Does anyone make a tiny digital recorder that records on EITHER compact flash, memory stick, micro drive, etc. ?

Im looking for one as small as possible. At least as small as a IPod.

The idea is to use something like this with a wireless transmiter to make sure I always get good audio. I plan on spliting the signal from the lav to both the tranmitter and the digital recorder. But for it to make sense it needs to be battery powered and tiny. If not maybe theres a better way to do this.

You might want to research the Sony mini-disc (the new hi-MD ones) and the iRiver. The first has really good electronics and is pretty small, but you may have difficulty getting sound off it because Sony implement anti-music recording/copying schemes. The iRiver can record uncompressed or mp3 audio, but its electronics probably suck and you could attach an A-D convertor to it and use the digital input on it (adds to size and complexity).

I haven't used either (except for mini-disc) so I can't help much here. With mini-disc you can play the MD and record through a digital/analog output. The analog output can be good enough for quality depending on how picky you want to be and your audience.

2- Budget?

3- What wireless lav do you already have? A better set may or may not be a better idea?

I have a mid level Sennheiser wireless system. I've hear competing signals once in a long while but thankfully it never happened when we were shooting. Never the less in one take only shoots I need a for sure thing.

The mini discs recorders are small but not quite small enough. When your planing on straping it to a transmitter as well and putting it on the talent every inch counts.

So when searching for a solution the first thing I popped in my head was all though tiny consumer compact flash, memory stick MP3 players on the market. Does anyone make something like that but will record a signal from a incoming mic? Seems like its the only way to make sure I have good audio for my edit later on.

Can someone help me with this issue?

small
http://www.edirol.com/press/html/2004/092704_r1_pr.html
bigger
http://www.audiocubes.com/product_info.php?products_id=1029
exotic
http://www.core-sound.com/pdaudio-cf.html

else you can use any mp3 player with record functiunality.
The problem being that these gadget usually have only line input and/or integrated mic, so no mic level input.
You could tweak one, by removing the internal electret mic and adding a minijack plug instead. this should allow you to plug an external mic.

You should consider the iRiver...pretty amazing little gadget about the size of a big tube of lipstick. A few weeks ago I used one (IF-790) with a cheap little $20 axden lav mic to place on a officiant during a outdoor wedding. What was unique about that day was the approach of Hurricane Francis...we were in the very outer wind bands at the time of the wedding...15-20 mph typical winds. I was a little nervous about the quality until I listened to it the first time after dropping it into Vegas...WOW...


http://www.iriveramerica.com/products/flash.aspx

As the model you mentionned (IF-790) seems to have a line-in plug and no mic-in , how have you connected your mic to the mp3 recorder, or what kind of output you lav mic was delivering ?

If your asking if it has a seperate line-in and mic-in input jack ...no...but the line-in/mic-in input is firmware selectable.....

Here is the link to the mic I was using....
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=89741&is=REG

when you say firmware selectable, this means accessing with a menu, button, or flashing a new firmaware into the player ?

The iriver 595T is really small and has a mic-in plug, but runs on its own battery. I am looking for device that runs on standard AA or AAA.
The iriver 12o and 140 have a mic plug too, but runs with harddisk. too expensive and breakable.

you can check herehttp://www.neurosaudio.com/store/prod_preampSpec.asp
for a mic to line level amplifier. it is small but as big as the mp3 recorder and as expensive too.

Yes..simple menu button...The 700 series are catching on in the wedding video industry...runs on one AA battery....

thanks for the info, i will go for the 799 model (1gig of memory)

Mark, when switched to the "line-in" position does it accept a signal from a mixer or sound system "line-out" without distortion?

I would would think that is the reason for the distinction between the two settings, that the mic would be preamplified but the line in would accept the, (I believe) one volt signal from the usual line out.

It would be great to be able to plug this into the DJ's mixer. No muss. No fuss.

I'm assuming it would...haven't configured it for that process yet (have another recorder for any line-level recording)

Mark, i saw in iRiver's site for that model (790) that it comes w/ a USB cable-- is that how you xfer the recordings to the PC for use in Vegas?

If so, what's the file type (wav, mp3 etc) once recordings are uploaded?

Looks very interesting for a variety of applications

Thanks,

MRP

Yes...but the file has to be converted in the supplied iRiver software before importing into Vegas...it adds about a minute or so to the process :-)

Great info! Can you guys think of any problems I might have by chosing to add a y-adapter (or y-cable) coming off the lav and into both the iRiver AND my wireless transmitter body pack?

For thoughs scratching their heads why I would do all that:
You get the best of both worlds. I would use the iRiver as a backup source to record a signal because its sure not to have any interferance issues competing signals. And the wireless transmitter as the first source because (unlike the iRiver) I can monitor the levels remotely and dont have to sync up the sound later.

So can this be done or will I NEED some type of miniture signal booster or D/A to split the signal like this?

Thanks for everyones help.

<<<-- Originally posted by Brett Erskine : I would use the iRiver as a backup source to record a signal because its sure not to have any interferance issues competing signals. And the wireless transmitter as the first source because (unlike the iRiver) I can monitor the levels remotely and dont have to sync up the sound later. -->>>

good question Brett. I just recently bought the 790 and was planning to use it as as backup on the groom. Save the cost of another mic too! Hope we get some answers.

Just bumping this up in hopes someone can offer a solution to our last unanswered question:

"Will I NEED some type of miniture signal booster or D/A to split the signal from the lav to the iRiver and the Transmitter?"

Normally you should NOT split a mic .I believe the voltage and impedence changes would adversly affect both recordings.Just use a second mic , there not that expensive (check out the one Mark suggests)and besides if your using the iriver as a backup and the one of the mics fail your defeating your purpose.
smitty

I hear ya but I'm running a lav here so I dont want TWO hanging off the talent looking even more obstrusive.

would the iriver work as a 2nd mic at an indoor concert (bar band)? I just did my 1st trial but only had 1 input from the bar's sound board. Not horrible, but flat. Would the iriver give me the 2nd "live" sound that I'm looking for? thanx for any help. lazlo

Sean,
What physical connectors did you use from the bands mixer board? Did you go from line out into the iriver? Did you use RCA jacks or XLR jacks into an 1/8th" jack that plugs into the iriver?

I am trying to get a definite answer on whether this can be done. I would hope that there was a built in attenuator or resistor in the iriver for when the software switched it to that mode and that there would be no distortion. Cold and dry I would expect, lacking room noise or added echo/reverb but distortion would not be acceptable.

To me this would be just perfect to plug into the mixer at a church for the vows and would catch any other microphone used by church singers etc. That is, if it works cleanly using "line in" input.

I don't have an iriver, yet. I plugged an RCA to 1/8 mini jack on the camera from the board, but it sounds flat. I duplicated the audio track in post which made it sound better, but still not acceptable. I need a 2nd track to make the "live sound" more prevalent (spelling?). I will be going to different locations so I need something versatile that I can put in different spots. I think I'm gonna try the Iriver.