Keying with vegas at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Windows / PC Post Production Solutions > What Happens in Vegas...

What Happens in Vegas...
...stays in Vegas! This PC-based editing app is a safe bet with these tips.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old March 29th, 2006, 03:14 AM   #1
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: PAL Zone
Posts: 188
Keying with vegas

Hello

Does anyone know any other keyer other then the standard one in vegas? cant seem to find any info on it but can primatte 3 work with vegas or only after effects? i am after a add on or plug-in that is going to give me a better key with green then the standard one

Thanks for your time
Jim Rog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 29th, 2006, 06:22 AM   #2
Jubal 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Wilmington, NC
Posts: 872
What problems are you having? Vegas keys brilliantly with green.
David Jimerson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 29th, 2006, 08:26 AM   #3
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Little Rock, AR
Posts: 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Jimerson
Vegas keys brilliantly with green.
And on a curious tangent, does Vegas key well with blue or any other color? (I'm working with a green costume for my next shoot.)
Robert Kirkpatrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 29th, 2006, 09:54 AM   #4
Jubal 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Wilmington, NC
Posts: 872
It'll key any color (or range) you specify.

Working with DV, blue is sometimes problematic, because the blue channel can be noisier than the others.
David Jimerson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 29th, 2006, 11:07 AM   #5
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 3,259
I'm still looking for a project to justify purchase, but *many* people have reported great results with Serious Magic Ultra 2 for green-screen with DV. seriousmagic.com.

There's a forum here covering Ultra and DVRack (also an SM product).
Seth Bloombaum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 29th, 2006, 11:19 AM   #6
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Stockton, UT
Posts: 5,648
I'm a major fan of Ultra 2 for speed, but I can achieve nearly as good a key with Vegas in *most* cases, but it takes more time.
With Ultra, or Vegas, you can key from any color, but red specifically is the most difficult key in DV, due to the way DV samples. You can easily use lighter blues, but as David mentions, blues, or specifically deeper hues, can cause a problem. This is due to how DV samples. Luma value is the key factor in any color.
__________________
Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot
Author, producer, composer
Certified Sony Vegas Trainer
http://www.vasst.com
Douglas Spotted Eagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 29th, 2006, 12:01 PM   #7
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: PAL Zone
Posts: 188
Hello

Its HD i am keying with just posted in wrong topic

Any how when i try to key the green out its taking some of the subject out with it the screen isnít lit as best as it could be but i donít have a lot to work with it does ok but then when i want to insert another back ground over it you can still see some of the green. is there any way of brightening up the background without touching the subject so it makes it easier to key?

Thanks again
Jim Rog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 29th, 2006, 12:16 PM   #8
Jubal 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Wilmington, NC
Posts: 872
You've got sliders in the key editor. Try bringing the low up and the high down.

Also, you can use the secondary color corrector to saturate the green and only the green -- apply that before you apply the chroma keyer.
David Jimerson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 17th, 2006, 09:01 AM   #9
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 145
Cleaning up the edges

I am having pretty good results keying out an object with fine lines against a blue background. Both are computer generated. I am using Chroma Blur, Secondary Color to saturate the blue since it is a "sky" and some unevenness is there, and then finally the Chroma Key.

But now I have a fine blue finge/noise around the object. I went to this forum
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...roma+secondary

The suggestion there is to put the Secondary Plug in AFTER the Key plugin. Can someone explain the difference in what is being done here? I thought you would need the secondary CC before the key so you could get a great key. Thoughts? Things look good except that pesky blue noise.....
__________________
Phil Hamilton
hamiltonp@sbcglobal.net
Dallas, Texas

" I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here! ..."
Phil Hamilton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 17th, 2006, 09:40 AM   #10
Jubal 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Wilmington, NC
Posts: 872
No, you need to correct the keyed color before you try the key, so put the corrector in before.

Also, adding a chroma blur between them may help some.

What's being suggested in that thread is to use a secondary corrector for post-key cleanup. You apply it only to the keyed image to try to mitigate the spill. You wouldn't be making the blue more blue; you'd try to get rid of it entirely.
David Jimerson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 17th, 2006, 09:45 AM   #11
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Stockton, UT
Posts: 5,648
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Hamilton
I am having pretty good results keying out an object with fine lines against a blue background. Both are computer generated. I am using Chroma Blur, Secondary Color to saturate the blue since it is a "sky" and some unevenness is there, and then finally the Chroma Key.

The suggestion there is to put the Secondary Plug in AFTER the Key plugin. Can someone explain the difference in what is being done here? I thought you would need the secondary CC before the key so you could get a great key. Thoughts? Things look good except that pesky blue noise.....
Phil,
the order in which you want to do this is:
1. Secondary color corrector to even out the blue
2. Chromablur set to a value of 2.0 (assuming DV source)
3. Chromakey tool
4. Any color correction for the subject in the key itself.
__________________
Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot
Author, producer, composer
Certified Sony Vegas Trainer
http://www.vasst.com
Douglas Spotted Eagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 17th, 2006, 10:46 AM   #12
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Douglas Spotted Eagle
Phil,
the order in which you want to do this is:

4. Any color correction for the subject in the key itself.
So at this point for step 4 would I use the regular color correction or another secondary color correction to touch up any remaining blue? tks for your quick responses...
__________________
Phil Hamilton
hamiltonp@sbcglobal.net
Dallas, Texas

" I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here! ..."
Phil Hamilton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 17th, 2006, 10:50 AM   #13
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Stockton, UT
Posts: 5,648
No. Step 4 is for correcting the SUBJECT within the image. If it comes post-key, it won't affect the blue at all.
Did you shoot blue with a DV source? If so, you're likely going to need to create a garbage matte. Blue isn't a good option for DV sourced-material. You really needed to use green, for the substantially higher luma value.
To create a garbage matte, I have a tutorial at:
http://www.vasst.com/resource.aspx?i...f-b305852df8a7
__________________
Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot
Author, producer, composer
Certified Sony Vegas Trainer
http://www.vasst.com
Douglas Spotted Eagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 17th, 2006, 11:28 AM   #14
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 145
Great tutorial - an easy way of creating a travelling matte. I will give this a try.

I do have another question regarding masking out areas to be keyed. I have this object and I use the Bezier tool to mask around it leaving a little of the blue area to be keyed out. When the object is against a lighter background I can make out the edges of the area I've masked out! This does not seem to happen with cookie-cutter but the bezier tool is great for creating a custom shape.

What is better to use - the bezier tool or cookie cutter? And when using the bezier tool is it generally better to feather - in - out - or both to clean out the mask line?
__________________
Phil Hamilton
hamiltonp@sbcglobal.net
Dallas, Texas

" I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here! ..."
Phil Hamilton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 17th, 2006, 11:37 AM   #15
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Stockton, UT
Posts: 5,648
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Hamilton
What is better to use - the bezier tool or cookie cutter? And when using the bezier tool is it generally better to feather - in - out - or both to clean out the mask line?
There is no "rule." You'll find it's entirely project-dependent. I use both, but end up using Bezier most of the time, and feathering is often "both."
HTH
__________________
Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot
Author, producer, composer
Certified Sony Vegas Trainer
http://www.vasst.com
Douglas Spotted Eagle is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Windows / PC Post Production Solutions > What Happens in Vegas...

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:25 AM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network