We've been commissioned to produce a film where one location happens to be in the deserts of the Middle East.

Temperatures can reach over 40 degrees as we all know.

Anyone have any experience of using an HD200e in such temperatures? One positive side is that humidity is low!

Other obvious considerations are sand and dust ingress into the camera. As I'm well aware most of the body armour available for this camera is very poor. I found the new Portabrace to be badly fitting and the KATA, whilst the better of the two, won't protect it from dust and rain! Any suggestions?

Cheers
Stu

I have been shooting at speedways in aus. Very dusty environment. As the cars come round everything is sprayed with mud and crap. I used a rain cover instead of body armour which proved to be pretty good.

Rob

which rain cover did you use Robert?

Well first up I rigged up my own using a large industrial transparent plastic bag which I gaffered together! It was a bit of an emergency situation. It worked very well and had enough room for me to get in underneath it.

However, I have now bought a Petrol bag from B & H. Very cheap but does the job. You might need something more heavy duty for the extreme conditions you will be in.

Rob

Hi Stuart

I'm just back from a three week shoot in the Sahara, in Niger. We were working regularly in direct sunlight in the middle of the day when it was 44 degrees in the shade, according to thermometers on the vehicles. My little backpack thermometer stops at 50 degrees C, and it was on the stop for hours on end.

I was shooting to tape, on a HD 111 (the Euro version of the HD 110), using Swit 8080 batteries. The camera had no problems at all with the heat. After one particularly dusty day I had a couple of tape hits, but I ran a JVC head cleaner tape and had no more problems with that. I'm sure you will check tape at the end of each day to monitor for that kind of problem.

Two things to watch out for though: In my experience drivers in the Middle East run their vehicles' aircon at "max plus ten percent". If it's 17 C inside the car, and 50 + outside, your camera will complain. Try to keep the temp inside the vehicles at something closer to the exterior temp, and maybe switch off AC and open the windows ten minutes before you get to a location. That will help you, your crew AND the camera acclimatize.

A plastic bag's a good fall back for dust protection, but again, if there's a temperature differential between inside vehicle, or hotel, or whatever, and your exterior shooting environment, you might well get condensation forming inside the bag. Be careful not to seal your camera into the bag too assiduously.

Most of the risk of dust and sand to getting into the camera, will be when changing tapes. (If you are shooting tape). I would suggest you brush and blow off the area round the tape door before you eject a tape.

And don't be tempted to use "canned air" type dust removers in dry, hot climates. I've had problems with those (in Iraq) forming excessive condensation - again because of the temperature differential between the extreme cold of the gas coming out of the can and the high ambient heat.

Enjoy the shoot!

Have you looked for an underwater housing? These provide absolute protection, altho', heat venting would be a problem.

Hi Robert

Thanks for the advice, all good stuff. Good to hear the 111e coped well under the circumstances. I've used our 200e in -18c and it coped fine. Seems it may be a touch little camera after all. Did you not use any covers at all whilst filming?

I'll be taking usual precautions as regards going cold to hot (had tonnes of breakdowns in that department before) but for anyone else reading Roberts advice on 'acclimatising' the camera, it's essential!

I'll probably bung on the KATA body armour but I'd really like a sensible rain cover in case of dust storm. I had a camera completely break down in Chile once due to a dust storm. The lens was completely buggered. All focusing and zooming mega broken! Cost a fortune to get repaired! That's interesting to know the air in a can can cause problems of it's own. I was thinking of taking a couple!

Bill, a water housing did spring to mind, but I foresee the camera cooking in it as most of them are effectively perspex greenhouses! Given lower temperatures it would be a good idea.

Thanks (still searching for that ultimate rain cover)

Hi Stuart - we did get taken by surprise one time entering a series of mountain caves in the Dead Sea area where you could not see any dust whatsoever, but it hit your lungs very quickly, the camera immediately gave a head clogging warning and took some sorting (An old Panasonic). In Egypt down near Luxor you could see the fine sand in the air at night as it passed the lighting.

Last year we used a JVC101E in a very nasty industrial set up within a large Iron Ore Silo, the camera was lowered in on a crane through a gap in the top cover, and controlled remotely - all we did to protect the camera was put it into a see through polythene bag and sealed it with a skylight filter on the lens. When the camera was finally removed, the bag cover was completely covered in fine Iron Ore dust - you could not see the camera. On removal the camera was perfect with no condensation (in this case) and the resulting footage was fantastic, so much so that it helped to secure a major international contract for that client. We had also placed 4 Dedo Lights at key points within the Silo and when they were removed they needed totally stripped down and left to soak in a detergent.

JVC Highway wanted to run a story on it but we could not get clearance for the pictures to be published.

Regards: Stu
www.studioscotland.com

In Egypt 4 weeks ago with a HD-110 and IDX battery pack. No problems
at all, although the heat wasn't as bad as previous posts reported (35C max). The usual dust protection (lens filter, etc.) were sufficient, and the camera peformed beautifully. The suggestions about condensation were very good (air conditioned vehicles & buildings and caves can fog up your whole day).
Ed

I don't know what part of the Middle East you are going to but there's no guarantee about dry heat. Parts of the ME can be extremely humid and temperatures can go way beyond 40C.

It sounds like you're taking the proper precautions though, just make sure you build in enough time into the schedule to allow for acclimatizing the camera and don't forget a hat!

Stuart

I didn't use covers because I reckon the risk of damaging the camera - or at least causing a malfunction - by overheating because of an extra layer of insulation is probably greater than the risk of dust getting in - especially as neither the Portabrace nor the Kata covers seem to provide much protection against dust anyway.

R

That is a good point Robert. My main concern is the lens really. Dust, grit and sand getting in between the parts is bad news.

It seems then that we have uncovered a gap in the market! Anyone out there fancy developing a desert climate camera cover? It has to resist heat, dust and sand!

I reckon I'll just take KATA body armour, a good shade umbrella and some fine paint brushes for brushing off any dust and sand when changing tapes as you recommend. It's probably good practice to do the same with any battery change or lens change. (although I think I'll avoid lens changing outside.

Robert, it must certainly be an interesting time for you in Zimbabwe right now to say the least! I'm watching the reports from undercover BBC reporters with great interest.

It would, actually, be quite simple to modify an underwater housing to include air cooling. It would require 12v DC battery power to drive the thermoelectric coolers, of course of this variety...
http://www.tetech.com/?gclid=CKX_9cjExJICFQ8EIwodK2rKYg

I've used these, in the past, and they work very well, if sized for the heat load from the camera. Since the cooled air is not circulated outside of the camera housing, no air filtration is needed.

in the outback and rural areas of Western Australia, especially when you combine horses, cattle and motocross things get real dusty, no probs, and no protection, but I shoot as smart as I can, for example, if the dust is caused by something, move up wind, stay out of it's way, unless the shot really calls for it.
I bought a cheap rainjacket from www.globalmediapro.com. It cost me $70, but I can't use it with a mattebox, there's a solid ring on the front which interfere's so I'll have to remove it somehow to make it useable. I would be also concerned about using it in middle of the day heat. (I use the 251)

Regards

Adam

Shot for three weeks in the Tamil Nadu region of India in 40+ degree heat. Biggest issue was indeed moving from A/C to hot AND humid. This was with a Sony Z1U about three years ago. Let the camera acclimatize before shooting.

Yes indeed Stuart, these are interesting times in Zim. We're hoping that we can make it through to the run off, whenever it may be, and kick the old man out once and for all. It's a tough TV story though - there's just not much picture to get, and the authorities are getting a little tricky to work around.

Back on topic: I see from the repair manual for the 111 that the primary heat sink seems to be in the handle. I have to say I've never tried to analyse the heat output from different parts of the camera, so I can't say if that is the only heat sink. But it does suggest that in hot operating conditions, covering the handle would be a bad idea. It might also mean you could get away with putting other protection around the main body of the camera, so long as the handle was not covered.

Dust, sand, grit and lenses definitely don't work together. A colleague was in Afghanistan last year on a two week embed in Helmand. He took a brand new Z1, and junked it when he got back - every moving part was trashed.

Some good stories here which tell me the gyHDs are tough little pro sumer jobbies! Hope these aren't famous last words! Good to hear they've been to some interesting places.

I've only ever used a 300ap beta camcorder in these sort of places when doing military stuff. That was one hell of of rugged camera, but again, it was only ever the lens that suffered if at all. Focusing was a grindy affair for years after that!

Robert, the heat sink location is interesting to know, where did you see that?? I'll certainly give that some thought. Mind you, it sounds like the camera can cope OK in high temps. I'll have a look and see if there is any 'official' JVC line on maximum operating temperature. I've read their UK article on sending the camera to Antarctica where it performed without problem...slightly different I know!

It seems to me there's a fairly high interest in an electronic cooling solution. If anyone finds any heat rejection data for a camera, I'd be happy to select a TEC cooler solution. These coolers work like those cheap beer coolers you plug into your cigarette lighter in your car.

I do like your idea Bill, but my only concerns would be,

How bulky would this unit be?
Would the cooler only end up reducing the additional heat created from the camera being in a box, therefore you end up with no benefit?
How noisy would it be?
Could you still use an on camera mic somehow?
What sort of power source would you need and battery duration?
Would you have enough room to stick on a 35mm adaptor and primes, matte box, rails etc?
Would it fit onto a tripod, as a camera under water would have no need for a tripod...

Questions questions questions!

If none of these questions proves to be a problem Bill, any chance you could get your prototype to me by mid May and I'll gladly test it out for you in a Middle Eastern desert all day long for a couple of weeks.

Now there's a challenge!

Now I do agree there could be some serious demand for a decent cooling / dust and sand protecting system.

I do like your idea Bill, but my only concerns would be,

How bulky would this unit be?

hard to tell until we know the heat load. these coolers are fairly small.

Would the cooler only end up reducing the additional heat created from the camera being in a box, therefore you end up with no benefit?

the cooler would need to be sized with some margin to account for the things like the sun heating the black camera body.

How noisy would it be?

hmmm...good point. depends on whether a fan would be needed or not...again, how much heat are we trying to exhaust?

Could you still use an on camera mic somehow?

no, you'd need to port the mike outside the box

What sort of power source would you need and battery duration?

12v power. depends on whether a fan is needed. fans are BIG power eaters.....maybe a 12v lead acid type battery


Would you have enough room to stick on a 35mm adaptor and primes, matte box, rails etc?

you'd probably need to build your own box...not that hard, I suppose.

Would it fit onto a tripod, as a camera under water would have no need for a tripod...

would need a hefty tripod.

Questions questions questions!

If none of these questions proves to be a problem Bill, any chance you could get your prototype to me by mid May and I'll gladly test it out for you in a Middle Eastern desert all day long for a couple of weeks.


LOL.....not likely as I'll be in Film Editor's school 'til august.

Now there's a challenge!

But, there sure seems to be a need.

Now I do agree there could be some serious demand for a decent cooling / dust and sand protecting system.

see answers embedded in quote

Stuart

The JVC sales brochure for the HD110E/HD111E says the Operating temps are 0 deg C to 40 Deg C; storage -20 to +60. Humidity limits are 30% - 80 % operating, storage 85% max.

I'd guess (from my experience and that of others on this thread) that those are conservative.

Here's a grab from the HD111E repair manual that shows how to detach the heat sink from the handle.