De-interlacing method
 

I am using pair of consumer camcorders - AVCHD for my 3D @ 60i. When I play the resulting video on TV, it seems o.k. due t the decent de-interlacing technique - I am guessing. When I play back on computer or over internet (YT/Vimeo) I have annoying artifacts due to interlacing. I tried to use several de-interlacers, but I canot find one that works well. Does anyone have any suggestions for good de-interlacer?

Re: De-interlacing method
 

It depends on what platform you're on. Revision FX's Fieldskit is pretty good & also works on many platforms. If you're on Mac, use compressor & set the deinterlacing to "blend". On a budget, try JES Deinterlacer.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Thanks Arnie. I work on either Windows or MacOS and would like to use decent de-interlacer on either. Your advice is very helpful and I appreciate it.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Hi
Try ffdshow with deinterlace checked (yadif method)
This gives me smooth result!

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Thank you Prech. I'll give it a try.

Pavel

Re: De-interlacing method
 

I'll second yadif. It beats the adaptive, motion-compensated de-interlacer in Compressor hands down (and every other software de-interlacer I ever tried).

Re: De-interlacing method
 

When is the best moment for de-interlaced? Do you de-interlace L and R clip separeted or do you de-interlaced once the are ensambled?
Thank´s

Re: De-interlacing method
 

De-interlace as a first step, fresh out of the camera. Any transcoding or frame manipulation might have the unintended consequence of blending the two fields from the camera - which need to be pristinely separated for proper de-interlacing.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

How can i play Sony TD10 native files with Stereoscopic Player
with good deinterlace (bob, yadif, etc)?

Re: De-interlacing method
 

I'll look into the ffdshow, especially since I'm doing all my stereo work on PC.

Does anyone have a sample interlace vs. de-interlaced stereo comparison samples link, so I can see them side-by-side?

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Stereoscopic Player will deinterlace on the fly. Depending on your video card, you'll generally get quite decent hardware deinterlacing.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

FYI - AVISynth can run YADIF as well.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

I have only a geforce 210 card. Can i use this with Stereoplayer for high quality deinterlacing?

Re: De-interlacing method
 

I've never seen really bad deinterlacing from an NVIDIA card, but, reviews say otherwise for the 210 card:

AnandTech - Quick Look: MSI?s GeForce 210

"The quality is reminiscent of vector adaptive deinterlacing, however it’s not as clean as what we’ve seen on the GT 220."

It's still worth a try.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

When i check deinterlace to on in Stereoscopic player, it will use the gpu hardware deinterlacing? Sure?
After turned on, the horizontal lines disappear, but i don't get smooth motion. I see 25fps progressive (from 50i source), and not 50fps.
I can see my 50i mpeg2 videos at 50fps deinterlaced with bob or yadif method via ffdshow. But when i
load native videos from TD10, i cannot change deinterlace method at "video properties" under used filters.
Only 3dtv.at AVC/MVC decoder is used, and i cannot setup here anything.

So i really need a new video card? A GT240 support good deinterlacing?
thx

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Yeah, that is what the review said - that the card will try to attempt vector adaptive deinterlacing but cannot maintain realtime playback. That's unfortunate, because vector adaptive deinterlacing is a quality approach (uses optical flow analysis to interpolate position of features between the two fields).

It's a snarly process - but - you can split the MVC into left and right uncompressed streams (AVI uncompressed) using Peter Wimmer's MVC to AVI converter. Then, use AVISynth & YAFID to deinterlace the streams and re-compress in AVI container (in VC-1 or H.264 format) @ a target bitrate that your system can handle for realtime playback (e.g. 10 Mbps).

One major bummer of the TD10 - is no 24P.... and if you deinterlace into 1080 60P, 50P, 30P or even 25P, you cannot play using most HDMI 1.4a 3DTVs.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Thanks, i don't need the MVC converter, because Vegas handle the raw video.
If the TD10 can record 24p in 3D, i doubt how often use it.
24p to my eyes is just not enough in 3D.
I really like stedicam moves, aerial footages etc in at 50/60 fps in 3D.

Anyway i try to play back my TD10 files with another computer, this time with
an Ati 5450 card. It also support weave, bob, vector adaptive deinterlace, but
none of them work good with Stereoscopic player. Motion was never smooth.
It was like 25p again. :(
Even the 5450 cannot to this? I can't believe. My i7 cpu can solve the whole problem,
but i cannot set software deinterlace with the player??

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Prech,

What are you viewing your output from Vegas on? Do you have a Black magic card or something similar?

3D BD spec states:

1920×1080 @ 23.976 fps progressive
1280×720 @ 59.94 fps progressive
1280×720 @ 50 fps progressive

I use a TD10 - and although the limit of raster size is 1280x720, results for motion are excellent. I simply create a project in 720 50P.



Paul :-)

Re: De-interlacing method
 

No, i mean i don't need a separate program for converting to AVI, etc,
because Vegas handle TD10 files, and i can render out avis, mpeg2 files from Vegas.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Prech, the TD10 does not record 23.98 in 3D mode, only in 2D mode. One of your earlier posts seemed to indicate you were unsure about this.

It's really annoying because the Sony literature obscures this fact and I didn't find out until I had shot it as a C camera for 8 days and then saw the readout in Inspector. No harm, Twixtor fixed the usable shots.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Paul:
i like to view my TD10 3D footage on my fullhd Cinema3D display, without resolution loss,
and with smooth playback. Why not, if it's already in 50i format?
I like to quick check and playback the footage from Stereosopic player with good deinterlacer,
and don't want to convert to 720p only for viewing it. For this task geforce 210 and even ati
5450 is weak? That was my question. If yes, what is the minimum card for it?

Sorry Bruce, my english is not very good. I know that this cam cannot record 24p in 3D.

"If the TD10 can record 24p in 3D" is not exactly what i want to say.
Instead: "If the TD10 could record in 24p".. With a new firmware or something.
In this case, i doubt i will ever use this mode, because i don't like 24p especially in 3D.
I can slow down my 50i footage to 24p, and we also have a dual projector setup with
50Hz refresh, so when projecting the video, 50i is very good!

Re: De-interlacing method
 

That's great for personal viewing - but - for distribution, it's a downfall. 3D Blu-ray is limited to 24P in 1080 and HDMI 1.4a's manditory mode for full-frame 1080 is 24P too.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Yes, and i can slowdown my 50i footage to 24p nicely.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Still searching the cheapest vga card, which can playback my
TD10 50i files with Stereoscopic player at nice 50fps.
Do i have to use ON- OFF or AUTOMATIC in settings/format/deinterlace?

I also installed the latest coreavc, but it doesn't work (player says: codec necessary)
Seems it can use only the internal coreavc mvc codec, but without hardware acceleration by me.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

I recently bought a PNY GeForce GT 430 1024MB for $62.24 with shipping on Amazon.com. It has great motion-adaptive deinterlacing with Stereoscopic player (NOTE: I've only tested with TD10 60i content, not 50i). I leave the Stereoscopic player deinterlace setting at automatic.

I think the CoreAVC (MVC) decoder (or an OEM subset of it) is built-in to Stereoscopic player.

-- DC

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Thanks.
If you can test with my 50i file, would be great.
http://www.relaxvideo.hu/td10.mts

Yes, the coreavc is built in the player, i just installed the latest one, hope
it helps, but does not.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Yadiff is very good but I have been experimenting with QTGMC which is considered by many to be the best. It is an avisynth filter but realy does need the multi-threaded version of avisynth. It's speed can be configured depending on the quality you need.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

David: have you tested with my 50i file?
I can now buy a 220 card for cheap.
Should i buy or not? :o

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Ooops... sorry... dropped the ball on that one. I just verified that your 50i test file de-interlaces perfectly on an Nvidia GT 540M GPU. Looks great - no tearing.

Best,

David

Re: De-interlacing method
 

So you see 50fps not just 25?

* news: i became an info from Peter, the author of the player.
He wrote when deinterlacing is enabled, the player drops
one field, resulting in 25p, no matter what hardware you use.

So how can you see good deinterlace?

Re: De-interlacing method
 

re: 25P

The result is properly de-interlaced 50i to 25P on a 120 Hz page-flipping. There are no visible de-interlace errors (e.g. tearing). What exactly are you asking for?

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Oh, i like to see 50p, with frame doubled or bob or something nice deinterlace method!
Not just jumpy 25p, with dropped one filed!
So no hw. acceleration by anybody? :(

Re: De-interlacing method
 

The NVIdia motion-adaptive de-interlace is VERY good. You know, 50i to 50P syntehsizes spatial data up the ying-yang (it's fundamentally line-doubling). 50i to 25P is a good trade-off between temporal and spatial data preservation.

In any case - the 25P looks good from an NVidia card. Not sure how to get a line-doubled 50P signal to look at, short of YADIF'ing one up.

RE: Playback - you can view up to 1080 60P on an NVIDIA page-flipping display. 50P is no problem (no frame dropping needed). Out to HDMI 1.4a is another story. Their your MAX for 1080 will be 24P. You'll have do down-sample to 720 to go to 25P or 50P without frame-dropping. You can also conform the 25P to 24P, easy enough.

Re: De-interlacing method
 

Sorry, i don't understand you.

"The NVIdia motion-adaptive de-interlace is VERY good"

How can i use this with the player, when Peter sayed:
"the player drops one field, resulting in 25p, no matter what hardware you use"

I just want to view my TD10 50i files at 50fps like my old HDV mpeg2 50i footages...
(with mpeg2 i can set which codec to use, what deinterlace, etc)

edit: in the player you set deinterlace to on or off? If on, then the player drop one field, if off,
the vga card recognize that it is interlaced video, and use the hardware deinterlacing algorythm?

Re: De-interlacing method
 

AH... sorry... took it a while to sink in. Peter is stripping of one field and line doubling in the presentation layer, before handing it to the video card. Damn. I verified that if you turn de-interlacing off in the SP settings, it display's as interlaced on the page-flipper display. NVIDIA's de-interlacing does not kick-in.

)-:

Re: De-interlacing method
 

So you never saw great deinterlaced footage with stereoscopic player?
Then i don't understand this previous statement with GT 430:
"It has great motion-adaptive deinterlacing with Stereoscopic player"

Re: De-interlacing method
 

1) The NVIDIA card has GREAT motion-adaptive de-interlacing.

2) Your footage didn't tear or suffer from any of the usual artifacts of bad de-interlacing

3) I thought your original issue was bad playback speed w/ de-interlacing turned on, which is not occurring on the NVIDIA card.

-- therefore -

I gave it a clean bill of health.

It's not easy to see the difference between stealing one field and doubling it to get 25P - or - actually de-interlacing to get 25P on a notebook page flipper. In fact, it's impossible. I assumed (incorrectly) that your concern was de-interlacing artifacts & speed.

This is one of those, "no good deed goes unpunished" moments. So, it's possible (but, I'm checking with Peter), that this statement was not entirely accurate, " Stereoscopic Player will deinterlace on the fly. Depending on your video card, you'll generally get quite decent hardware deinterlacing." Should have said, "will get decent playback speeds w/ software line-doubling."

Re: De-interlacing method
 

I never wrote about bad playback speed.
For me 50i footage to jerky 25p means "bad de-interlacing"
thanks