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-   -   Help ! Mic Recommendation! (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/all-things-audio/20045-help-mic-recommendation.html)

Neil Kissoon January 19th, 2004 09:23 AM

Help ! Mic Recommendation!
Hey guys, I've been reading up on threads, I was certain I was going to buy a me66 for my boom mic, but after reading some of the posts, I'm now uncertain, even with shot gun mics for indoors. I'm doing a narritaive short film... Like I said I was going to use the me66 boom for the dialouge. 90 percent of it is indoors... Should I scrap the boom all together and use lavs... so confused... I'm looking to spend no more than 300 us... need help please

Douglas Spotted Eagle January 19th, 2004 10:28 AM

Boom/shotguns should always be a near last resort, particularly for interviews. They look sexy, and always require post-audio work no matter what. Usually minor, but never just right.
Lavs that are wired become first choice for interviews, wireless second, boom/shotgun with operator third, hand held fourth, boundary or PZM next, and then on-camera mic. On camera mics are a travesty.
For a budget buy, it's really hard to beat the little AT830 series. We've used them on films like Last Samurai, U-Boat 571, and all of our documentaries. About 30.00 used, and 120.00 new, phantom, bass rolloff, and other features. Wireless will start about 500 for a good system, 1K for a very good system.
If you buy an ME66 for 300.00 don't forget you need a pre, too. Look at the AT 897 if that's the route you end up going. Sennheiser is a great mic too, but overrated, IMO, because of their name.

Neil Kissoon January 19th, 2004 10:54 AM

Thanks DSE, you've set it up pretty clear for me...

Jay Massengill January 19th, 2004 11:09 AM

I agree with DSE in theory, but Neil said "Narrative short film" with 90% interiors.
In that context, I'd be more likely to recommend a boom with a high quality hypercardioid. This is likely to give a much more natural sound with minimal post and no worry about hiding lavs on all the actors.
Neil, you didn't mention what camera and other sound gear you'll be using. Will you have phantom power available?
Give more details about the film (pace, style, max. number of actors at one time, crew you have, etc.)

Martin Garrison January 19th, 2004 11:22 AM

Douglas Spotted Eagle,

You worked on last Samurai? Thats cool.

Any experience with the 830R, it seems like a great deal. I've always used omni lavs, and don't have any experience using cardioid lavs, any advice on placement.

I've really enoyed your posts here.


Neil Kissoon January 19th, 2004 11:29 AM

Hey Jay...

It's a b/w film noir... indoors of course (most of the dialouge is indoors, very little outside) For the first short, max number of actors is 2 in a scene, dvx100 w/phantom, fast paced, cutty-cutty... Crew not sure, but I can wrangle a good number... I'm using vegas w/sound forge eventually, let me know if you need anything else whta would help, Jay. As far as audio, just the built in mic on the camera... which I won't be using....

Jay Massengill January 19th, 2004 03:14 PM

Well at least you have a good start with the DVX-100.
With the info you've given, I'm sticking with my recommendation of a hypercardioid on a boom. There are 3 mics that will fit your budget and would work in this situation.
A properly QC'd Oktava MC012 with a hypercardioid capsule, an AudioTechnica AT873r or a Rode NT3.
Normally the Rode is too heavy to be considered for booming, but your situation would lend itself to static booming. When shooting film-style in a fixed interior location, having the boom mounted on a stand makes editing the cuts much easier because the sound doesn't change much even after hours of different camera angles.
Both the Oktava and the AT are much smaller and lighter, but they are more expensive and a little harder to find good vendors for. You'll need to decide if the mobile and outdoor shooting that you will do make it necessary to avoid the Rode. It's a great sounding low-noise mic for very low cost, but it's built like a tank.
Don't forget you'll need to budget for a boom pole and a shockmount. The AT8415 is a very good value shockmount at $50. Check other recent threads for more info on shockmounts.
A real boom pole minimum cost is about $85. You can make do with a painter pole for less, but it's a hassle.
If you do go with a static setup rather than a live person, you'll need a suitable light stand and a clamp or boom holder. See other recent threads. Some small sandbags will also be needed.
Lastly, good cables, a headphone booster and 2 sets of good headphones are a must.
With all that, you're closer to $450-$500 for overall budget. However that's really the minimum that I'd want to try and get good dialog with. If you're going to the effort of shooting a movie, it will be well worth it.

Douglas Spotted Eagle January 19th, 2004 05:47 PM

Just to clarify, I didn't do any location on "Samurai," all my work was studio work. Most of the flashback scenes that Algren suffers are of him being part of the murder of a Native village. The war cries, echo flutes, drums, and other related sounds were done at our place or in CT at Moose.
Hyper on a boom would work well, just be sure to have a solid stand and shock mount as mentioned above.

Regarding the 830R series, these things are monsters for what they are. A mid to lo-end mic that has a fixed cable, and comes with the low end wirelesses. The PBS film that won the Berlin Film Fest for us a couple years back was recorded with these, more out of experimenting, since we actually produced this film out of a private project that went south for the person paying for it. (it was supposed to be an archiving of a person's flute collection)
So, for the cost, it's a GREAT mic. Be sure to use the stick on windscreen though.

You will hear and appreciate a more expensive mic if you ever have the chance to use one though....

Mike Rehmus January 19th, 2004 10:32 PM

I continue to have very good luck with a Shure SM81C on a boom or hand-held (Lightwave Systems shock-mount) and on-camera when running and gunning (literally).

Sounds good (to me) and takes overpressure very gracefully. Small and light too.

But it is about $360 or so at discount.

I rarely use a shotgun if I can at all avoid it.

Ken Tanaka January 19th, 2004 10:47 PM

I can add little to the top-grade recommendations already offered.

But, not to confuse matters further, I would recommend considering the possibility of using a dual mic arrangement. That is, use a boom/shotgun as well as a lav. Since you indicated that gathering a crew will be easy, you may be able to recruit a decent boom operator, too. This will offer you some mixing and repair options in post that a single mic configuration would not.

Good luck with your production!

Neil Kissoon January 20th, 2004 08:27 AM

Thanks for all the generous input guys...

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