FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

So I'm going to learn both Premiere and Avid - figured the quickest learn was Premiere so have been working in CS5.5 for a couple of days now, checking out online tuts and such. I'm starting to get comfortable in it but keep running into issues. Worked through learning how it handled mono/stereo tracks yesterday (thankfully before doing any major editing). Today, I see that while trying to add a transition with a keyboard shortcut, it works if the commands are set to the Premiere set in the prefs, but once under 'custom,' I've mapped (and re-mapped) the same transition command but it doesn't work. Dragging it works fine, but not practical...
If anyone has a solution for that, great...please post! ...
Also the marker functionality in CS5.5 is pretty nil... I need to mark a lot of interviews... but it looks like that might have been corrected in later versions with a markers tab. Subclips labeled with the dialog is another option, but it's a pain to deal with transitions on a sub clip because of end of clip limitations. It also takes a lot longer.

But mostly I'm feeling sort of annoyed with Premiere although it does seem to have some rockin' features.
I'm also a bit disturbed about the CC subscription - I don't want to switch to a program that will hold me hostage to a subscription in the future.
Wondering what other switchers think about Premiere as a program. It seems difficult to work with although I'm sure a large bit of that is just the usual learning curve. I miss FCP like an old flame.
Thoughts? General impressions? Solution for the transition issue?
Do you like Avid better?

Thx folks =)

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Hi,
If you are a FCP Switcher, you've got to at least try Premiere Pro CC. It's a lot closer to FCP 7 than CS5.5 is. There is a 30 day trial available. There are "soft" sub clips so you can use a transition on them now. Markers are working as you'd expect too.

As to the question of the subscription, that'd be up to you. It's less than $50 per month. I wouldn't consider that a huge cost if I was freelancing again. Again, your call on that. I'd say that most people on CC are very happy with it.

Thanks,
Kevin

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Due to the ridiculous Adobe pricing strategy it is more than $ 86 per month here. I'm very glad not having gone the CC route, since it saved me over $ 1000 this first year alone. Every month not on a subscription saves me $ 86. Best investment ever NOT GOING THE SUBSCRIPTION PATH.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Frustrating, I just drafted a whole reply and the board logged me out for the second time in ten minutes. Argh.

I'll give that trial a whirl. I can see situations where the subscription model would be useful, and others where it would be a hindrance. I personally don't want to be bound to a subscription but would still be open to considering the benefits down the road. I think Adobe should offer the subscription as an option and not as a mandatory thing. It may come back to bite them.

Like the idea of soft subclips and am glad they fixed the marker issue in later versions. I don't really have a workflow that includes subclips for the most part, and was trying to work out a system to log some interviews. In light of the limited marker functionality, subclips with a synopsis of the dialogue looked like an option but it took a long time. And you still have to rework them in the timeline anyway. I eventually ended up just marking them at major points and cutting up in the timeline, since they were fairly brief interviews - but that's just a fix for now since they're not really logged or labeled.

Do PP later versions offer smart bins or keywording? Just curious.

Right now I'm just trying to get fluent in PP since it's one of the industry standards - plan to do that with Avid as well.

BTW I'm enjoying your videos Kevin, thank you.

Oh, I fixed the transition issue - it would map 'add transition' but not 'add default transition.' Works for now.

VENT- won't go to markers without highlighting the clip! Grrr.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

PP CC is much more feature rich than PP 5.5. The autosync and multicam features built into PP CC are amazing (assuming you need those sorts of things). I started using PP CC late last year (I've have many years of FCP and Avid MC under my belt) and I enjoy it for the most part. The subscription only route isn't my favorite but I'm making more money with right now it than I would be without it so I'm not going to complain too hard.

Between PP and Avid... it really depends on what type of work you do. Most gigs I do are on Avid and for big projects (like reality shows) I couldn't see myself using anything else. But Avid MC is still an offline editor at it's heart so effects work, finishing, fine audio mixing, etc., is better done in other programs. PP, like FCP, has a bit broader base of functionality than Avid does and with the creative cloud subscription you also get all the other Adobe programs so if you are a smaller shop or one-man-band then Avid might not be versatile enough for you.

I would also keep my eyes on Resolve 11 when it becomes available (as it has many NLE features in it now) as well as the Mac Lightworks beta which should come out early June.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Yes, I also think there is room in the market for multiple right answers to the NLE question...

On the 5.5 to CC jump...if nothing else, the marker functionality has been one of the faster advancing features, so you might encounter a bit less frustration there.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

I'm enjoying parts of working with it - but I found a nifty tutorial which had some timeline trimming keyboard techniques, most of which appear able to be done only in CS6.
But as a program it's pretty cool . It's a little odd because I'm used to being able to fly through FCP, but I"m getting more comfortable and able to get around in it.
Love that still export feature - beats having to export via QT Conversion. Drove me nuts.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Was a FCP user for many years and made the jump to PP CS when Apple "screwed the pooch" with X. Setting up the keyboard to function like FCP7 was a piece of cake and I haven't looked back. It's nice to have the full inter-application functionality since I use AE, PS and AI quite a bit.
PP has one thing that used to annoy me but not any more…title generation. It's a bit bulkier to deal with than FCP but once you set up some keyboard shortcuts it's really nice. Did a project that had 200 3-5min vids with 30-40 title cards in each last year. My intern got tasked with building them and got really speedy at it! The render queue feature is a life saver!
Very happy with the whole Adobe suite and unless they do something stupid like Apple did, I will continue to rely on it!!

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Tim and Robert, have you edited on Avid as well? If so, what do you see as the advantages/disadvantages of each?

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Avid announced they are going to the "rental" route so I'm looking forward to the next release of Resolve which will be version 11. It looks like it's taking the NLE seriously and not to mention they have a free version which is really robust!

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Ugg. "Rental." Really? I hadn't heard that.
This is a good opening for someone to come along and fill the gap with a program that is not 'rental' and pick up a place in the industry.'

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

"This is a good opening for someone to come along and fill the gap with a program that is not 'rental' and pick up a place in the industry"


Blackmagic Resolve! :-)

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

I've been on a good relationship with Premiere CS6 until recently. Computer crashes, due to overheat(!?! on a iMac 4 core 3.4Ghz i7, 32 Gb RAM, 2Gb Nvidia GPU) editing out of a USB3 drive...Somehow the last few copies of Auto- Save were not saved, where did it go? Lost an hour of work or so, (see article below)

Computer shuts down while using GPU intensive applications

Also, sometimes I have to work on my laptop, when I open the project from the iMac on it, it takes forever as the project has to be 're-indexed' each time. I moved from FCP7 a few years ago, tried FCPX but that too was frustrating. Not willing to go on subscription either. I edit Avid at a TV station occasionally, do not like it either, am I hard to please?
I'll try Resolve, I'll try Vegas or Edius as long as it is stable and fast. This tread has valid info on this discussion:
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/general-...had-adobe.html

I wish I didn't have these issues as I do like Premiere as it is so intuitive for me, but I'll be kicking its bucket any time soon.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Avid didn't go subscription-only like Adobe did. Avid offers a pure subscription model, a traditional perpetual license model and a 'hybrid model'. With the hybrid model you pay full price for the program once, then pay $299 a year for upgrades. If you stop paying the $299 you keep your current version of Avid 'as is' but you don't access to any more upgrades. If you later decide you want a new version of Avid then you have to pay full price again (no upgrade discounts). Basically they've gotten rid of the upgrade discount and replaced it with a $299 annual fee.

There's a couple other wrinkles but that's it in a nut shell.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Hmmm... no shutting down problems on this end... hope that gets resolved for you. That's frustrating.
I had a friend who edited on Edius and loved it.
Someday I'll have to try all those other programs out just to see how they work. Right now I"m trying to get literate in the industry standard programs -- after that I can have a little more freedom of choice.

Regarding the Avid models, I think that's fine - at least they give you an option and don't take you hostage. It would depend what the end cost of each would be.

Liking Premiere so far - except I don't see a way in this version to save a custom transition but can copy/paste for now if need be.
The keyboard shortcuts are buggy - not crazy about that - hopefully they fixed that. Any changes you make results in a 'custom' keyboard setting spread - but sometimes it saves them and sometimes they dump out. Flighty. Grrr.
I'm starting to edit with the trim window though - it's a different way of editing for me but it's kind of cool. I'm starting to move around and get used to some of the shortcuts in the trim window and the timeline. Some of these methods may be more efficient than my previous way of editing.
Premiere does have some nice features to it, I'm warming up to it.

I read part of the Adobe thread the other day - still plan to read more. Love this though:

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

That's how Adobe started also and then they pulled the rug out from under their customers.
I would not be surprised if Avid ends up doing the same thing!

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

From a business standpoint, it's probably a more lucrative model.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Hi Kell,

We know about this one. In the upcoming version of Premiere Pro CC, you'll be able to save custom dissolves. The plan is to give more transitions this treatment going forward.

Yes, if you make a change you get a custom keyboard, as with FCP 7, and earlier. I'm sorry that you find that some of the shortcuts are not saved when you return to them. I have not experienced that. If you like, file a bug here: http://adobe.ly/BugReport Thanks.

The only complaint I have is that you can't "double tap" keys like you can in FCP 7, and earlier. For example, you cannot call up the Roll tool by tapping R + R.

Yes, trim edit is pretty awesome in Premiere Pro CS6, and later. I'm glad you like it. I used the Trim Edit window in FCP, but I find Trim Edit to be much more functional and easier to use. Shortcuts will really help you in this regard.

It's a shame that I didn't find out about Terry Wall's problem sooner. I could've had an agent contact him to solve that issue. If anyone else ever gets into this kind of trouble using Creative Cloud applications, please contact Adobe support ASAP here: Contact Customer Care You can even tweet to @AdobeCare and I will get your message.

The guy that made this spoof is actually a Creative Cloud member.

I prefer the term "subscription" because you get not only all of our applications, but a bunch of services like storage, Typekit and Behance which I feel are relevant for our community.

You can still purchase Premiere Pro CS6, which is not part of our subscription program. I'm not sure how editors that want to use other NLEs will do without Creative Cloud applications. When I was a FCP guy, I still had to have access to After Effects, Illustrator, Photoshop, and Encore. I owned Production Premium even though I had Final Cut Studio, as well. Integration with all these apps was very cumbersome, even with helper apps like Automatic Duck.

I didn't use Premiere Pro because I wasn't familiar with it, but now I am. It has many similar FCP style features and others above and beyond FCP, so I feel more comfortable with it. The integration between these applications is matchless, unlike my previous workflow with FCP.

If I didn't work at Adobe, I would be in the same boat as you in making decisions about which NLE to choose, but I still think I'd consider Premiere Pro and Creative Cloud for its features and integration.

I was professionally trained as an Avid editor. If you're coming from FCP, I don't think you'll like it. The jump from FCP to Premiere is so much more easy.

The timeline trimming is insanely good. I'm particularly fond of Ripple Trim to Playhead (some call "Tops" and "Tails") which came in at CS6. Selecting a clip/next clip under the playhead in CC is also very helpful. I like all the presets you can make for the timeline, like patching, track height, etc.

In Premiere Pro CC, it's even better. You have the option of automatically importing it back into the project, as well.

There is a search function, but no smart bin/keyword capability. We do know about that request.

Those were made for CS5. 4 years ago! Well, I hope they helped you.

In Premiere Pro CC you can choose to go to "All Markers."

Hope this answers a few questions for you.

Thanks,
Kevin

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Unfortunately, when it is good for business, it a bad for the end-user.

In the first year alone, I saved, well not spent, over $ 1 K on the rental and each month I do not move over to the rental model saves me $ 86. That allows me to spend my money elsewhere AND I can use my projects all the time without having to pay extra for it. A major benefit of using a perpetual license.

Sure, I miss out the latest supported camera formats, but since I don't have such a camera, that is nothing to miss. I miss all the new features in the CC version, or should I say, that are not features, that are bugs ...

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Hi Harm,

Sorry that CC won't work out for you. Nice to hear from you, though. Do appreciate your continued help in the community. Keep rockin'!

Kevin

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Take another look at FCPX. It's no joke.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Haven't touched an Avid in over twenty years so can't comment on the current state of their software. (geez I'm old!) I have heard the latest versions are very nice though. Had a rep try to convince me to switch and I seemed to have an answer for all the "Avid does this…can Premiere?" questions. They are both very capable. The choice should be made based on the area you are in and what the other editors you may send projects back and forth to are using. Phoenix seems to be mostly Premiere users who switched from FCP7.

And to Mark…several of us in my circle tried FCPX and the only real issue was the inability to move a project from computer to computer. Since I have several producers and production houses who like to do rough cuts then send to me for finishing and graphics, it just didn't work. The software is fast and does everything needed albeit in a very strange interface for an old-school editor like me. Have they updated to allow moving projects?

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Lightworks will also become an option for Mac users on 11th June and may be worth trying out. It has a wide range of payment methods, so you're no tied into the cloud.

You have the choice of the FCP keyboard arrangement, although, as with most NLE's, if you try to use the program precisely the same as your old software making the move will be frustrating.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Thank you all for your thoughts on the issue. I've gotten sidelined lately and am just coming back to the board.
I'm getting more comfortable in Premiere, it's a nice program once you get past the awkwardness of learning something new. Some of the things drive me batty and have maybe been corrected in later versions - and maybe not, but most things seem pretty workable.
I"ve been away from that for about a month as well - so it's going to be a re-familiarzing with it when I get back in.
I think I could be pretty comfortable on Premiere - but the next stop is Avid so that may or may not change everything. Last time I tried to learn Avid, it was a nightmare - but perhaps because I expected a really small learning curve. I abandoned it in favor of just being able to get something done in PRemiere. This time I'll go in expecting a higher learning curve.
The fact that Avid edits AVCHD without transcoding is a huge, huge plus though. Saving drive space is a great thing. Man, when I transcoded those files to AIC for an earlier project they were HUGE. It would be better not to have to deal with that.
Thx everyone have a great day.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

"The fact that Avid edits AVCHD without transcoding is a huge, huge plus though. "

I have to assume you mean versus FCP right? PPro handles AVCHD (and just about everything else) natively.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

When it's bad for business, it's undeniably bad for the customer...owners of discontinued, unsupported products from businesses that no longer exist or just abandon the market for more profitable niches aren't big winners either... I guess satisfying everyone is impossible.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

FCPX handles everything PPro will handle natively.....

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

I think his point is that one of Adobe's motivations (I didn't say the only one, but undeniably one
of them), is to make more money off its users. By changing to a subscription base, they do
this. I don't begrudge them this, if you create an awesome bunch of software, you SHOULD
profit off it! Unfortunately, I am one of their 'less valued' clients. I switched over to CS6 from FCP7.
I do not upgrade every cycle, (FCP 2>FCP 4.5>FCP 7) instead updating when there are enough new
features to entice me to upgrade. So for me (and others like me), upgrading to CC would cost
me more money, but give Adobe more money. Adobe made the decision to no longer offer me
a choice for when I feel their software is worth paying them the money to upgrade.
I made a business choice, that it would therefore be in MY best interest to switch NLE's.
FCP X is a total new way of editing and learning it was a little struggle. But it costs less
than 6 months subscription to CC and Motion cost 1 month as does Compressor. And
all their upgrades are free. Like Harm, I am banking money every month, instead of spending
it on CC. That is good for my business. I'm going to look out for my bottom line,
just as Adobe is looking out for their's.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

I was under the impression that MXF files still needed additional plugins...

At any rate, I thought the OP was referring to switching from FCP7...

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Tim,

MXF.....is that C300 files? I can't remember which is which anymore. I remember
last year working as a DIT on a TV show pilot. It was shot with C300's and the laptop
production sent me to use.....had no programs on it. I downloaded Canon's free utility, and that
let me spot check the video of the files I copied over......but you couldn't listen to the audio.
I tried CS6 and thought it would do the trick, but surprisingly I couldn't view the files.
Finally, I tried FCP X and it worked. Not sure why, I thought maybe I hadn't updated
CS6 to its newest state but after the show, totally forgot to check. Anyways maybe
I should have said 'FCP X will handle pretty much everything CC will natively' as there
may be an exception. FCP 7 on the other hand, means you have to transcode many
formats to ProRes.

Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.
 

Yes FCPx still needs a plugin for Canon MXF files.