That's not entirely true. My 7Ds do not overheat all the time. I've shot an hour long ceremony with 3 7Ds running and not one had the red light indicator come on. Same with the 3 hour long reception.

Now have my cameras overheated? Yup. 3 out of the 4 times it was in 30P. I shoot in 24p so it's not as much as an issue to myself.

These cameras are great for weddings. Sure there is a file limit, but work around it. Stagger your recording times. Set up a wide safe cam. Use external audio. It's not a big deal. ;)

I haven't got a chance to read the previous pages but if the t2i has a longER recording time at 30 mins, definitely will pick one up.

Don't forget that these cameras can overheat. A colleague has switched to DSLR from HVX (lucky he didn't sell it!). Leave them on, shoot lots, and the li'l red thermometer starts flashing, and if you don't do anything about that, the camera will. It shuts down. The end. No switch back on until IT is ready, not you.

Luminaries such as Dan Chung and Philip Bloom mention it in passing, but that immediately will discount DSLRs from some shoots - half way through speeches?

Got a spare body for that moment? Not even that would really work.

Remember, Philip Bloom shoots only 15% of his work on DSLR. For videographers, it's an additional, special effects, crashcam, arty GV, sneaky stolen shot, night-time camera. It gives good 'interview' too. But long form? I'm glad I've got two EX1s for that.


Where do you get that number from? Maybe his corporate gigs, but I guarantee he is shooting most of his personal stuff on DSLR's, every time I have seen him in person, he has had a DSLR cam, not an ex1, etc...

Where do you get that number from? Maybe his corporate gigs, but I guarantee he is shooting most of his personal stuff on DSLR's, every time I have seen him in person, he has had a DSLR cam, not an ex1, etc...

The number comes from a couple of recent podcasts he's done with Chris Jones (Living Spirit Films).

And for some of us here, shooting corporate gigs is what we do for a living.

The point I'm making is that DSLRs are not the best solution for every shoot, and have disadvantages (like overheating, shot length limits, audio, yada yada yada) that mean that enthusiasm to ditch one's A1 or EX1 or whatever and forever bathe in the glory of DSLR video should be tempered with a little understanding that these are not exactly perfect and have gotchas.

Of course Phil will carry a DSLR more often than an EX1. So will I. And I'll use it on my corporate gigs for the special effects it's good at. Just not recording long-form stuff, chromakey stuff, video-look stuff, quite a lot of run and gun stuff, and so on. It's not an 'All or Nothing' thing, and just because they're NOT used on corporate gigs as much as some would think doesn't mean they can't be used or should be used.

Most of Philip's work doesn't go onto his site for corporate reasons. But from what I've seen, they are beautifully told stories and the fact that some don't use DSLRs does not detract from them. We see a lot of his DLSR stuff as that's the stuff he does between the actual money-earning stuff.

I just did a corporate gig for my employer with the 5D2 that included green screen stuff, and the keying was no problem at all. I shot it all with a shoulder rig, mostly with the 24-105/4 IS.

This particular video was a product demo/lifestyle example. I used AE for motion tracking a fake user interface on various screens. By keeping the aperture at roughly f/4, the DOF was reasonable - not hard to deal with, but with some softness on backgrounds. On one shot I used the 50/1.4 and an ND to direct the eye with a rack focus. I rented a four light kit, so lumens were no problem.

While a DvSLR would not be the weapon of choice for recording live speeches and presentations, it's perfect for promo stuff, HR training films, and product demo/lifestyle stuff. Just make sure you have enough light to stop things down a bit. Artistic, razor-thin DOF isn't generally appreciated in the corporate world.

how the heck does anyone shoot a whole ceremony with one of these!?

You use two. At this price its a no brainer. Cam 1 shoots the first full 10 or 11 minutes, while cam 2 is b cam, and takes infills of the congregation/close ups etc. Switch to cam 2 on B & G for the next long shot, And cam 1 becomes B cam. Sync them up with Plural Eyes. Simple.
(Sorry, I know it should be in The Weddings forum)

Because your HF100 is a camcorder and is defined as such.

D-SLRs are not defined as camcorders, they are still-photo cameras. That is the distinction, and that is the reason why they are hobbled with 30 min. video recording, to prevent classification as a camcorder and therefore taxed higher (in the EU, but affects all cameras worldwide as there is only one model worldwide, and not a separate model for the EU). In other words, the limitation is there to keep the price down.

Guys, we're not going to debate the reason why the file size limitation is there, because that debate is not going to change anything... the fact is that the 4GB limitation exists, and yes it will be present even when recording to SDXC cards. For what it's worth, I've been told by more than one person at Canon USA that the reason is due mainly to the EU restrictions. Let's stop arguing about it please. Arguing about it doesn't change the fact that it's there.

Can someone please clarify something for me. I've had the Panasonic GH1 in my sights for some time but debating whether I could justify the cost. Now this T2i comes out, and I'm excited about the lower cost and larger sensor but also reading about 4GB file sizes and limits in recording time due to taxes, etc.

From what I've read the GH1 has no limit on record time other than the card size. Is this true?

Also, why would the 4GB limit be present when recording to SDXC cards when they don't use FAT32 but, rather, exFAT?

The GH1 doesn't have a limit.

Does the t2i finally have manual audio levels for the stereo inputs?.. this is the only thing stopping me from ordering a half dozen of these things!

'The GH1 doesn't have a limit.'

(if its non EU version)

Does the t2i finally have manual audio levels for the stereo inputs?No. It does *not* have manual audio level control.

Canon EOS 550D - Rebel T2i on Vimeo

I found this on Vimeo !!!

I am definitely looking at the T2i for its 1080p24 frame rate. I already have the T1i and do a lot of shooting in the 720p30 frame rate. The question is: the new T2i 720p60/50 frame rate; how will it work with footage shot with the T1i? Does the 60fps mean that it's for slomo only? If so, if I wanted slomo 1080p with the T2i, would I have to shoot in the 720p and blow it up in post?

Thanks!

I am definitely looking at the T2i for its 1080p24 frame rate. I already have the T1i and do a lot of shooting in the 720p30 frame rate. The question is: the new T2i 720p60/50 frame rate; how will it work with footage shot with the T1i? Does the 60fps mean that it's for slomo only? If so, if I wanted slomo 1080p with the T2i, would I have to shoot in the 720p and blow it up in post?

If you are going to deliver to Blu-ray then you can just stay with 720P, it is within BD spec, and will look much better than if you upscale it but if T2i 720P60 is like 7D then there will be a lot of aliasing. )-:

This camera really looks like it could be a great deal for the money. I have been saving for a 7d but it looks like this 550d will be just as effective for video and I could possibly use the extra cash to get a slider or other gear. It will be interesting to see if it holds up as well in low light situations.

I had read earlier in the thread that people didn't like that it didn't have auto focus, but the canon site says it has "Autofocus: Quick mode, Live mode, Face Detection Live mode; manual". Does that mean that you have to depress the shutter button slightly to autofocus or is it the auto focus we are accustomed to on standard video cameras?

Also, can any of you guys see the possibility of one of these DSLRs being totally optimized for shooting video? I am envisioning something that looks like a typical pro-camcorder but uses the large dslr sensor and interchangeable lenses. It seems to me like it's just a matter of time before someone releases a "hybrid" camera of this nature. Total speculation, but something like that would seemly be the best of both worlds.

this 550d Actually it's a Rebel T2i to you and me. Our friends in Europe and the UK will know it as the EOS 550D.

Also, can any of you guys see the possibility of one of these DSLRs being totally optimized for shooting video? Well, if it's totally optimized for shooting video, then it wouldn't be a D-SLR anymore -- since by definition a D-SLR has a mirror, a pentaprism and an optical viewfinder, all of which would be totally out of place on a video camera.

I am envisioning something that looks like a typical pro-camcorder but uses the large dslr sensor and interchangeable lenses. It seems to me like it's just a matter of time before someone releases a "hybrid" camera of this nature. See my article as to why this idea probably won't happen this year:

APS-C or Full Frame CMOS Sensors? Not Happening in 2010 (http://www.dvinfo.net/features/canon-reveals-their-next-pro-video-cam.html#aps-c)

Very cool. Thanks for the replies. But... 720p60? Is that slomo only? I'd definitely like to shoot 24p for the "film look" idea, and a DSLR is perfect for what I want. Everything I do, so far, will be mastered to DVD or to the web (Vimeo, specifically). Blu-Ray isn't in the picture yet, not with my clients!

Shooting exclusively in 720p wouldn't be a bad thing, I guess. Maybe shoot the 1080p24 things with the T2i, any slomo with the 720p60, downconvert the 1080 to 720 and enjoy. Or I could shoot 720p30 with my T1i and slomo with the 720p60 T2i, and call it a day.

I just think it's strange that the 60/50 fps is on 720p and SD only! Hmmm... interesting.

Update: Download the Rebel T2i / EOS 550D operator's manual.
The link is provided at the bottom of the second post of this
thread (back on the first page). Here's a shortcut to that post:

Download the operator's manual: Rebel T2i -EOS 550D (http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/digital-video-industry-news/472473-new-canon-rebel-t2i-digital-slr.html#post1483151)

What are the HD recording limits on this baby?

HD recording is limited to the same specs as Canon's other HD SLRs. 4 gig or 30 minutes in SD mode, 4 gig or roughly 12 minutes in HD mode. You can keep taking clips up to that length till you fill up the SD card.

Thanks for posting the manual. On page 228, it states the file size for 1 minute of 1080 or 720 video as approximately 330 MB. Divide that by 60 (per second) and multiply that by 8 (from Bytes to bits), gets us 44 Mb per second.

I note the Canon 7D's manual uses the same figures as the 550D. I feel I'm tiptoeing into nerd territory here, but where the 7D's manual says MPEG44 AVC, the 550D's manual says MPEG-4 AVC/H.264. Hopefully this is just tidying up their nomenclature.

Taking into account that this is all speculation, variable bit rate et al, are we pretty safe in establishing the video side IS pretty much identical to the 7D?

MPEG-4 (did it really say MPEG44?) is a standard that consists of several sub-standards for video and audio. MPEG stands for Motion Picture Expert Group. I believe that AVC stands for Advanced Video Codec. H.264 is a specific compression codec.

Both cameras use H.264 compression.

H.264/MPEG-4 AVC - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H.264/MPEG-4_AVC)
MPEG-4 AVC/H.264 Information - Doom9's Forum (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=96059)

Bad news on page 136 of the handbook.

I think that mean that there is no HD Out over HDMI while recording.

But on this site it seems the camera have HD-Out:
Google Nachricht (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=de&sl=ja&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fcweb.canon.jp%2Fcamera%2Feosd%2Feosmovie%2Fcomparison%2Findex.html)


Daniel von Euw

The manual says:

If you connect the camera to a TV set with an HDMI cable and shoot a movie in 1080p or 720p, the movie being shot will be displayed at a small size on the TV. However, the actual movie will be properly recorded at the movie recording size that was set.

This indicates to me that it functions like the 7D, namely the HDMI out during recording doesn't fill the screen but doesn't drop down to 480i either.

@Jenn Kramer:

I think the 7D fill the screen if you press the "info" button until no more screen-infos are shown.


Daniel

It doesn't give you the actual 1080p image, though. It's the scaled image from the LCD screen. If the 7D outputted a full 1080p image without other menu/system data people would be using nanoflashes to get around the 4 gig limit.

Thanks for posting the manual. On page 228, it states the file size for 1 minute of 1080 or 720 video as approximately 330 MB. Divide that by 60 (per second) and multiply that by 8 (from Bytes to bits), gets us 44 Mb per second.(...)

yep, the 5/7D's do about 5MB/s :) more or less, depending on the amount of compression used for each frame.

So the 12min time limit is not a constant! The 4gb file size is.

@Jenn Kramer:

The 7D outputs 1080i during recording.

Check this two links:
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/canon-eos-7d-hd/471665-output-resolution-via-hdmi.html
http://cweb.canon.jp/camera/eosd/eosmovie/comparison/index.html (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=de&sl=ja&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fcweb.canon.jp%2Fcamera%2Feosd%2Feosmovie%2Fcomparison%2Findex.html)


Daniel

It outputs 1080i, but not full screen.

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/canon-eos-7d-hd/465083-7d-hdmi-output.html

@Jenn Kramer:

Have you read my links???


... The 7D does NOT get restricted to 480p when recording. If you are seeing a small view with info all around, hit the "info" button to toggle through until you get a larger display with no information surrounding it. ...


I just tried it and it works. This will help focusing tremendously.


The stock 5D (not sure about the firmware thing) outputs a standard def image to a monitor via HDMI when recording. The 7D outputs everything in HD (1080i I believe) via HDMI even when recording.

I just shot with a 5D Saturday and a 7D (mine) Sunday and used a Small HD DP1 monitor on both shoots. In my case when shooting with the 5D, when you hit the record button everything turns into a stretched 480p image on my 16x9 DP1 monitor. It kinda sucks, follow focus would be really hard visually. BEFORE recording everything is HD, you can cycle through different display options for data, etc with the info button and one of them fills the frame (it is cropped a bit) on your external monitor - it's just when you hit the record button that everything goes black for a second and then pops up as stretched 480p.

On the 7D, everything just stays the same when you hit the record button. If you selected "full screen view" via the info button - it just stays that way, the focus box thing goes away and a little red dot shows up in the upper right corner. Visual follow focus is very easy with an external monitor.

This is one of the reasons I got the 7D and not the 5D. Hope this info helps.


Daniel

'Full screen' to you may mean something other than it does to me. Full screen to me would be the 1920x1080 16:9 recorded image displayed in it's entirety. The 7D (and presumably the T2i, based on the manual) displays a 3:2 display scaled to fit in the 16:9 space with a grayed out top and bottom to frame the 16:9 recording area and black pillarboxing on the sides. I can post a picture if you like, I have a 7D sitting right here and I've used the HDMI out while recording before.

@Jenn Kramer:

And what means that:

"If you selected "full screen view" via the info button - it just stays that way, the focus box thing goes away and a little red dot shows up in the upper right corner. Visual follow focus is very easy with an external monitor."

If its only a upscaled liveview image follow focus would be difficult.


Daniel

From a quick search it looks like the actual image area of the 7D's video output is 1620x910, about 3/4s of 1920x1080. Good enough for follow focus but not full 1080.

From a quick search it looks like the actual image area of the 7D's video output is 1620x910, about 3/4s of 1920x1080. Good enough for follow focus but not full 1080.

Apparently, if you scan up that 1620x910 footage to full 1080 and compare that with the camera footage, the resolution is the same.

Just to verify, the Canon 550D = Canon T2i right?

Yes. In North America it's the EOS Rebel T2i. In Europe and the UK, it's the EOS 550D.

In Asia too, it's called the 550d, except in Japan where the Rebel is a "Kiss" camera.

Apparently, if you scan up that 1620x910 footage to full 1080 and compare that with the camera footage, the resolution is the same.

Sounds like a different scheme than HDV or HDCAM but a similar principle. 1920x.84375=1620 1080x .842593=910.00044 so using your numbers they are playing with the shape of the pixels a little. You would need very good charts to see if there is any difference.

Anyone read the Australian pricing yet?

Canon Australia has just put a figure on their website (http://canon.com.au/en-AU/For-You/Digital-Cameras/EOS-Digital-SLR-Cameras/550D). RRP AU$1349!

Strange... That's the same price as the 500D.

Canon Australia has just put a figure on their website (http://canon.com.au/en-AU/For-You/Digital-Cameras/EOS-Digital-SLR-Cameras/550D). RRP AU$1349!

Strange... That's the same price as the 500D.


And 1349AUD is for BODY ONLY!!! The cheapest kit is 1500AUD (1350USD)
Canon USA has body only listed as 899USD for the kit!
In Shanghai, China (not on Canon's site though) I've seen it advertised online as 6500RMB (approx 940USD), and sales people are telling me 6100RMB yay! (900USD). BTW this price is amazing! I was thinking about a doing a "round table" type shoot, multiple cameras, but the cost would have been too high with previous HD-DSLRs... thank you Canon!



Seems the nice people of Oz are getting higher prices! Any other prices spotted round the world?

I completely agree! Currently US$988 is worth AU$1,001.28... So where's the other $347.72 going?

Not like I'm going to pay the RRP... I'm waiting for local stores to start getting stock... Then I'm going bargain hunting! ;)

550D/T2i body in the Netherlands will cost about 760 euro (US$1030; AU$1150) (whereas the 500D is 200 euro cheaper!)...

7D costs around 1250 euro, so for 500 bucks I can get me a nice extra lens or follow focus!

All local store prices, not the RRP from Canon.

If possible, I'd like to be able to download a sample of the raw video (any frame size, but 1080 preferred) from a T2i, when the cam is available, of course! I'd like to see how it edits as compared to my T1i. Thanks!

Curious why this active thread has come to a dead end? I can't be the only one, but please, some final clarification on uncompressed hdmi out? Official recording in cam codec and bit rates, and 720p 60 frame rate or not?
Yes much of this has been answered at various times, only to be debated later. Could someone please just provide a definitive spec summary?
Maybe DVinfo itself?

Ken, we'll know much more as soon as the camera starts shipping. Nobody has it yet (outside of some select pre-release testers), but once it gets into people's hands then we'll have something to talk about (and a new forum to match).

Oooopse. My apologizes. I had wrongly assumed it was a released cam(ra). That explains a lot.
When will we know the exact specs? Based on the (pre)specs, it is a killer.
Really looking forward to this release with full details. Canon has taken the lead in the low/middle class cam, for a while now, and do not appear to want to let it go with their reach into this catagory. It appears the older low cost HD standards lock down, such as the old HDV spec, no longer apply. Finally!

Based on the official Canon manual:

It has 720/60p and 720/50p (page 132).
It will have the same HDMI out functionality as the 7D and the 1DmkIV.
Recording lengths and bitrates are the same as 7D and 1DmkIV.

any idea on a release date yet?

Apparantly it comes out in the UK on Feb 28th,

I was all set to buy a 7d (for 90% video) so if the video mode on the 550d is the same as the 7d, i think I'll get the 550 and put the rest to lenses

Exactly what I plan to do as well. Although, a 7D is still tempting for me because I can make it my main wedding still camera, and use it as another cam for videos when I need it.

My plan is to go with the Rebel to get my foot in the door with DSLR video and spend the cash I save on lenses and stabilizers. Then when ever canon finally releases the new revised 5MK2, whether that means just a firmware update or a total body revision, I pick up one of those as a primary still/video camera. Because I still like the idea of the full frame sensor for its low light qualities and its awesome bokeh.