Anyone have an answer? Do you set Gamma first, then adjust Gain and Offset or what is the best way to get the most out of the image?

Chris
Chris Harding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2013, 11:19 PM   #2
Major Player
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Riga, Latvija, EU
Posts: 280
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

The best way is to monitor the process in the Videoscopes, in particular in Waveform monitor. Furthermore, I most often use Color curves instead of CC for similar activities.
Juris Lielpeteris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 4th, 2013, 01:41 AM   #3
Trustee
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: upper hunter, australia
Posts: 1,368
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

clc - curves > levels > colour
__________________
www.lesliewand.com.au
Leslie Wand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 4th, 2013, 03:22 AM   #4
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Woking, England
Posts: 113
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

+1

Richard
Richard Jones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 4th, 2013, 05:22 AM   #5
Old Boot
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London UK
Posts: 3,528
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

Simple, as you wish to raise the Shadows use CCurves and work those Graph Points. Using levels or anything that will have a global effect on your footage, will adjust boost everything!

I've stopped using 2ndColour Corrector about 5 years ago. There are other 3rd party plugs that are admirable. I now use GenArts ColorFast as my GoTo for lifting. It has the ability to shape the mask; keep skin tones safe or/and work with 3 levels of masking - Highlights and/or Midtones and/or Shadows to bring out the best in my exposure-challenged footage.

Colour corrections & grading is a passion with me.

Grazie
Graham Bernard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 4th, 2013, 05:44 AM   #6
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 8,222
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

Thanks Guys

It only happens on very rare occasions when I'm fighting fierce backlighting and as already mentioned, levels simply boosts everything which doesn't really help lift stuff in the shade.

OK, with my simple mind and totally ignoring the colour wheels I can lift Gamma to get the level I want BUT I can also lift gain and get the same result and tweak either with offset. Vegas help doesn't tell you what effect each slider has on the image so if I have an image with a really blown out background but the faces of the subjects in the deep shade are still a little under-exposed, what is the best way to lift the underexposed part of the image ? This weekend my camera was already running at an EV of 2 stops over but the background was really really a killer so the faces in the shot are a bit crappy.

Thanks for all the suggestions ..the correct way to fix the problem (as minor as it is) would have been to crank the iris even more than two stops and let the background just totally blow out!!

Chris
Chris Harding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 4th, 2013, 07:09 AM   #7
Old Boot
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London UK
Posts: 3,528
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Harding View Post
Thanks for all the suggestions ..the correct way to fix the problem (as minor as it is) would have been to crank the iris even more than two stops and let the background just totally blow out!!
Well, yes. I've learnt to try and seek and eek out that sweet-spot of illumination versus blow-out. But that's our job - yeah? But sometimes, depending on the situ, you have to take your pragmatic view.

As a nod to working with what's there, I also use a matt box a rotated ND Grad filter. I can also use a reflector to illuminate the subject.

Grazie
Graham Bernard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 4th, 2013, 08:35 AM   #8
Sponsor: JET DV
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Southern Illinois
Posts: 7,873
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

You might also want to take a look at the ColorFast plugin from NewBlue. It will let you control the darks, mids and highlights separately.
__________________
Edward Troxel [SCVU]
JETDV Scripts/Excalibur/Newsletters
Edward Troxel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 4th, 2013, 10:53 AM   #9
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 3,259
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Harding View Post
...so if I have an image with a really blown out background but the faces of the subjects in the deep shade are still a little under-exposed, what is the best way to lift the underexposed part of the image ?...
As mentioned above, color curves would typically be a first filter in this. Make sure you're modifying RGB (default), then add some points and draw the bottom of an S in the lower left area of the graph.

Waveform monitor will help inform you as to exactly what is going on with the various filter controls you're working with.
__________________
30 years of pro media production. Vegas user since 1.0. Webcaster since 1997. Freelancer since 2000. College instructor since 2001.
Seth Bloombaum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 5th, 2013, 08:05 AM   #10
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 8,222
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

Thanks guys

I have this footage as best as I can get it but it is a pain when you get heavy back lighting in the background.

I see that Grazie uses reflectors to illuminate the subject..sheesh I never thought of that ! Is it effective without reflecting too much of the light behind the subject onto the front.

Peter Rush on the wedding forum has the same problem on an upcoming shoot with large bright windows behind the couple .... I did mention to him that Grazie talked about reflectors too here ... I would much rather reduce the problem before the shoot so post edit work is not so tricky!

Chris
Chris Harding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 5th, 2013, 10:00 AM   #11
Old Boot
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London UK
Posts: 3,528
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

Chris? Hand over a still and I'll have a go.

G
Graham Bernard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 5th, 2013, 04:39 PM   #12
Trustee
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: upper hunter, australia
Posts: 1,368
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

i always carry a couple of z96 led's and stands. amazing what they'll do to counter bright back light...
__________________
www.lesliewand.com.au
Leslie Wand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 6th, 2013, 06:18 AM   #13
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 8,222
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

Hi Grazie

Here is a screen grab to play with ... as you can see the background is fairly blown out already and skins tones have gone crazy. What I normally do is add an Invert plugin followed by the CC and then another invert so I get my footage back to positive again. However I still tend to have to play via the scopes with gamma, gain and offset but never quite know if I should push gamma quite high and then add a little gain and adjust level with the offset or only push gamma a tiny bit and then add a fair amount of gain and correct with offset???

Thanks again guys for all the advice

Chris
Attached Thumbnails
CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset-backlight.jpg  
Chris Harding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 6th, 2013, 09:02 AM   #14
Sponsor: JET DV
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Southern Illinois
Posts: 7,873
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

ColorFast can definitely correct this very quickly and easily. Sony Color Curves can also easily bring up the lows.
__________________
Edward Troxel [SCVU]
JETDV Scripts/Excalibur/Newsletters
Edward Troxel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 6th, 2013, 12:24 PM   #15
Old Boot
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London UK
Posts: 3,528
Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset

Here's my take on it. The BG isn't doing much for the story anyway. So, I've gone for blowing the BG and concentrated on the foreground using ColorFast+Levels+Bump Map+Soft Contrast. Using a nice white background - some detail, but not the blokes with the rucksacks! - is this:-
Attached Thumbnails
CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset-gb-backlight.jpg  
Graham Bernard is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Windows / PC Post Production Solutions > What Happens in Vegas...

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:51 AM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network