I am looking for a good film scoring software for my P.C. (besides digital producer). I am new to this area, and I am not certain which ones to look at. Ease of use and cost are important considerations, but quality of finished product is the supreme consideration. Obviously, I intend to use the software on a number of projects (from docs to shorts, to drama, etc.) so genre specific apps are less useful to me. Please, those in the know, give me some software options to consider, and a little info on why.

Thanks

If ease of use is a consideration, then Sonar should be on your plate, but don't forget Cubase either.
On the other hand, you don't provide your background. Are you a musician at all? Or a videographer looking to score some royalty free segments? If you have no musical chops, then Sonic Fire Pro is your answer, but it's reasonably limited in terms of what you can do with it. ACID offers a lot more choices, but it requires a little bit of musical acumen. Sonar and Cubase require quite a bit of musical acumen.

DSE, thanks for the reply. My chops are limited (I play a bit of acoustic guitar and piano, but can't sing to save my life:-), but I luckily have access to several very good musicians (including singers, bass guitar players, percussion, etc.) who are willing to create original music for and with me. However, to be practical I am FIRST considering royalty free or low cost music to be mixed with the various projects I am working on (i.e. a historical doc, urban short, a social drama). I am saying all this only to say that scoring with already created content is my first line of approach (though I hope to have original content in the near future).

Thanks

Since you play, even a little, I'd be looking at ACID. There is a free Express version on the Sony website with a bunch of free loop content. That'll give you an idea of how well/quickly you can maneuver and create. For me, it's very fast. For others, it might not be so.

Thanks man...will do.

Just read an article on this type of product (Presentation magazine July 2004: Play Your Own Tune, by Jeffery Fisher, Julie Hill and Tad Simons).

Listed are the rating by the article authors and product manufacturer and product name.

8 Magix: Music Maker 2005 Deluxe
8 Apple: GarageBand
6 Cakewalk: Home Studio XL 2004
9 Sony: ACID Pro 4.0
9 SmartSound: SonicFire Pro 3.0
9 Adobe: Audition 1.5
9 Apple: Soundtrack
N/R Digital Juice: Stack Traxx

But personally, I'd take DSE's recommendation because he's actually worked with these things.

Patrick, the problem is that I am looking for software that is mainly designed for film scoring (preferably for digital media). Some of the software on the list are designed as general sound editors, and as such not as precise an application as I would prefer. Of course I realize that you can't always get what you want.

Just wanted to give you options to study even though I thought you would pick the DSE recommendation.

Thanks Patrick, I appreciate the info. Some of the prog U had on the list are useful for what I want to do, I was just hoping there was something more specific out there. For now I am going to follow DSE's suggestion and also keep looking.

Get Acid or better still... Acid Pro. Then IMMEDIATELY get the two disks titled "Best of Prosessions"... OR PLAN B is to IMMEDIATELY get Cinematic Pulse, Cinematic Ambience, and Cinematic Impact... All these disks are from M-Audio and after you get Acid you'll celebrate the day you heard about these M-Audio discs. When combined with Acid they will absolutely, positively, BLOW YOUR SOCKS OFF! Seriously, change into some underwear you can throw away before you start experimenting with this combo... it's THAT good.

Matt,

Does ACID play the Apple format M-Audio loops you recommended? I couldn't find any references on the M-Audio site listing ACID as a compatible software.

Joseph

Thanks Matt, I'll look into it. BTW, once purchased can these recordings be freely used in works that may be at least in part commercial, and can they be manipulated for different sounds without breaking any laws.

I've got Acid Pro and about 10, yes 10 of the M-Audio discs... so yeah, they work together. Splendidly... oh yes.

I emailed M-Audio to get some clarification on their licensing speak... 'cause on the package it almost sounds like they don't want you to use their sounds to make money. Well the clarification that *I* got was that all that stupid lingo is REALLY meant to say is that you can't sell their sounds as a product for what they simply are... As in you can't have a video that has the raw audio samples one after another or use them in some other way to inadvertently (or intentionally) create a "competing" product. Sooo....

I use 'em in various ways and sometimes they are altered, um, er... very little...

Get these discs and you'll see what I mean. In the Cinematic Impact disc, for instance, one sample sound... at one loop... may be exactly what you need to punch up a scene or key moment. So is that wrong? M-Audio sure wouldn't clarify it for me fully, but they made it sound like that isn't something to worry about...

Sometimes I mix the sounds down and create my own track... sometimes the sound I want is pretty much "ready to go".

Once you get these you'll understand that the ONLY reason I put this post up is 'cause I've been playing with these for a long time... otherwise I'd have kept it a secret. They are THAT good.

Thanks for letting us know about M-Audio, Matt--I looked into it and wow, what a way to put a professional sheen on one's work! Fantabulous options.


:D

Hey Dwight,

Just to weigh in... off-the-cuff, I'd go with DSE's recommendation for using ACID Pro. I have a music background and LOVE Sonar. It's incredibly powerful and useful to compose and score on, esp. if you like diving your hands into MIDI editing. However, when I need something quick 'n dirty, I will inevitably turn to ACID Pro to get things done. It's has an easy workflow, a super-fast learning curve (when you're just starting into this), and allows you to create workable material with loops (if you're so inclined) in a very short amount of time... AND it's ULTRA stable (at least for me). Since it allows you to come up with sketches pretty quickly, you can then spend time making creative decisions and fine-tuning without having to do lots of setup.

For ACID Pro, I'm still on version 4 and will say that the VST implementation is a bit spotty. I've had *a few* soft-synths freeze, close-out, or refuse to start altogether. In my case, it really doesn't impact me since I use those synths and ROMplers in Sonar anyways. ACID Pro 5 may have fixed much of this, but don't know since I really haven't had the need to shell out for the upgrade.

If you're using canned music, you could just track it right in your NLE, providing it's audio-friendly, like Vegas (very friendly, to the point that you can use it to do basic loop-based work). That would save you from needing to purchase additional software. If you're having other musicians contribute, you'll have to figure out how you're getting their material into the final piece. Will you be mixing it yourself? Will you need recording capability... multi-track even? Or, will they be handing you a finished piece? Answers to these questions, among others, may go more toward driving the software decision.

As you can see, there's lots of considerations before investing in a sequencer. At the end of the day, definitely consider it an investment, because you'll probably be learning the workflow, quirks, and workarounds for your chosen platform... maybe even upgrading over the long-run.

Maybe if you can give us a bit more detail on how you envision your use of the software will be, we can give you pros and cons (or at least opinions) on what which platform would suit your situation best.

Oh... budget, too!

Harris, as stated above I am currently doing several projects in different stages. The most pressing now is a historical Doc I am working on and now need to consider the music for. I will probably be using canned music with voiceover (meaning lowering the music and background sound to allow for clear foreground voices of narrators). I will mix it myself, but I admit this is a new area for me so there will be a learning curve. In the near future I will be using music I have recorded live and maybe mixing it with some canned music. I am taking the position of Dir of sound design more so than Foley artist, but in indie work U kinda have to be a jack of all trades (to some extent). I will be taking the advice given above by DSE and others, and I will be looking around for canned music I can use in post. Ultimately, I will be looking for a software with a reasonable learning curve (I have used editors before, such as audition, but I am new to mixers like acid), and a lot of flexibility.

If all you're looking to do is mix canned music in post, your NLE will more than likely be sufficient for mixing canned music and voice-overs. (BTW, by "mixing", I meant mixing several different parts of a musical piece together, e.g. drums, guitar, bass, etc, into a final piece.)

You haven't mentioned anything about your recording needs, MIDI sequencing needs, or plug-in needs so I'm guessing that none of these are requirements for you at this point.

Adobe Audition (formerly Cool Edit Pro) is actually more than an editor, you can multi-track and mix in it. You can even open video files for viewing and syncing if required. I believe it even has loop handling capability. So, if you have access to Audition you're already set to go. Plus, you'll have a great audio editor to boot.

You haven't mentioned budget either, but I'm guessing that since you're doing indie work, you have a tight budget requirement? Do you plan on doing this as your trade or as a side job? Is this going to be a business investment for the future or just to get you by for now? Does the software you select need to be cross-compatible to your peers and others in industry (and have street cred) or are you looking for software that can just "get the job done"?

My point is, you may have the tools in your hands already for the work you're describing, but if you don't, to give you a well thought-out answer will take you answering in more detail. Despite the fact that capabilities are converging in the sequencer realm, each piece of software out there has its strengths and weaknesses. These strengths and weaknesses map into how easy (or hard) it becomes to get certain things done.

I understand that you're new to this area altogether and maybe just testing the waters. If that's the case, go for one of the light versions of the full-packages like Cakewalk Home Studio or Steinberg Cubase SE. These will give you basic capability for cheap until you learn enough to know what you need. Or, spend a bit more and get ACID Pro, Audition, or Cubase SL.

Gotta love having choices.

EDIT:
Take another look at that list Patrick posted. Most of those are NOT just general sound editors. They're very capable budget-level sequencers and many on the list allow you to drop a video track on the timeline to sync your sound to. Pro Tools and Steinberg Nuendo are considered to be more "built" for film scoring, while being multi-hat wearing also... and they'll blow your budget out of the water just by looking at them. ;-)

I downloaded MAGIX, the glitch however is that I can't find their loops, they say they have a sound archive with 3500 sounds, but they don't show the preview. I've emailed them.

I also tried to download Cubase, but I need a USB number.

Good thread, I just need a large library of loops and such, I'm pretty sure I can do the mixes. Anyone know the link to the m-audio disks that were referenced on this thread?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but judging from your posts what you are looking for are pre made loop libraries rather than film scoring software where you would need to compose the actual score yourself.

But I was thinking there are loops out there that can be mixed to create a song, I might be crazy. Something similar to how rap is mixed, basically samples.

So I'm looking for loops that I could mix to create 'romantic' music and the like. I have a musical background, unfortunately it's playing the drums and mixing audio. Thanks for the question.

Sonic Foundry's Acid was basically the first music looping software program. Lots of loops available if not creating y'own. Comes with a nice assortment of plug-ins, supports Direct-X and VST, MIDI, MIDI-TC and a video preview window or an option to send picture to an external monitor.
It's also a decent multi-track DAW, but it wouldn't be my first choice for tracking sessions with multiple players.

Sony Creative Software - ACID Pro Digital Audio Workstation and ACID Music Studio Loop-Based Music Creation Software (http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/acidsoftware)

Well I went to my local stores, ironically there are two major companys, Sam Ash Music and Guitar Center right side by side, and looked at CuBase. Then the guy at Sam Ash opened Sequal Start:|http://www.steinberg.net/ (http://www.steinberg.net/en/products/sequel.html) and I think that's more of what I am looking for. I have a musical background, drums, but all the males in my family play piano. So I'm expecting to be able to learn basic piano then I think I can continue to the point of making my own music. It might take me a couple of years, but you have to start somewhere.

"The list" posted earlier includes SmartSound's SonicFire 3.

Current version is SonicFire Pro 5.5.0.0

The "Express Tracks" edition is free with any music purchase, individual tracks may be purchased at prices that range from as low as $14.95 for their older single layer music, to $29.95 for some of their multilayer music, to $49.95 per track for their latest with vocals.

With Express Tracks you indicate the timed length you need in a data field and if you've purchased the music you select (and it's on your hard drive) it is automatically composed to that length. Export it as a WAV file, drag 'n drop to the music track on your NLE timeline.

The "Scoring Edition" is $99 and has a timeline of it's own. You can load in a video (low res render of the segment you need to score works best) and it plays in a small window while the music on the timeline plays so you can see before exporting how it fits. The Scoring Edition works like SmartSound Quicktracks in many NLE's used to work, you can drag left and right ends of the music segment to change the length of the music and it "recomposes"

Express Tracks comes with the Scoring Edition, I have the Scoring Edition and find it is an extremely precise way to score using SmartSound music. I have NO musical background, and NO musical talent.

But SonicFire Pro works well for me.

Hi Bruce

Nice to see you around still!! Yep, for me SS is still the easiest without having to know anything about music. I used to play in a band so I have fiddled with Acid but for me it's a long and painful process and just browsing thru ready-made professional tracks is way easier!! With mood mapping on the new versions film scoring should be relatively painless now and the end result will be good.

I still use single layer libraries but for weddings and events they are more than adequate!!

Chris