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-   -   Capturing a whole tape with splits? (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/adobe-creative-suite/110180-capturing-whole-tape-splits.html)

Nathan Quattrini December 13th, 2007 04:44 PM

Capturing a whole tape with splits?
 
I just read this about Final Cut

"I have the machine capture the full tapes, splitting them to clips....With cheap HDDs this is convenient, no need to sit around and choose which takes to capture etc.
"

How does that work exactly...and can CS3 do that?

Bill Hamell December 13th, 2007 05:56 PM

I am using PP2 not CS3, however as far as I know it is the same in all versions.

File > Capture

With your capture device connected, you select Scene Detect and click on Tape in the Capture section of the Capture window.

You can determine the location of the files that are captured either in the project preferences or from the Settings tab in the Capture window.

Bill

Mike McCarthy December 13th, 2007 11:43 PM

Yes CS3 can do that, but it handles the timecode breaks a little differently I believe. There is an auto scene detect option, but I prefer to capture entire tapes as single clips. Either option is available in any Premiere Pro version.

Brian Brown December 14th, 2007 02:28 AM

IIRC, CS3 will do scene-detect on DV but not HDV. I use the wonderful (and free) HDVSplit to capture entire HDV tapes to the HDD and delete the bad ones later. Seems to save a lot of time/wear on my playheads. On a tape with dozens/hundreds of scene changes, this makes sense. On longer form projects/takes, probably not.

HTH,
Brian Brown
BrownCow Productions

Nathan Quattrini December 15th, 2007 11:58 PM

so HDV Split you just push play and it records everything splitting the file every time pause was hit?

ARG thats PC only...any program for the Mac?

Mike McCarthy December 16th, 2007 02:17 AM

Uhm...Final Cut. (As you pointed out)

Nathan Quattrini December 16th, 2007 09:35 AM

any others....I only just got the CS 3 suite

Brian Brown December 16th, 2007 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan Quattrini (Post 793330)
so HDV Split you just push play and it records everything splitting the file every time pause was hit?

ARG thats PC only...any program for the Mac?

Yes, HDVSplit will scene detect from the camera or from existing files on the computer. It's awesome. I can do capture/split while I'm editing video in PPro.

Yep, it's for XP/Vista only.

So, do you have a Mac and the CS3 suite?

-bb

Nathan Quattrini December 16th, 2007 07:55 PM

CS3 suite on the mac yea

Ervin Farkas December 17th, 2007 11:41 AM

What version Mac? The newer ones can operate as Windows machies as well... Option two: any old, unused PC with firewire can do it, the spec requirements are very low with HDVSplit.

Nathan Quattrini December 17th, 2007 12:50 PM

but does HDV split act as its own capture device? I do have a PC as well, but no software that can capture or edit HDV....

I do have a new mac as well with the intel chips...so i could use HDV Split on that if I bought another copy of windows huh?

Does it save as m2t? Also is that better or worse than cineform making 10 bit editing files?

Ervin Farkas December 17th, 2007 12:58 PM

You don't need anything else, HDV Split IS ALL THE SOFTWARE you need, it will make a perfect copy of what's on the tape, absolutely no processing, no alteration, just a plain and simple file transfer.

And yes, it saves as .m2t. It's neither better or worse than anything else since it's a perfect copy of your tape - you can take it from there and work with it natively or via CineForm.

Nathan Quattrini December 17th, 2007 01:19 PM

ahh great to hear. Looks like I`ll while waiting to install my new OS on the Mac i can get started using my PC first for capturing. Any idea how many gigs 1 hour of footage will take up in m2t format?

Ervin Farkas December 17th, 2007 01:43 PM

HDV file size is exact same as standard definition video: ~12-13 GB per hour.

Ian G. Thompson December 17th, 2007 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan Quattrini (Post 793330)
so HDV Split you just push play and it records everything splitting the file every time pause was hit?

ARG thats PC only...any program for the Mac?

By the way...you don't have to hit pause everytime....just let the tape run itself out....once the tape is done you will find all of your clips neatly clipped and ready for use.

Nathan Quattrini December 17th, 2007 03:01 PM

thanks guys, you`ve really eased my headache that started yesterday apon learning premiere couldn`t split HDV nor review while capturing....weak

Ervin Farkas December 17th, 2007 03:03 PM

Even if PremPro would capture, I would still use HDV Split because I can capture with it in the background while the computer is working something else, it's very low in computer resource usage.

Nathan Quattrini December 22nd, 2007 10:11 AM

i looked at the HDV Split page and still had questions. It will make a new scene every time the camera button was paused during recording right? Thats what makes a timecode break? Also did they just never update the readme? It only says the Sony cams work

Brian Brown December 22nd, 2007 10:54 AM

It will make a new file from each "scene" on the tape (yes, by sensing when the footage has changed, like when you pushed stop or turned off the cam). Timecode breaks are another matter entirely, and good habits must be followed to avoid breaking timecode on your tapes. Another good practice is to put 20-30sec of bars and tone at the beginning and end of a tape (the most vulnerable areas for stretching and damage). I also do this between major "events" on a tape... the tone alerts me to take a look at the next filename (*.m2t) to put the footage in another sub-directory or even stop the capture.

I haven't read the readme since the software works so well for me. But my XH-A1 never has any trouble synching up with HDVSplit. I have the best luck with a solid capture when I activate the software and then turn on the cam in VCR/Play mode. If there's any doubt or hiccups, I just restart the cam. Since you also shoot with this cam, be aware of the settings between HDV and DV in the camera's menu. Sometimes they mysteriously change on me and HDVSplit doesn't recognize the cam.

HTH,
Brian Brown
BrownCow Productions

Nathan Quattrini December 22nd, 2007 03:22 PM

Thanks brian, i always have new things to learn. My workflow has always been just film, capture the old fashion way (watch, rewind, capture, missed 1 second rewind again, capture again). I never realized there were alternatives to these things. So now I`ll need to learn how to film for this kind of work flow...and save some more sanity.

Nathan Quattrini December 24th, 2007 08:01 PM

I can`t HDV Split to recognize the A1....and the directions on their site lead to a dead link...and is aimed at the Sony camers anyway....how did you make it work with your A1 brian?


*ok i got it to recognize the camera...but in ffdshow the instructions say
"1. In start menu open "ffdshow" -> "Audio decoder configuration"
2. Choose "Codec" tab
3. Find in the table, under "Format" column, "MP1,MP2" row. "

There isn`t any row thats named that in the audio codec menu. What now?theres an MP2 row but thats it.

Brian Brown December 26th, 2007 05:14 PM

Nathan, I haven't ever used ffdshow. I think it's for folks that don't have a native mpeg application like PPro. You can get along fine without it.

FWIW, I use VLC Media Player to view my clips outside of PPro. I'll then rename the clips to something useful prior to bringing them into PPro or AE.

HTH,
Brian

Nathan Quattrini January 1st, 2008 12:56 PM

i got it all working, now have about 9 hours of tapes all split. Now I`m curious as to how you delete files efficiently. Do you just write down the bad ones and manually delete them? Or delete them off the timeline and use the project manager to copy only files on the timeline to a new folder? (Using premiere)

Adam Gold January 1st, 2008 02:00 PM

To delete unused files after editing in PPro, go to Project Manager and "Create New Trimmed File" and tell it to delete unused files.

To delete unnecessary files before editing, you can double click each one in the project window to open it up in the program monitor. Play it to confirm you don't need it, then go to it in the project window, right-click and select "Unlink media." This will give you an option to delete the file from the disc.

Deleting from the timeline only removes that instance of the clip, not the clip itself.

This is all from memory so if it doesn't work let us know and I'll fire up PPro and double-check.

EDIT: just remembered you're using CS3 on the Mac, so procedure may be a bit different. Also note that just hitting the DEL key with an unnecessary clip highlighted in the project window just removes the reference to the clip, but does not delete the clip from your HDD.

Nathan Quattrini January 1st, 2008 02:08 PM

well i`m going to need to be deleting several hundred clips so going one by one won't work. I was thinking to just delete the bad takes from the time line then use project manager to make a new folder with only used files, but I was hoping there was an easier more streamlines way to do it.

Adam Gold January 1st, 2008 02:19 PM

I guess I'm a little confused. Why are bad takes on your timeline at all? They don't go there unless you put them there. You'll have to to through them one at a time to decide which ones to delete even if you've dragged every clip to the timeline, won't you? Otherwise how will you know which ones are the bad ones?

If you find that less than about half your footage is "good," you shouldn't be capturing the whole tape with scene detection. You should go through your tape, mark the in and out points of all the "good" takes, and then batch capture. It's a little more work (okay, a lot) up front but saves you all of this deleting hassle.

But for your current project, I guess your way is the best way, since the bad shots are there already. Just create a new trimmed project after you've finished editing.

Nathan Quattrini January 1st, 2008 02:41 PM

ok heres the layout.

- 1 tape of footage.

- Captured with scene detection to save the heads on the camera from too much wear from rewding, recording, missing recording because of too small pre-roll, rewinding again, etc.

- 100+ Clips from tape dropped onto timeline so I can watch them all in sequence.

- Good takes raised to video 2. When I complete the tape, select Video 1 and delete everything on it leaving only the good takes from the whole tape.

This is where I`m not sure if there is an easier way than to use the project manager to create a copy of the project copying over only used clips on the timeline (I believe theres an option 'delete unused clips') Or is this the easiest way?

Brian Brown January 1st, 2008 05:05 PM

I always look at each clip with VLC, deleting the bad ones off the hard drive before I begin editing PPro. But since you've already started in PPro, the advice you've been given with Project Manager is the best way to go from here.

It's a good practice to slate your takes in production, putting a small whiteboard in the frame with the take # and any other info helpful during post. Then write down the good takes on a notebook to make your life easier in post. Another option: On the very next take after the good one, you can place your whiteboard upside-down as a visual that the last take was a keeper (alternatively, you could use color bars and tone), then quickly turn off the camera. Once the tape is captured, scan your clips for the smallest file sizes containing the "good take" visual and you'll know that the file preceding it was the good one. And delete the rest.

Sometimes the extra time we take in production pays off with big time savings in post-production.

HTH,
Brian Brown
BrownCow Productions

Nathan Quattrini January 2nd, 2008 11:26 AM

Yea thats something I need to get into the habit of, but I need more crew first. I also tend to want to watch all the footage anyway since sometimes you can salvage pieces of takes especially for camera switches. Hard to tell whats a good take in the small LCD as well. I do need to at least start slating once I get the chance to find more people to work with other than myself and my brother when I get lucky and drag him into it. Guess I felt it was something more appropriate for when giving footage to an editor...but I`m editing it as well.

Ervin Farkas January 9th, 2008 09:37 AM

Adobe Bridge is also a good tool for reviewing clips and deleting the bad ones. Is that not part of the suite for the Mac?

Nathan Quattrini January 9th, 2008 02:41 PM

it is in there...but honestly i`m not quite sure what its for heh...i am still used to Premiere of the old days, never learned the new tricks that came over the years.


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