Hi Everyone.

I desperately need some help selecting appropriate audio equipment for a video series that takes place in an automotive shop.

I am a custom car builder who is embarking on a project to do a series of ‘how to’ videos on auto restoration and customizing. The video will be shot using a Canon XH A1s in a 30 ft x 30 ft shop with a 12 ft ceiling. The walls and ceiling is dry walled and the floor is cement, so my audio equipment needs to be very good at capturing my voice and avoiding any ‘echo’. Since this room will be dedicated to this project, there will be no other people, etc making noises in the room but we all know how a persons voice sounds when it is recorded in a kitchen (for example) and this ‘hollow’ sounding voice is something I want to avoid.

I will be working alone on this project. The camera will be set up, the ‘set’ lit and the Lavaliere mic attached and a boom mic fixed over my head with no operator. I will then film myself working and explaining what I’m doing to the camera. Recording what I say simultaneously onto the two channels of the sound track, Boom mic on one channel, Lavaliere on the other. This way I can choose the best one in post.

Here’s the question:

I would LIKE to buy and use a Schoeps CMC6 with Mk41, a quality Lavaliere mic (which does NOT need to be hidden, or even small for that matter), all plugged into a Sound Devices 302…. BUT CAN’T AFFORD IT (this package is over $3000).

So, after reading for days on end, buying Ty Fords book and studying it, I THINK a good choice for me would be an Audix SCX1 / HC, a quality Lavaliere mic, both plugged into the Sound Devices MixPre. This gets the cost down under $1500… Aaah… feels much better, but only if it will capture good sound.

Here’s where you, the experienced sound people come in.

Before I make this purchase, could you please take a moment to tell me what you think?

Thank you for your help,
Greg

P.S. Since this will get ‘filmed’ as a custom car is built, the project will be recorded a segment at a time, over several hundred days spanning two or three years, so I really cannot hire a professional sound person.

This is a good challenge - especially with a limited budget. Fortunately, the budget isn't too tight to do a reasonable job.

First, as you note, echo is your number one, two, and three problem. Given that, the recorder is the least of your problems. If you need to hit a price point, I'd be willing to downgrade the recorder to a Tascam DR-100. It's not super quiet, but from your description, you'll be able to get reasonable mic positioning. With a strong voice and all that echo, the noise level in the recorder won't be a problem (it's good, but not excellent), and you don't need silky-smooth audiophile quality at the recorder, since it would all be covered up by the environment in which you're recording. (Note that I wouldn't recommend the Zoom H4n. It has a single volume control, while the Tascam can adjust the gain of the two channels independently.) No mixer is needed, since you'll be working alone. Just plug the mic into the recorder.

For the lav, I'd go with an omni. A cardiod can reduce the high frequencies of the echo, but you could be left with a boomy echo. Also, a cardiod can deliver inconsistent results when you move your head. An omni will be more foolproof. Just make sure to mount it up high on your chest (more signal, less echo) and be careful not to move your head up and down too much when speaking.

On a budget, there's the AT899. My wife uses one for public speaking. It's somewhat large, sounds okay, and is inexpensive. At work, I have a couple of Sanken COS-11Ds (that I use with the DR-100.) They sound fantastic. They have that nice combination of accuracy with a bit of edge - as if it were put through a subtle exciter. Recently, I recorded over 70 people saying their names in a busy, but dead, environment, and they all sounded good and clear. It's small and not inexpensive.

Another option is the Countryman E6. If you don't mind it being seen, this would be even more foolproof. You could keep the recorder on your belt and walk all over the shop without ever worrying about your head position. It would be so close to your mouth that you simply wouldn't have to worry about the echo. On the other hand, I find the E6 to sound quite thin. This is necessary to avoid handing noise and plosives, being head mounted and so close to the mouth. On the other hand, this would help avoid boominess in your echo chamber. With an E6, you wouldn't need any other mic, unless you had a lav as a backup. You'd be totally untethered.

As to a super cardioid, I don't have enough experience with the various models to offer a comparison. I will say that I've read people rave about Oktavas, but the test samples that I've heard don't seem to match the hype. Then again, if you go with an E6 and a backup lav, you'll have no need for a boom mic.

And, of course, anything that you can do to treat your space will be worthwhile. If you will tend to shoot away from a given wall, you could hang moving blankets on that wall. If you have large tool cabinets, turning them at odd angles will help break up standing waves. Moving blankets on the ceiling would help too. Bookshelves (large ones for shop manuals) can help. Space the books unevenly and leave space behind the books to act as a diffuser and bass trap. And, if your shop is somewhat remote, opening the doors will remove some echo.

Best of luck with your project. It would be tough to get soundstage quality, but you should be able to achieve clear, solid dialog without having to mortgage the house.

Besides recording technology, check also if you can do something to mitigate the acoustic characteristics of the room. Agree w/ Jon: Eco will be your major problem.

Hello Greg,

Indeed an interesting challenge. First address the space. The cable TV show Ace Of Cakes is shot in an older building with 12' ceilings. They have attached 2"x 4" foam acoustic absorption panels to the ceiling. Not the entire ceiling, but anything you can do to absorb the sting of reflection helps. You're trying to create a sound stage in a hard-walled raw acoustical space. I have seen facilities with cellulose sprayed on to the walls and ceilings in 2-3 inch layers.

Remember the story about the helium balloons in my book? (thanks for buying it. I am working on a postproduction book now that should be ready by year's end.) You can use fabric, canvass or muslin, for example. It can either be in loose sheets or draped over horizontally suspended poles.

Walls: You can use fabric panels as mentioned above or 4' x 8' panels of Corning 703 cut in any size you want. You may cover them with decorative/colored fabric as well.

Gobos: Gobos "go between" things to block sound. The can be as simple as a C-stand and arm with a sound blanket draped over it. The idea is to make it difficult for the sound of your voice to get to the walls and then difficult for it to get back to the mic. So you build a cocoon of gobos around you, just out of frame.

Floor: rubber mats in as many places as possible. Indoor/outdoor carpeting in less automotive places.

Jon may not have had that extra cup of coffee. I think he may be confusing a Sound Devices 702 recorder with a 302 mixer. The MixPre works as long as your camera has a line level input.

For a mic I would suggest a Countryman E6, hardwired or wireless. In the environment you envision, every inch closer you are to the mic, the better you'll sound.

Regards,

Ty Ford

Unless your going to be absolutely stationary and talking directly to the camera the boom mic track would probably would get little use, and even if it does, it will sound different than the lav so inter-cuts may be an issue.
I'd spend the money saved from a high-end boom mic and put it toward acoustic treatment and a COS-11.

On a budget, there's the AT899. It's somewhat large, sounds okay, and is inexpensive?? ...
-- Not to pick on Jon anymore, but he maybe thinking of a lower priced AT lav. The AT-899 is large compared to a B6 , but in the same price (and size) range as the TR-50 and B3... sounds pretty much on par with those as well, IMO.

> "...he maybe thinking of a lower priced AT lav. The AT-899 is large compared to a B6"

You're right. My wife has the AT803b. It's cheap, not small, and sounds pretty good for the money, but lacks the magic of the COS-11D. Whatever you get, make sure that you get a compatible XLR adapter. There's no standard for connectors and wiring on lavs. They tend to be pre-wired to work with various wireless transmitters.

The AT803b comes pre-wired for XLR. The AT899 is a more traditional "wire to taste" lav. If you go with a COS-11D, make sure to order it with its own XLR adapter.

One option is to wire the lav with an adapter connector. I wired mine with a TA3. Now I can make adapters for whatever wireless system I might use in the future. The mic isn't hardwired for only one system that way.

You can follow the lav wiring saga here:
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/all-things-audio/474367-lav-connector-xlr-wireless-use.html

I would get a good headset mic and a good wireless TX/RX kit. In acoustics like that, you can either do extensive acoustic treatment (which sounds unlikely) or you can maximize the direct/reflected ratio by putting the mic as close to your mouth as possible. Especially in a location that is that reverberant, and with no acoustic mitigation, any kind of boom/room mic seems pointless. If you want ambient, you can just use the mic on the camcorder, that is all it is good for, anyway.

Budget spent on a good headset mic and wireless kit will most certainly be heard in the quality of the tracks. I can't say the same for spending $$$$ on a high-end external mixer. And I just don't even see the purpose of a boom/room mic in your scenario. In acoustics as you describe the boom mic will NEVER be the "best" track, especially as it will be locked down and not tracking you.

If you use a good establishing shot, people will see that your location is a big reverberant box, and some amount of room echo will establish that this is a "reality" production in a real shop, and not on a pristine Hollywood sound-stage. Audiences are becoming more accepting of (limited) audio artifacts that come with low-budget location recording for "reality" type shows. Although even there, it is hardly "reality" when you have a dozen people wearing wireless transmitters (or a couple of very busy boom operators trying to catch everything.)

Thanks for all the GREAT info everyone.

Looks like I have two issues: Microphone choice and Sound mitigation.
Since I didn’t address this in my opening post, lets start with SOUND MITIGATION.

I am on board with needing to do something to mitigate the acoustic characteristics of the room. Here’s a brief overview of the ‘stage set’ and my thoughts on sound mitigation.

Behind me:
I will be 5 – 10 feet in front of the shop wall which has had the walls covered in vintage 1940’s – 50’s industrial equipment, cabinets, work benches, shelves, etc. It was chosen so as to NOT be a flat wall of steel cabinets, rather a mixture of differently shaped objects to better disperse sound. (and to be more visually interesting) Like Jon said: “Bookshelves (large ones for shop manuals) can help” I have shelves with differing sized objects on them. I’m also intrigued by Jon’s comment where he said:” Space the books unevenly and leave space behind the books to act as a diffuser and bass trap.” Good advice… I will leave a space behind the objects but should I first cover the wall with some sort of ‘sound material’?

Beside me:
Same as behind me However, I have run a curtain track along the ceiling in front of the cabinets and hung blankets like curtains. I anticipate that I will pull the curtain forward and back adjusting for each shot to cover anything that is not in the shot. I think this will accomplish what Ty said about:” build a cocoon of gobos around you”

In front of me:
The camera and lights will be in front of me, Behind them (still in front of me) will be more blankets hung from the ceiling. In this case I anticipate leaving spaces between the blankets to prevent the creation of a full fabric box. Am I correct in thinking openings in this curtain will control echo better and result in better sound (kind of similar thinking to leaving spaces behind objects on my shop shelves discussed above)?

Above me:
The ceiling is 12 feet above me and hung from the ceiling is a radiant heater (think of a very hot metal tube 6 inch in diameter running across the ceiling above my head) I cannot cover it, but in the remainder of the ceiling I was thinking of acoustical ceiling tiles of some sort. Near the heater I need to use something FIRE Rated, like those t-bar ceiling panels used in office buildings. The commercial ones are rated for use here since they can be purchased in a ‘fire proof’ grade, but what about the sound? Are office t-bar ceiling tiles a good idea? What about the ceiling that is safely away from the heater? Should I use the same tiles or is there a better choice? To cover the entire ceiling would be 900 square feet, but realistically, I would likely do the 400 square feet above my head.

Below me:
Lets cover the cement floor! It will have to be something that can be readily placed and removed. I will be cutting with a torch and welding, so I will need a cement floor at that time. I was thinking of several products: 1) Black floor foam tiles. Building places like Home Depot sell these foam squares meant to go on the floor and make it nicer to stand on. I could buy several hundred square feet of this to cover the floor. 2) Carpet roll ends / used household carpet. I could take household carpet and cut it into smaller pieces that could be quickly moved in and out as needed. 3) Well… any other options? A concern in this choice is color. Off white (soon to be dirty white) would reflect light better. Is this a concern? The floor coverings will always be off camera when the floor coverings are in place.


Oh Yeah, BUDGET for sound mitigation. Lets say $500 doesn’t scare me, AND this discussion is slowly talking me up to $800 or more.

Any advice? Ideas on techniques and specific materials to use would be GREATLY appreciated.

Thanks again everyone,
Greg

P.S.: I also like Jon’s idea: “if your shop is somewhat remote, opening the doors will remove some echo.” Unfortunately, this garage is in a quieter part of town, but I would definitely get intermittent traffic noises, so I think that is out.

In my last post I got serious about sound mitigation. Nonetheless, I still need to choose some sound gear.



BOOM MIC…Do I even need one?

Rick Reineke made a comment that really resonated with me: “unless your going to be absolutely stationary and talking directly to the camera the boom mic track would probably would get little use”
Good point. The words ‘Absolutely stationary’ do not describe what I’m going for. Especially when Rick added “it will sound different than the lav so inter-cuts may be an issue.”

Additionally, Richard Crowley built on this comment with: “I just don't even see the purpose of a boom/room mic in your scenario. In acoustics as you describe the boom mic will NEVER be the "best" track, especially as it will be locked down and not tracking you.”

So… NO BOOM MIC? What are every body’s thoughts about this?


HEAD MOUNTED MIC
I’m not real keen on the ear mounted Countryman E6. I don’t mind a lavaliere being seen on my shirt. Indeed, it is expected in this sort of video. None the less, and maybe it’s just me… but I personally see this sort of headgear more appropriate for an aerobics video, or a pitchman like Billy Mays. Hummmm… I may need to change my opinion here. Until that happens, lets discuss my other options.


LAVALIER MIC
Well it looks like my Lavaliere Mic choice will be very important.
On your advice, I had a look at the “Sanken COS-11DBP Omni directional Lavaliere Microphone with XLR Connector (Battery or Phantom)” and although $450 is high, the price isn’t bad.
In another post, Ty Ford also recommended “Countryman B6 Omni directional Lavaliere Microphone”, at $330 this also interests me.

Any input / advice? If the lavaliere is going to be my main microphone… it had better be a good one… or should I say, one that is awesome in my garage environment… So it looks like I need a little more guidance here.



Do I need a SOUND DEVICES 302 / SOUND DEVICES PREMIX?
What about Pre Amps / Mixers like the Sound Devices 302 or the PreMix. Since I do NOT have a sound man in this one man show, and every shot is planned, set up and executed by me… I do not need ‘on the fly’ sound adjustment. Nonetheless, although I don’t need these devices for their usual “sound man purposes” … What about using one just because they have better electronics in them than my a Canon XH A1s has. My reasoning is the by using line in levels in my XH-A1s I can bypass my XH-A1s preamps entirely and thereby improve the sound because I am now using the better electronics in the Sound Devices 302 / PreMix unit (in place of the reportedly poor ones in the Canon XH A1s).
What are your Thoughts on this?

THANK YOU AGAIN for reading my post and offering your guidance. It is DEEPLY APRECIATED!

Greg

I am dubious about using a lav In the kind of acoustics you are describing. You want the maximum ratio of direct (mouth) to reflected (ambient) sound. The 12 inches difference between clipped to your shirt and next to your mouth will make a huge difference in your ambient situation.

I also think your reticence to using a headset mic is misguided. You see them everywhere, both in scripted drama, and in real life. From Sunday morning pulpits to Sunday afternoon pit crews and the crew of Stargate Atlantis. The very tiny tubes (which are available in a variety of completion-matching colors) are practically invisible except in a CU shot.

I don't know how much practical acoustical mitigation you can do with $500, IF you want to keep it LEGAL and SAFE (i.e. fireproof). There are all sorts of things you can put up for temporary sound absorption, but none of them are recommended for (semi-) permanent fixed installation, especially in a hazardous location like an auto garage or machine shop or similar industrial setting.

Regardless of what mic solution you select, I think the acoustics of your location will completely swamp out any potential benefits of a premium mixer or mic preamp. So shoot some test footage plugging the wireless receiver directly into the camcorder and do some critical listening for yourself.

Note that the only way to bypass your (or any) camcorder's built-in mic preamps is to not use them and record elsewhere. The "line level" inputs on camcorders is merely a pad to knock the line-level back down to mic level. IMHO, in your scenario an external preamp is a misuse of your audio budget.

Even though Richard and I are in the same geographical area, I'll offer the counterpoint opinion... ;)

Given that you will be doing some sound treatment, you *might* be happy with the lavalier. (You wouldn't be happy in an untreated, empty space.) Of course, the E6 would offer less echo, but as I mentioned, it's a thin sounding mic. And you don't need to have zero echo. As long as the reflections are natural, not too strong, and your voice is clear and understandable, you're fine.

I think this is a judgment call. The E6 is lower risk as it can be clinically clean and won't vary as you move your head. With a lav it's hard to know when you cross the line from good, natural sounding dialog to amateur echoey dialog. Done right, the lav can make it more "authentic", while the E6 could be a bit sterile. Assuming that your room treatment is adequate, it's a style decision.

Regarding a high-quality preamp/mixer ahead of the camera, that can definitely improve things. Feed the camera with a strong signal and turn down the camera gain for a clean result. Frankly, I don't believe that noise will be an issue for you. You'll have a nice strong signal with close mic placement and won't have to boost things in post. Signal to noise is much more important when recording quiet sources, or when you're recording over some distance. Dramatic whispers and moments of silence can be challenging. But for a custom car build, you'll be speaking pretty consistently when on camera.

That brings up something else, what about natural shop sounds like compressors, air wrenches, welding torches, etc? It would be nice to have a stereo mic for these sounds. Note that unlike dialog, you can record these separately from the video and add the sounds in post, if needed. Of course, a live recording is the most efficient use of time - if you can position the mics well enough to get a good result.

For these sounds, a stereo recording is best. I'd go with an X-Y setup to keep things simple and avoid phasing problems. You don't need a fantastic mic for such recordings, but you want something that can handle high SPLs. A pair of SM57s (often used to record electric guitars and snare drums) would do the trick. They don't have much at the extremes of the frequency range, but that's a good thing for shop noises. They're also nearly indestructible, affordable, and have been around forever, so you might find them used. The trick will be to get them near your work, yet hidden from the camera.

Best of luck with the project!

Feed the camera with a strong signal and turn down the camera gain for a clean result.

Agreed. But note that if your mic signal is coming from a wireless receiver, you can typically turn it up as "strong" as you like, even line-level on some receivers. External mixer is superfluous for the purposes of simple gain enhancement. In fact, again, wireless receivers typically have line-level outputs and simply insert a pad to produce mic-level output.

Greg,

While I'm not really qualified to give advice on capturing audio, I have a little experience with Lavs and have two concerns about using a Lav in your application - clothing noise and big changes in audio volume. From working on cars from my younger years, I remember contorting myself into weird positions. If that describes your situation, you might find the lav shifting position. It could be moving away from and toward your mouth, and picking up clothing noise constantly.

For example, if you lean forward to demonstrate attaching a fender, wouldn't the Lav suddenly swing up towards your mouth? Or if you twist around in a back seat won't the Lav pick up a lot of clothing noise?

Regards,

Dan.

We're shooting similar projects restoring historic airplanes in large hangars. We spent time getting stereo fx tracks with reverberant air compressors, tools and off camera voices to build up the mono voice tracks. You can even include a still photo of a plane and the hangar sounds as busy as blazes.

So don't kill the reverb too much, get a few roll around office dividers stick some acoustic foam on 'em and place them just out of frame.

We use Sony ECM77 omni lavs and occasionally a boomed NTG-3 with an op to the camera.

But if you're hoping to sell this and even though it's a long project at least use a camera operator.

If you don't it just won't work it's too restricting and you will end up with unusable footage resulting in frustration and wasted time to the point where you give up.

Cheers.

My take:


I'd say skip the boom mic. Get a sennheiser G3 wireless, and a Sanken COS11d lav. Total 1,200.00. Go straight into the camera. If you feel you need a boom mic after you test with the lav, buy an AT4053b, which is a hyper. Don't use a shotgun in that reflective situation.

Just try the lav. Or get the COS11d, with a 100.00 power converter (to convert phantom from the camera to a power the lav can use), and go wired to the camera. That will save you buying the wireless, but you may find you like the freedom of being wireless.

With the lav you will have the mic consistently at the same distance from your mouth, giving you consistent audio. That's important since you will have nobody monitoring your audio. Deal with the room reflections with some moving blankets from Costco, at about 8 bucks a piece.

Bam.

Consensus seems to be that a pre amp might be something I could add later, but isn’t likely a really required piece of equipment. (do you all agree?… alternate opinions welcome)

Therefore, I should put the money into a good Lavaliere, and perhaps a countryman E6.


LETS LOOK AT THE COUNTRYMAN E6 AGAIN.
I have noticed many stage performers are using microphones like this. Although most of them have it attached to their ear with the ‘tube’ going across their cheek to their mouths, some have it in their hair. Indeed, one performer had it going down the part in his hair ending on his forehead at his hairline. Therefore….. If I consider using the Countryman E6, could I mount it in a hat, with just the tip of the tube protruding? Would the tube ending on my forehead give decent sound? Although I do not intend to wear a hat throughout the video, I routinely wear a welders cap while I fabricate metal parts, so this option would work for many scenes.

Feedback?

Along a similar line, what if I used the standard ‘ear mount’ but used a shorter ‘tube’. I know this would move it away from my mouth, but I would prefer it to be less ‘in my face’. How would this option compare?

Thanks for any insight you can offer. Even after aggressive reading here on dvinfo and elsewhere (indeed I feel like I’ve been ‘stalking Ty Ford after reading almost everything he has posted over the last few years) I still am WAY OVER MY HEAD on this microphone decision.

Thank you all,
Greg

For a headset mic, the optimum position is usually close to the mouth. If you want a mic to be more discreet, or not seen at all, consider the B6. I've had great results when affixing a B6 to a hat, glasses, and at the hairline. Like a HS mic it moves with the head so it's very consistent and natural sounding, The only issue I have with B6 is it's very susceptible to wind. The vampire clip is an addition $10 or so, which is usually a must have.

...
Thanks for any insight you can offer. Even after aggressive reading here on dvinfo and elsewhere (indeed I feel like I’ve been ‘stalking Ty Ford after reading almost everything he has posted over the last few years) I still am WAY OVER MY HEAD on this microphone decision.

Thank you all,
Greg
Greg,

If it's any consolation, I've been looking at the audio side of video for months and it's still over my head too. (I need to buy Ty's book too.) I've been shooting pics for over 50 years and video for a little more than 10 years, so the video side is a little easier. But...

I didn't pay much attention to the audio side and I feel like a rank noob at audio. Now that I'm becoming more serious about video, I realized how important audio - in all its many flavors- is to good video. While it looks like audio preamp and recording technology has had some major changes in the last five years or so, it looks like people are still using 50 year old microphones to good effect. So there's 50 years of useful technology to choose from with lots of subtleties. IMO, it's reasonable to feel confused about microphones. (How's that for good justification?!? :-) )

Regards,

Dan.

For a headset mic, the optimum position is usually close to the mouth. If you want a mic to be more discreet, or not seen at all, consider the B6.

Still not clear (at least to me) what the downside of using a headset mic is? I didn't get the impression this was scripted, full suspension-of-belief drama here. If the OP is talking to the camera, the appearance of a little tube on one side should not be a big deal. Or have I missed something here? I just think that in that kind of ambient, even moving a mic as far away as collar or chest will make a huge difference in how much (undesired) ambient reverberation the mic captures. It could potentially make or break the feasibility of the project to the desired production value.

Except if the OP is not a pro voice there's possible problems. eg: using a headset mic could result in unwanted heavy breathing as he say leans out over the car hood.

Greg if this project is going to run 2+yrs rent all the contenders and try each one out .. being comfortable is also a major factor.

btw you could do a certain proportion of this as voice over .. probably have to anyway as you patch it up.

Cheers.

Still not clear (at least to me) what the downside of using a headset mic is?


Good question Richard, I’ve been wondering what my reservation is as well. I suppose a big part of it is that all the ‘how to’ videos and TV shows I watch and am using as models for this project use a lavaliere. Unfortunately, I don’t have the sound stage set they do (although the feedback I have received here has convinced me I need to spend $800 - $1500 on ‘echo control’) None the less, I think necessity is beginning to warm me up to the Countryman E6.

One comment I keep hearing that has really resonated with me concerns my head movement. I have spent the last couple evenings reviewing automotive DVD’s and TV shows watching their head motion. I now fully realize how they control head motion when using a lavaliere and this clearly shows how easy a Countryman E6 headset would be to use. So….

HERE’S THE NEW PLAN, WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS:

I am now thinking of getting a countryman E6 and a good lavaliere. I will ultimately need two microphones for sequences involving another worker, so I am inclined to buy both up front, rather than renting them first. This way I can play with both and choose the one I prefer to use in most of the shots and have the other available to use when it is needed. Perhaps I may occasionally use both at the same time so I can have the safety of redundancy and the ability to choose the best sound in post. This brings me to…

MIC SELECTION

HEADSET:
The Countryman E6 ($360) seems to be highly regarded. Indeed, it is the only one I’ve heard mentioned. Are there other choices I should look at?

LAVALIERE:
Here are my front running choices based on my research here on dvinfo:
1. Countryman B6 micro lav ($350)

2. Sanken Cos 11D ($450)

3. Tram TR50 ($310)

4. Sony ECM88B ($550)

So… what are everyone’s thoughts here?

Thanks again,
Greg

Get 1 & 2 and you're golden. Make sure you get them wired for the wireless transmitter you are using. It's not a one size fits all. You could also get a thing to run them wired that also powers them, which sounds better. I can't find a link, but they run about 100.00.

COS11d: Sanken COS-11 Lavalier at DVcreators.net (http://www.dvcreators.net/sanken-cos-11-lavalier/)

Cool Vampire clip: LMC SOUND | LavMicClip (http://www.lmcsound.com/)

Here's a little test I did when I got my COS11D:

Lavaliere Shootout: Sanken COS-11D Vs. Sennheiser ME-2 on Vimeo

If you go with the Sanken for a direct XLR output, make sure to order the version with the XLR converter. In black, the phantom-only version is the COS-11D-BK. The phantom/battery version is the COS-11D-BP-BK. They're the same price, but I seem to recall that the phantom only version has slightly better performance.

Down the road, you can always cut the wire and insert a TA3 connector pair if you want to make adapters for various wireless units. I bought a specific wireless model with a TA-5 and a generic XLR converter initially and it didn't work. I was able to buy the Sanken adapter separately, plus connectors, but it was a needlessly expensive path. Going for the official XLR version is the way to go.

If you have any questions, Martin at plus24 is very helpful and knowledgeable. (sales[-at-]plus24.net) plus24 is the US distributor and doesn't sell directly. I would imagine that they are the distributor for Canada as well.

Greg,

You've received a lot of good information here. You say:

<<I suppose a big part of it is that all the ‘how to’ videos and TV shows I watch and am using as models for this project use a lavaliere. >>

Those shows also probably have a dedicated sound mixer, a camera operator and a director. Not to mention lighting directors, gaffers, P.A.s, ad agency people, line producers, etc. My biggest concerns about what you are trying to do relate to the fact that you are doing them "unattended". If you get a big crackle in the audio while you are talking, you won't know it until you review the footage later. You will then need to try to reshoot that part and fit it in. What if the mic suddenly quits working? What if it just changes position enough that the sound quality changes dramatically? What if someone starts the washing machine in the next room and you can hear it on your sound track? All these things could be remedied immediately by a sound person. As far as video goes, How do you know that you are still in frame? How do you follow your movements without a camera operator? What about close ups?

I'm not trying to rain on your parade. You can produce something watchable all by yourself. It's just that it could take countless hours to keep redoing it to get it right. If you can do it with an audio person and camera op, it will make your life much easier (though will obviously cost more). In the end, I think it would be worth it.

Have fun!

Rob

Or better yet a camera guy who can also monitor the audio. Static shots with no movement are boring. I am an audio engineer, but I work as a One Man Band style video producer. Just one person wearing headphones, and gently following your moments with a camera will go a long way. Also you can pause and get close-ups. When working on engines, staying in wide shot will not convey a lot of what you're doing. Even if you got your wife to just monitor the audio for RF static bursts, and tell you you're in frame will really save a lot of grief. Especially since a retake means taking apart your engine.

Rob and Chad make good points. Having shot solo, dropped audio isn't a problem - but only if you can re-shoot. One thing for sure, 100% static camera shots will limit the quality of your project.

Regarding monitoring, the E6 might give you an extra advantage - it might allow you to wear a small in-ear monitor without looking too obvious. Monitoring one's self is far from foolproof, but if would at least let you hear that you have sound and no buzzes or crackles.

Two cameras can definitely help in the editing department. As said above, a wide, static shot is really boring. A second camera lets you show close work, and because it's done in one take, you can cut on motion for natural transitions. Trying to do multiple takes as an actor/director, it would be tough to ensure continuity across cuts. If you can get a camera op to move one camera while the other is static can help a lot.

B-roll is also your friend. You might consider getting a slider or home-built dolly. Showing a cam cover from sticks is dull. Handheld closeups can be shaky. But a macro view sliding down the piece can be dynamic and engaging. Since a car, parts and tools don't move on their own, camera motion is the key to bringing the project to life.

When you're on camera, a camera op will really help your project stay loose. Not only will you have camera movement, but you will have another person to engage with. Without an op, you risk making the project feel stiff.

You might contact a local school and find out if there are any video classes being given. You could talk with the instructor to see if they have any AV geeks (or gear heads) that they can recommend. You wouldn't think twice about hiring a kid to mow your lawn or feed the dog when you're on vacation. Why not hire one to be your production assistant? And if the local school is helpful, you might offer to speak to the class and tell them about your real-world project. You might just get some fans!

Yes, short of having another person help you, there is the option of using 2 cameras. One cam could be above you looking at what your hands are doing. Also, if you shoot in 1080p, you could put that footage in a 720p project, then zoom in digitally. It's not perfect, but done slowly, it will add dimension, and since you are editing in a 720p project, you aren't losing resolution when you zoom.

Here are some experiments I did with digital zooming. The camera was stationary on a tripod. With 2 cameras you could have a pretty dynamic show:

Ukulele Jam
YouTube - Joy To The World - Birthday Ukulele Jam - Rode NTG-3 Mic Test (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FEX5HinFdE)

Waste Time
YouTube - Waste Time - Chad Johnson - Original Song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M67SdL6ZhFQ)

Silly Earthquake Improvised Song
YouTube - Footage of 6.5 Earthquake in Eureka California 1//09/10 inspiring Improvised Silly Song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAXAGV39ZpM)

Thanks for the awesome advice on improving the quality of my ‘one man’ project.

The advice about static shots being boring is one of my fears!

Here are my thoughts on combating this problem. Each day will include two to three hours of work, likely resulting in a half hour of raw video. I anticipate setting up each one minute segment (for example) by starting with an opening on me discussing the next step, with my ‘script’ spoken over the full minute, without me doing any of the automotive work. Then change the camera position many times focusing on the work being done, including some with me as camera operator moving around the car part, etc. In post I anticipate using the shot of me as the basis of the segment (and all of the spoken script) and editing in the other cuts to show how the work is done.

To add camera motion I will likely have another worker join me for a short time each day to shoot ‘camera dolly’ and ‘reality hand held’ clips. These can then be cut in during the post work. This project really cannot support full time camera / audio operators (though I am being convinced to hire some for select shoots)

The idea of adding motion in post is also something I will utilize. Perhaps a second camera is in order as well (the budget gods will decide this).

As I video, I will be able to playback my work as I go to check for obvious video & audio issues.

Each day I will do the post production of the days work, identifying any additional shots I may need.



I also agree with the idea of taking film / audio classes but have yet to find anything local. The college wants me to enrol in a two (or more) year course, and I haven’t found any other local classes. Anyone know of some in your area that I could do on a vacation there? Something along the lines of an every day intensive three days on up to a two month set of classes would be awesome!


Any other ideas / advice?

Every day I learn and get closer to being properly prepared.
Thanks again,
Greg

This thread has gone from mics to production tips which I think are more helpful in this case. We're assuming you want to sell this series, too much work not to and you have to have something to aim for.

As I said ...

But if you're hoping to sell this and even though it's a long project at least use a camera operator.

If you don't it just won't work it's too restricting and you will end up with unusable footage resulting in frustration and wasted time to the point where you give up.



So you definitely need another person (cameraman) hopefully for the duration.
And it doesn't have to be a full time pro. A student to frame each shot, turn the camera on/off .. listen to the sound and most important check your continuity listening for any mistakes. You will make some over the years of production.

So you need to get an idea of each ep, prepare a breakdown and place running times in the margins. 30mins is long enough for this type of program .. leave breaks for commercials. Start each ep outside the garage or at a car show showing finished cars etc. Overshoot each ep with optional cuts for timing purposes .. and end each ep with some sort of cliffhanger.

Having done years of this, for you 2 cameras are overkill. With one camera after you shoot a sequence and you're having a break get your cameraman to shoot cutaways and closeups of the stuff you were just showing. You'll save costs big time .. and much tape.

And I wouldn't do any post production till you've finished shooting the first ep. Even with editing help you'll get better as you go and I'll bet you end up re cutting the first ep anyway. Before you shoot Ep2 run Ep1 past *reliable* people and have them fill out your questionnaire .. did they like it etc.

One thing I do if possible is shoot Eps 5-7, then do Eps1-4 so we have our chops fine tuned for the first impressions of the show .. tho it might not work in this case.

You better study lighting too, hire a one time pro to set that up.

Cheers.

This project doesn’t start for quite a while, so I have some lead-time to learn. On this note, I have just arranged a ‘warm up’ / practice project. Something shot in an automotive shop covering just one aspect of restoration. I will have a full time partner working with me on it who’s role will often be camera man (with his headphones on). I will buy and use the Countryman E6 through out to get comfortable with it and see how I feel using it. I think this sort of ‘warm up’ project is just the thing I need.

Thanks again everyone!

Please keep the advice coming,
Greg

PS. I will be away from my computer for the next two weeks, but will check back in as soon as I return, so don’t see my lack of response as any sign of loss of interest… Quite the opposite… I am very excited for this project now!

Allan's advise is excellent. Regarding two cameras, it's more a suggestion for shooting solo than if you have an assistant.

The thing that I still find amazing about video production is that we start with a vision, script, equipment and all that, yet I find it impossible to predict how the overall piece will feel. Music, graphics, pacing, and the emotional state of the talent can make things feel staid, frenetic, zany, sad, fluid, clunky, or whatever.

So spend a lot of time on the front end with your pilot. And don't be afraid to throw it in the garbage and start over. Once you develop your "franchise", it should really start to flow. But don't be surprised if your first cut doesn't begin to match your vision. Also, if you and your family and friends think it's really cool, don't stop there. Make sure that people who don't know you like it too.

Another thing to consider are your top strengths and your priorities. How will your project differentiate itself? What do you offer the viewer? Maybe it's great writing. Maybe you'll clown around. Maybe you'll focus on eye candy. Maybe the technical information will make this a must-have for home builders. Maybe you'll have great graphics, illustrations and transition music. Maybe you'll show great stuff from around town. Or maybe, you'll get emotional when stuff goes wrong and offer drama. (Orange County Choppers, anyone?)

By making it technically competent as well as entertaining, and by knowing your strengths and advantages, you'll be in a good position when it comes time to pitch the product.

Best of luck!

I have had some experience filming in workshops and sound is a nightmare. Asking mechanics to turn off their radios makes you instantly unpopular and most aren't patient enough to wait for you to setup, recompose or even to start recording. Hands get in shots all the time so at least two cameras is important.

If you do the work yourself and film it takes forever so you get tired and sloppy

I tried to use time lapse on this video to make a boring process a bit more interesting but my "production assistant " kept moving the car and camera which ruined some shots.

YouTube - Phat Sliggity :: Zipties ????? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OveJ8AsJ8Lo)