Hello.

I bought an SONY FX-7, made my first try and edit on PREMIERE CS3. I made an video using HDV source and i got a high quality mpeg2 1440x1080 file. Now i want a mpeg2 dvd 720x480 file but i cant have it. I tryed to export directly to encore dvd but the image got worse.

I´m using adobe media export and trying to export with DVD, but the image is not so great.. Its like an low quality preview with can be seen in lines etc...(see example)

Overall the image its good but this is buggin me... How can i export a high quality dvd standart file?

Thank You

The example.
http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/7/dvihs0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

This will frighten you... but a quick way I've found is to drop an m2t directly into Nero. It's a consumer product, but the downres I found to be MUCH better than Premiere/AME.

Carl

That's exactly what I do. Glad to see I'm not the only one...

This will frighten you... but a quick way I've found is to drop an m2t directly into Nero. It's a consumer product, but the downres I found to be MUCH better than Premiere/AME.

Carl

I render to mpeg 1440x1080 and import on nero and let him convert to dvd ntsc?? I will try

If you have AfterEffects, that will work well too, but might take a bit longer. After Effects will also correctly re-render interlacing when going from 1080i to 480i, which should significantly improve the quality of interlaced clips.
Ensure your HDV clip is interpreted as upper field first (CTRL+F) and then Set Field Renderer to Lower Field First in the render que settings.

This will frighten you... but a quick way I've found is to drop an m2t directly into Nero. It's a consumer product, but the downres I found to be MUCH better than Premiere/AME.

Carl

I imported on NERO and he gave me high quality file.. Great!!

the next challenge is do the same with Blackmagic intensity pro MJPEG video...


Thank you all for help me...

I imported on NERO and he gave me high quality file.. Great!!

the next challenge is do the same with Blackmagic intensity pro MJPEG video...


Thank you all for help me...

Freaky, isn't it? :) If I remember right, under advanced settings there's some basic tweaks you can possibly do, make sure it's 2 pass VBR, etc, to really get the best quality. But all in all, Nero amazed me with the fact it performs a downconvert to SD in the same time as Premiere, and with such a quality improvement. Adobe needs to talk to Nero and find out why they're so much better at something that Premiere should really excel at.

Carl

Note:
Don't use adobe media export with DVD. Only export with correct setting mpg2 file or m2t. Bring direct into Encore and let encore do the job.

Note:
Don't use adobe media export with DVD. Only export with correct setting mpg2 file or m2t. Bring direct into Encore and let encore do the job.

Before tryed to export my HDV timeline to dvd using adobe media export, i tryed send directly to Adobe Encore DVD CS3, but the results was worse...

[]´s

Like Mike, I use After Effects and get fantastic results. I load a clip into a HDV comp and then drop that comp into a DV comp and scale it to 45%. I render the DV comp out to an intermediate lossless codec and use Encore to encode to MPEG2. Although it takes extra time and intermediate disk space, the results are clearly superior to any other method I've tried. The SD footage really looks like it came from a higher res source.

I'm not sure why Adobe can't put the same scaling code in Premiere that they have in After Effects. Inspite of Adobe claims of improved quality, it still seems that the last place you want to down-rez HDV footage is in the Adobe Media Encoder. But even when I've tried frame-serving from Premiere to other encoders, the results have not been satisfactory for me.

-Dan

Dan, there are two things you can do to speed up that workflow. Instead of making an HDV comp, import the footage directly into the DV size comp and scale to 45%. It will save one step in each frame render, especially if you are interlacing the output. Also, saving directly to MPEG2 in AE has few disadvantages. You can't do 2-Pass VBR, but I have done many tests and seen no significant improvement in 2 Pass. I used to do everything in 2 pass, blindly accepting that it MUST be better, but on closer examiniation, I have not found that to be true. Your uncompressed intermediate file to Encore will have no loss of quality, but the total processing time will be a bit longer.

Hi Mike,
Thanks for the suggestions. I'll try what you suggest about going directly to the DV-scaled comp. It's my interpretation of the AE documentation that scaling from one comp to another is what triggers the sub-pixel math that makes the results so nice but it sounds like it's not necessary. Setting up the HDV comp itself takes about a second.

I agree with you about the 2-pass VBR. Maybe it's just a characteristic of the Mainconcept encoder but I've never been able to see any real improvement by doing the extra pass. I also agree that doing the intermediate file between AE and Encore adds time but I do like how Encore will adjust things to fit on the media. Unlike Premiere Pro, at least these two apps understand the concept of a processing queue.
-Dan

The time savings isn't about how long it takes to create the HDV comp. The render will take much longer as well. Try one clip your way and again my way, there will usually be a measurable difference in processing time. With an HDV comp, AE renders that HDV frame internally, and then renders the DV comp from that rendered frame, as a two step process. In the preferences, try turning on Display render status in the info pane. It will give you an idea as to what parts of the process are taking CPU time.

Like Mike, I use After Effects and get fantastic results. I load a clip into a HDV comp and then drop that comp into a DV comp and scale it to 45%. I render the DV comp out to an intermediate lossless codec and use Encore to encode to MPEG2. Although it takes extra time and intermediate disk space, the results are clearly superior to any other method I've tried. The SD footage really looks like it came from a higher res source.



I am interested in trying this. So if i understand correctlly, Should you render an HD project in Premiere, out to 1440x1080. Then import that into AE in a DV comp and scale down to 45%. And from here render from AE to 480,standard def, ???

Thanks in advance. This is something i am looking for

Hello All,

What verisions of Nero are you using that you obtain such quality outputs. I too am experiancing issue with quality lose through PPro 2.0.

Thanks!

I'm using the Nero 6 Suite.... came with my computer. :D

I am interested in trying this. So if i understand correctlly, Should you render an HD project in Premiere, out to 1440x1080. Then import that into AE in a DV comp and scale down to 45%. And from here render from AE to 480,standard def, ???

A bit late on this, I know.

FWIW, you don't have to render an intermediate out of PPro. You can import the Premiere file into AE and skip that render and potential generation loss. That is, assuming you have CS3. AE versions prior to CS3 didn't work so well with the long-GOP stuff.

HTH,
Brian Brown
BrownCow Productions

A bit late on this, I know.

FWIW, you don't have to render an intermediate out of PPro. You can import the Premiere file into AE and skip that render and potential generation loss. That is, assuming you have CS3. AE versions prior to CS3 didn't work so well with the long-GOP stuff.

HTH,
Brian Brown
BrownCow Productions

Be advised that many Premiere features do not transfer over when you import a Premiere project into AE. Things like titles, synthetic elements, and effects, can all cause issues. Check your project carefully after you import it to AE, or QC your file after export, but don't necessarily EXPECT it to work fine. Also, the render out of Premiere Pro shouldn't be in the HDV codec. Anything including uncompressed would be better than that, in case that wasn't obvious.

hey guys,
just tackling this at the moment myself.
Apart from the audio sync issues associated with the hdv project in premiere pro 2 this seems to be the only other significant issue with editing hdv.
Mike, thanks for the advise, Could you be a bit more specific as to what filetype & how i should be outputting the hdv project prom pp2. you say it shouln't be in the hdv codec, even uncompressed would do. surely this filesize would be huge, no? what alternative options are there?

I use Cineform for things like that, or Matrox's codecs since I have access to an AXIO. HD MPEG would work directly out of stock PremierePro, as would free codecs like HuffYUV, which is about half the size of Uncompressed.

I imported on NERO and he gave me high quality file.. Great!!

the next challenge is do the same with Blackmagic intensity pro MJPEG video...


Thank you all for help me...

Usa CF, vale a pena... (Use CF, it's worth it!)

Dan, there are two things you can do to speed up that workflow. Instead of making an HDV comp, import the footage directly into the DV size comp and scale to 45%. It will save one step in each frame render, especially if you are interlacing the output. Also, saving directly to MPEG2 in AE has few disadvantages. You can't do 2-Pass VBR, but I have done many tests and seen no significant improvement in 2 Pass. I used to do everything in 2 pass, blindly accepting that it MUST be better, but on closer examiniation, I have not found that to be true. Your uncompressed intermediate file to Encore will have no loss of quality, but the total processing time will be a bit longer.

Mike,
The AE help file says the following methods:
Nest the composition Create a new composition at the smaller dimensions, and nest the large composition inside it. For example, if you create a 640 x 480 composition, place it in a 320 x 240 composition. Use the Fit To Comp command to scale the composition to fit the new smaller composition size: Press Ctrl+Alt+F (Windows) or Command+Option+F (Mac OS), and then collapse transformations by choosing Layer > Switches > Collapse. The resulting composition rendered at full resolution and best quality will have excellent image quality, better than if you had rendered using a reduced resolution.

Stretch the composition This method produces the highest quality reduced-size movie but is slower than nesting. For example, if you create a 640 x 480 composition and render it at full resolution, you can set the stretch value in the Output Module Settings dialog box to 50% to create a 320 x 240 movie. For a composition rendered at full resolution, the image quality is excellent when the Stretch Quality is set to High.
Note: Do not use stretching to change the vertical dimensions of a movie when field rendering is on. Stretching vertically mixes the field order, which distorts motion. Use either cropping or composition nesting if you need to vertically resize a field-rendered movie.

The nested composition is what Dan Wilder was recommending. I'm confused about the note on when not to use the Stretch Composition method because I'm not sure what field rendering is.

Mike, do you have any comments on these two methods?

In creating the MPEG2 file, what "quality" (Premiere defaults to 3, AE to 4) and what data rate settings do you use?

My first experiment with AE was to create a DV composition, import my 'uncompressed' rendered premiere file. Drop it into the DV composition and set the scaling to 34% (puts black bars across top and bottom). I wasn't too happy with the image quality, so now I've added a 'sharpening' filter set at 20. Does anyone else use a sharpening filter?

Dave