Ahh of course Chris. He's using the 16:9 aspect guide bars so the lines along the bottom aren't a problem...Silly me!

They still haven't seem to fixed that image problem on that
site... duh

Chris W. --

belated congrats on your documentary; sorry I didn't know about the screening here in DC (just today looking into Chris H.'s fine bevy of forums here).

cheers,
d.i.

Angel --

I'd like to look at your trailer -- the project sounds interesting. When I go to the web page for the trailer --
http://www.paganiniblues.com/tring.html
I get choice of 3 resolutions, but none of them are working for me. I have Windows Media Player, and there's a viewer present, and it indicates the brief, quick start of a download, but then it says done and nothing has been seen or heard. Is the trailer still available, or available in some other form?

Looking forward to seeing what you're doing, if poss...

d.i.

hi david, i think you must have quick time 5 to see the clips.
hope this help.

angel

Angel,
cool website, and your movie looks great, would love to see it when it comes out. Glad to have found another person into dv from the same area, I'm from El Chuco, but right now out here in japan. Seeing the shot in your trailer at Scenic Drive was nice, brought back memories. Haven't been back to ELP in 4 years, but the next time I go back(later this year or early next year) I'll let you know, would be good to hook up and shoot something. buena suerte con tu video.

hey rik, what do you do tan lejos?
oye dejame aclararte que yo no dirijo el documental, solo hice una parte de la fotografia, todo lo que lleva glidecam, grua y dolly, ademas de otras tomas, pero como mi ingles es muy malo, creo que no lo explique bien en my primer post.
ahora estoy por terminar un documental mio, y espero pronto tener la pagina web para subir el trailer.
saludos desde juarez, y cuando andes por aca avisa.

Angel,
estuve aqui 12 anos pasados para visitar un amigo y me gusto mucho a Japon y ya tengo 11 anos aqui. Nunca escribo en espanol, pardona me pasi no escribo bien. Mi esposa es Japonesa and hablamos en ingles, pero cuando hablo en espanol, es como 60% espanol y 40% japones y aqui casi no hablo en espanol. Todos mis amigos son Americanos, Australianos, Japoneses.

Cuando tienes tu documental terminado, yo y tambien todos las personas en este dv groupo, querremos mirarlo. Este groupo es el mas chingon DV groupo, todos las personas con que ha escribo son buena gente y el jefe, Chris, el ha hecho un cosa muy internacional, ya puedo habla con personas de differentes paises que estan en DV como yo.(Translation: Chris! You the man!)

mucho gusto a conocerte,
saludos desde Osaka

Just sold some footage of a fire (nothing that truly exciting) to local news. Obviously they loved it compared to normal footage by "bystanders."

Can't wait to see how it looks cut with their 2/3" cams!!!!!

Anybody know what a fair price is?

And what if it's "excusive" use? They've got to be a bit different, right?

Of course if it were some real news, or really good footage it could go higher, but any guidelines?

Just seems that after I do my laundry to get the smoke out (let alone my lungs), I'm not getting much!

If you didn't make a lot of money, at least you made a connection with the news people. Who knows, maybe next time you will get some more good footage of something else and at least now you will know someone to call up and offer to sell the footage to.

BTW, I wonder how much money the people made from selling their footage of the WTC, the shot of the plane going into the tower. Maybe they didn't sell it but instead gave over the footage as evidence. Anyone know the story behind those shooters?

Don't know if it's true but while talking about it someone told me it's best to make a copy of the footage in case the police try to claim it as evidence, then you can't sell the footage. I don't know how situations like this are handled, maybe you can ask the news people what the going rates are and about handing over the footage to the police.

The first WTC hit was recorded by the Naudet brothers with a PD150. They were the ones doing the Fire Dept. training video on the street that morning. These are the French guys who went on to do that heavy CBS 9/11 documentary from a couple months ago, which DeNiro introduces. I have it recorded, but have yet to bring myself to watch it. The Naudets recovered expenses only and donated all other proceeds to charity.

The second WTC hit was recorded by various news agencies, all from more or less the same vantage point from another building rooftop, the CNN version being the most well known. There was one angle looking up from street level, to my eye it was the most distressing shot to watch of all. It was recorded by a doctor using a single-chip DV camcorder, possibly a Sony. This video made the rounds on all the agencies, and CNN and Fox showed more of his subsequent recordings in an interview with him during the days shortly after. I do not know if he was compensated or not.

Personally I often wrestle with the moral delimma of catching tragic events on tape. Surely they are news-worthy but accepting money for them is something I have to think about privately. I guess if there were no loss of human life, I could take the money. Anything involving a fatality however I would be most reluctant. Some news stringers out there make their bread and butter shooting this type of video on a daily basis.

Anybody else catch the series "African Tightspots" on the Travel Channel? Quite a bit of XL1 or XL1S material in that show, with the camera itself appearing on screen fairly often.

my documentary will be finished in july, i hope next month the webpage is online to put the trailer.
as you said this is a great forum to exchange ideas with other dv filmmakers in the world, sadly my english is too bad, so i dont participate too much, but i ever read the post.

saludos desde juarez.
angel

I know what you're saying about the morality dilema. I chose not to shoot a clip of the co's truck by the fire. I know it would have been an exclusive shot and probably used. I knew there was construction at the site and assumed they were probably involved (which it sounds like a heat gun was being used). I sort of kick myself for not shooting it, but also feel good for not slamming them. It was newsworthy, but not necessary.

So I can see how our editorializing (sp?) can have impact. Even worse, that I should shoot it all and let the real editors have that final say which I may regret.


PS I admit to being and indoor shooter and after looking at my (outdoor) footage in my NLE, it was about the poorest footage ever. Handheld (thank God for steadyshot), blown highlights (good shadows). What the heck was I thinking at the time!!!!! Still it held up. They had some OK footage from another angle, but mine was way better (image quality) than the sky cam which was used a lot.

They edited like crap. I don't know if it was done digitally, I doubt it. Used aweful zoom footage vs the fixed shots that followed. Weird

Time value of news?
5 PM - 1 minute
6 PM - 30 sec.
10 PM - 10 sec. although the story focus changed for addt'l time (where's my wedding going to take place now that the hall burned?)

Yes I just happened to have seen it, I think. This was a National Geographic production? No wait, I think what I am recalling is something on the National Geographic Channel I saw this last week or so.

There was a sequence of a guy wading into a stream with a xl1s on a monopod to get a shot of a herd of elephants walking into a stream.

It looked to me as if they were cutting between the footage from the xl1s and footage little better camera. The contrast of the footage from the xl1s was not the best -- detail in the shadows was not good. The other camera was much more evenly exposed.

Also I saw an xl1 on the Outdoor Channel a couple of days ago on some fishing show. Don't know if the show was shot on an xl1 however.

If the fellow with the XL1 on a monopod was a heavy-set guy named Mark, then yes, that's the one I saw... I agree the other angle was shot by a better cam... but the color match was pretty good despite the flaws you and I both noticed.

Angel,

Finalamente [am hoping mi poco Italiano stands in por Espanol] I got Quicktime and took a look at the Paganini trailer -- so this is the work that will be finished in July? Que lindo trailer. Makes one want to see the full work.

Look forward to seeing more en futura.

gracias,
david

hi david, yous spanish is as well (or as bad) as my english, so i can understand you.
im not the director of "el blues de paganini", i just make part of the photography, the documentary that will be finished in july is one that im directing, and what i hope soon can be put the trailer online.
el blues de paganini must be finished this year.

gracias.
angel

I think the heavy set guy shoots his XL-1 in the greenbox mode. I noticed the focus going in and out while the lioness was eating, gnawing on a bone. The focus continued to change between the bone and her face.
Bruce

I stand corrected. The program was on the Travel Channel. I happened across the rebroadcast and this time I watched for awhile longer.

Now I think the xl1 held its own quite well against the other camera -- esp. in the cheetah sequence. The elephants in the stream sequence, on second viewing, looked back-lit a bit.

So perhaps it all does come down to what Chris has said it does in other places -- lighting.

If you watch Howard Stern on the E! channel you can see sometimes on thje hallway interviews they use the XL1 and the pd-150.

i don't think you will have much better picture using pal
on other side you will have huge problem if you want to convert your pal originated material to ntsc because they have different compression shemes. DV ntsc uses 4:1:1 compression scheme, DV pal uses 4:2:0
i'm pal user , but i just live in a pal area

thanks a lot, sorry that I needed so much time to answer.

yep .. well the task was to do no dialogue and a 5min shortfilm - was for my application for filmschool, but they didnt like it or didnt like other taks I had to do -.- that is why it is very good to hear that other people like it :)

ok take care and happy filming everyone
Ulrik

Always seems strange that a film school require you to make something to get in and not let you in if they don't think it's good enough. Isn't that what you're going there to learn ;)

The fact you did it shows you're keen. Anyway, well done and best of luck man.

Cheers
Aaron

Excellent responses!

Thanks so much for the feedback! I'm especially happy to see that you guys consider the story to be the foundation of everything. It seems every dolt with a camera forgets that these days.

Thanks for the input!

I totally agree with you here Aaron. The filmschool here in Holland
is exactly the same. You need to make something and they must
like it before you even have a chance of attending their school.
Weird. Especially since the "like" part is very personal. How do
you measure if something is "good"? By what standards?

I went to a couple of their days where you can look around and
ask questions and stuff. I very soon got the feeling that they
more or less try to fit anyone in the same pattern, and I'll bet
they will also look for people attending for this pattern. This
persons movie should probably be "mainstream" instead of
something else if you want to join.

Oh well, I'm probably learning more on this board anyways.

Hey:

Learning on this board is probably cheaper than filmschool too!

This may sound cynical, but from the sounds of it from that school in Holland, people would learn more by making their own movies outside the school than attending and learning how to make movies the school pattern-way. In other words, I think that making movies outside the standard, filmschool way may help you be more creative because you have the freedom to learn from your own mistakes and styles, and you're forced to figure out things for yourself - or from help on message boards like this. But still, its not the pattern that the school might try to fit you in.

Some may argue that the film school teaches the methods and styles that work or don't; school teaches you how not to waste your time and to follow a pattern that works. But it may be better for yourself to experiment with styles and find alternative styles that work. A new style might be better. That's what makes your stories unique, doing things on your own. There may be more freedom to experiment outside school - if you can afford to!

Anyways, Ulrick, good luck dude. I thought the movie was cool!!

Regards,

Kyle "Doc" Mitchell

It seems film school is getting a bad rap...I don't want to say that film school is the be all and end all of filmmaking but it is not as bad as people make it out to be...I go to Concordia University (Montreal Film School) and the last thing they want to do is tell students how to make films...for example, in year one, they baseically give you an old Bolex 16mm film camera and tell you to go out and make a movie...about anything you want...

Speaking of Film School...does anyone out there know anything about the L.A. Film School (1 year program) or the New York Film Academy (1 Year)?

Thanks, Dave

Dave:

You're right dude! I didn't mean to send a negative hit about filmschool. I mean, how can I judge? I dont go to filmschool. I was just referring to what I've heard/read and to what the Holland school situation looked like - or to schools that look like they'll try to set they won't really help students creatively. Those schools don't look too cool, and those were just my feelings. Still, You're totally right man! Film schools can help!

Regards,

Kyle "Doc" Mitchell

A few months back I mentioned in one of these forums a documantary a friend of mine was putting together for the Travel Channel and described it as the best looking DV I've seen shot with a prosumer camera.

Well the documentaries will air tomorrow night - June 4 on the Travel Channel at 8 and 9PM EDT/PDT and repeated at 11 and 12 - check your local cable listings. The two docs are titled "Vegas Around the World" and "Vegas Exposed". Both were shot almost single-handedly by Fred Barney Taylor. He used his only camera - a SONY PD150 for all the shooting. He off-lined all the DVCAM material on his Mac using Final Cut Pro. The material was on-lined and color corrected on a conventional linear system and mastered on DigiBeta for broadcast release. Just about all the material was shot at -5db. I saw the material when he was editing and it looked great.

I haven't seen the finished docs but, knowing Fred's past work, it is worth taking a look.

Thanks very much for the heads-up, Ozzie. I remember your remarks about this fellow's work several months ago. I'm anxious to see the results!

p.s. I moved your announcement here to ... err...the Announcements forum.

The trailer for Full Frontal is now finally availbale from Yahoo movies.

But don't get excited. The current trailer is all titles and voices -- no live action at all.

Naw. I watched most of both of those shows. If your friend really shot them with a PD150 I'm in awe. Just the steadiness of many of the (probably) hand-held shots suggest a full-size ENG camera, certainly not a jiggly 4 lb prosumer camera. Color and sharpness also suggested a much more expensive rig.

It just stands as testament to the contribution that skill makes, as compared to gear, to the final product. I taped one of the shows and have to look at them again.

Thanks again for the notice.

It's 100% PD150. I'll get Fred to contribute a few thoughts on his approach. But Fred is not one to hang around web sites.

I'm watching "Vegas Exposed" right this minute and all I can say is WOW. Looks great! Thanks for the heads-up about this, Ozzie.

I watched it twice, a very well done piece. It's a good example of the quality that can be achieved with modestly priced equipment. The post work was very well done with one exception. The CG seemed fuzzy. The video was sharp, good contrast and overall very little noise. But the GC and lower 1/3s all seemed to lack sharpness. Anyone else?

Jeff

I moved this to the "DV for the Masses" forum because it's a bit more appropriate here...

Yes, I just have to chime in here that this so-called "trailer" is very, very poor in my opinion. I think it's safe to say that this film has certainly generated buzz within the film/video industry for being shot on the XL-1S; to release a trailer that doesn't even have ANY footage at all is pretty weak, even if they're trying to create even more curiosity about what the footage looks like. I mean, the dialog in the trailer is nothing special either... the typography is decidedly third-rate... heck, why is that thing even on Apple's site? Why did they bother *encoding* that in Quicktime? Flash would have made more sense for just audio and b/w text.

Of course that's just my opinion. I could be wrong.

Dave,

back when I was comparing such programs (abt. 3 years ago, before I ended up getting a DV camera and deciding to go my own route), I looked into both the NY Film Academy's thing (a one-month intensive I believe -- never heard of a one-year program), versus New York University's summer intensive beginning filmmaking workshop (generally 6-week program I thinnk). I ended up concluding the NYU one looked probably better.

That's about all I can say. It was mainly an impression formed from looking at their literature, and asking around a bit. I heard some good feedback from folks who'd done NYU, and some mixed feedback abt. the other. I never visited either. Depending on the luck of the draw (since you work in little groups to create short projects, in both systems), either might potentially work good. I think in the NYU version, you first do classroom stuff for a couple weeks, then go & create shorts, if I recall aright.

I think NYU also has a DV version (which is what I'd do if I were doing it these days....)

d.i.

I've heard that FF has been heavily processed and color-shifted in post; my guess is that you won't be able to tell it's XL1S video at all. It'll probably look like an analog 8mm handycam or something. Go figure. We'll find out in August anyway.

Has anyone sat through the Criterion "Traffic" extras? On the second disc there is an extended demonstration of how much film processing and colour timing they had to do to get the Mexican scenes looking so washed out and high contrast at the same time.

I almost died. How could anyone be so anal?

You can bet Soderbergh will do a lot more to his XL1s output.

Hello all! I've been working on my dv feature for a year now (it's official) and wanted to extend some thanks. My working knowledge of filmmaking would be woefully inadequate were it not for the posts and comments. My film's got plenty of bugs, certainly, but it could be much, much worse. Oh yes. But for an entry level guerilla filmmaker, I think I'm doing alright. Thanks again.

Marty Higareda
www.caryatidfilms.com

'Way to go Marty' :)
Jim

Well, the big question is ofcourse: where can we see it? I hope
you answer with something that begins with http://

Great you finished your project!

Thanks for the support. If you haven't already you can check out the trailer on the caryatid page. I'm turning the footage black and white, and if anyone has any experience or advice with color correction, I'd be grateful.

Back to the machine,

M

Hi Orca8888,
I live in New York City . I was like you tired of just standing by waiting for things to happen so I took things in my own hand and recently bought a XL1S PAL. I chose PAL because of two things: I come from Europe where they are using PAL and since I might go back some day. My ambitions are to blow my DV films up to 35mm.
You have already read answers and other threads about the extra work to show the footage here in the US when your have shot in PAL. I am not really so sure that is such a huge problem. I have spent the last month experimenting with my camera and just used the viewfinder to check the results. I am going to get a professionel monitor (PAL/NTSC) and an OneWorld VCR from B&H photo which enables you to record PAL footage to a NTSC VHS.
But most of the work will be done on a NLE workstation and using the monitor.
By the way I am producing my first DV short film in September. Everything is possible!!
Tom

Hi byroniceye,
I just saw your trailer. Visually it looked great, and the sound was also great. Unfortunately I didn't really get the story and what it is about which could be a catch. Though I got teased and would really like to see more. Keep up the good work!!
Tom

For me , shooting news is telling a story, the one thing I try to remember is that I am selling the footage to a very short list of customers. I expect myself to shoot a visual shot telling who what when where and why. But most of all, without fail, I must tell the truth, I tell the truth when a major network wants my video, and I tell the truth when I call an assignment editor and explain what I have just shot. The news is suppose to be the truth and by not shooting something that is of great importance, I would not be telling the whole story. I have an entire list of shots that I will not shoot or will edit out before dubbing to the studio, they include legal and yes some ethical shots such as faces of death, nudity, and others. The news has a place, It can be a tool to get people out of harms way, hurricanes, product recall, dangerous people, etc. News can also have the effect of showing when a particular event is re-occurring and deserves more attention, such as tires blowing out. It is natural to feel for people when an accident occurrs, but it may also be the truth about what happened. I shoot what I see and not what I think.

A behind the scenes look at a hiphop tour. Some done with an xl1, not sure what else.

Perhaps a "stupid" questions, but where?