I'm not sure where here to put this since the 60D doesn't have a dedicated forum but I tested the 60D today and it does indeed down convert to 480 when you hit record. Too bad, it's the only real thing about it so far that's bothered me. Well that and the lack of a dedicated white balance button. If you guys have any other questions, I'll try my best to answer them.

Can you dial in the WB? e.g. 3400K ? Ta.

What are your general thoughts about it? I've been thinking of upgrading from the T2i because the articulating screen will be very useful for me, and SD output for external monitoring isn't a deal breaker for me.

I read on your twitter that you can use the stick-on mounts to use the Z-Finder as well, correct? Of course you can't close the screen, but you never had that option with other DSLR's :p

I'm curious about the audio quality if you were to plug in a wireless mic or an H4n that has mics plugged into it. Is it good or will you still need to record double system sound to obtain quality audio?

Dropping down to 480 is also not a deal breaker for me. The articulating screen would seem to work pretty well if you're shooting one man band interviews which I do a lot. Seems like you could use it as a field monitor for framing...albeit a one. Also, once you've recorded your clips, does the output to an HDMI equipped monitor stay in hi-def or is it also SD?

Thanks,

Forrest

1- The video output from the 60D DOES NOT drop down to 480P when recording.

2- You can choose to set the white-balance by dialing in the degrees Kelvin.

3- You have full MANUAL audio control.

4- Both the LETUS and ZACUTO LCD finders can be mounted underneath the camera, so you can pop the finder off when you want to use the 60D's articulated LCD feature.

Comparison of 7D vs 60D vs T2i for Video Work (http://cheesycam.com/canon-7d-vs-60d-vs-550d-t2i/)

1- The video output from the 60D DOES NOT drop down to 480P when recording.

My experience with the 60D we got in stock today is that it DOES indeed stop down to 480 while recording like Evan said.

Also, I believe you have to set the audio levels before you hit record on the 60D. Once recording there is no way to adjust the levels - without stopping the recording. Whilst this is way better than what's on the 7D I own (i.e. only AGC), kudos to Canon for listening, it's certainly NOT what I would call "full manual" recording control.

Sorry to be pedantic.... and I stress I've only read this from others on the web - but lots of folks are trying to make DSLR purchase decisions between T2i/60D/7D etc. and need correct FACTS about things like audio and HDMI output for video work so this seems like a good place to ensure that's what they get!

My experience with the 60D we got in stock today is that it DOES indeed stop down to 480 while recording like Evan said.

I've been shooting with the 60D for a couple of days now, and my 60D DOES NOT drop resolution when shooting.

It will change the monitor display depending on what you have the info display set to, but if you have the info display off ( essentially having the image fill the monitor screen ) the display keeps it's res when recording. ( i.e. I can easily read the type on a full newspaper page while shooting )

Also, I believe you have to set the audio levels before you hit record on the 60D. Once recording there is no way to adjust the levels - without stopping the recording. Whilst this is way better than what's on the 7D I own (i.e. only AGC), kudos to Canon for listening, it's certainly NOT what I would call "full manual" recording control.

Yes, there is no way to ride the audio levels while shooting, but you can set the camera recording level manually before pressing the record button. Without some sort of audio remote, I can't realistically see how you could control the audio while shooting. ( i.e. What controls on the camera would you like to do this with ? )

Guy,

My brother is sitting on the sides waiting some feedback on this cam, and one of his concerns is the res when monitoring.

-We know the 5D down res when rec is pressed,

-The 7D which I have doesn't down res.

-The 550D of t2i also downres when recording,

So just to confirm, your external LCD monitor maintains the 1080 res thru hdmi during record from the 60D?

May I know what monitor you are using? I have the SWIT 1070C.

Ted

So just to confirm, your external LCD monitor maintains the 1080 res thru hdmi during record from the 60D?

Is your concern about overall image fidelity, or just being able to focus properly while shooting ?

I'm at work at the moment, but I will post some photos of the monitor image before and during recording with the 60D tomorrow. It's possible I am mistaken, but this was something I was quite concerned about, mainly to be sure of accurate focus while shooting.

The image I am seeing with the 60D does change when the camera goes into record mode. To my eye it does not appear to be a res change, but more of an image quality change. The impression I get is that the image processor of the 60D sacrifices image quality during recording but detail is maintained. ( it's nothing like the 5D MKII )

The monitor I am using is not a proper cine monitor, but rather a Samsung 22" T220HD TV computer monitor. I shoot mainly corporate work indoors and clients appreciate the 22" size when on set. Other than judging color, this monitor works surprisingly well for my purposes. The native res of this monitor is 1680 x 1050 pixels, so it's not a true 1080P image, but I don't think there are any cine monitors under $3K that have a true native 1080P image. ( the larger Samsung models are true 1080P, but they are extra bulky to take on location )

Guy,
So just to confirm, your external LCD monitor maintains the 1080 res thru hdmi during record from the 60D?


There seems to be some confusion about monitor out during record. I received my 60D yesterday and just hooked it up to my Samsung HDTV: before hitting record the TV reports (as expected) 1920 x 1080 - after hitting record the TV reports 720 x 480. So it seems to have the same behavior as the 5D. That's exactly what I expected based on the manual. I don't plan on using an external monitor so that wasn't a deal breaker for me. If you want to use an external HD monitor during shooting the 7D seems to be the best choice.

I have to eat crow, as I was completely wrong...

I spent the whole weekend editing for work, and finally got home to test the LiveView output from the 60D tonight. I taped a newspaper to the wall and shot it with my 60D using a 100mm f2.0 lens. ( it's a sharp lens ) To monitor the video I connected my Samsung T220HD 22 inch monitor ( not a proper video cine monitor, but it's not bad, and you can easily tell when the image is in focus )

To show you what happens, I photographed the T220HD monitor with a Panasonic LX-5 pocket camera on another tripod. The granularity of the image is mostly caused by shooting with the LX-5 at 800 ISO. You can clearly see the difference between LiveView Paused and LiveView Recording. The green-stripe pattern is how the T220HD monitor photographs. ( I don't see any pattern when looking with my own eyes )

Canon 60D LiveView Paused
http://www.lingodingo.com/60dOutput/LiveViewPaused.jpg

Canon 60D LiveView Recording
http://www.lingodingo.com/60dOutput/LiveViewRecording.jpg

...The image on my 22 inch monitor also changes dimensions when LiveView is in REC mode, it gets thinner and slightly wider. ( nothing seems to be cut-off )

I am kind of pissed at how bad the image gets when in record mode, which means I am going to be stuck using an LCD finder instead of a monitor when I shoot with this camera. ( I plan on buying the Panasonic AF100 next Spring, but the 60D is the camera that is going to have to fill the DOF gap for the next 8 months )

Sorry about being so adamant about the whole 60D LiveView thing. ( I don't know why I did not get this right away )

So let me get this straight, the 7d is the only camera that has 1080 output from the hdmi while recording. if thats the case thats a big bummer for getting the 60d. Is it still possible to use the 480 output to focus correctly or would it be better to use the lcd to focus and the hdmi out for monitoring purposes. I really want the 60d more too, everything about it aside from the lack of a second processor and magnesium body I like better.

Peter,

Let me just say it this way, If I were to purchase a DSLR today, assuming I havent one yet, and I'm looking at both 7D and 60D in a store, I'd pick up the 7D. -even if in the corner of my eye is a 5D, and if I can only pick ONE. Thats what I'd do.

AND Then, if in the next week I'd have more money I might come back and get a 5D, if my cash is not enough for the new offerings coming soon, like an af100 and so on.

Thats how i would "probably" think.

Now that articulating screen might seem ok for some, but having worked with the 7D extensively, heres my conclusions; that while using a magnified finder on it to be able to focus through its LCD is ok in some instances, its not enough, so I had to use an external hi res LCD via HDMI.

A sample scenario is when the cam is on a track or dolly, which i do often, it would be difficult to pull focus since your recording while doing the track, and you would need to check it on an external monitor, even if you marked your focus. This is one instance the diminished resolution while recording on the 60D is really a negative thing.

The 7D only outputs 480p while recording as well. This has been confirmed by numerous people including Philip Bloom.

Nope.

Because I have confirmed it.

It retains resolution even while recording. Nothing changes in my HDTV and onboard HDMI monitor except a RED dot coming on and the center square disappearing and this While shooting a resolution chart.

Have YOU confirmed this yourself?

and also- Because i have also read Philips later blogs on this issue and he said it retains resolution. -but its merely academic since I do my own tech tests.

I don't own a 7D but, judging from Google search results, there is a lot of argument as to what's being output via HDMI while recording.

Yeah, thats true about the internet, you need to filter and do a lot of confirmation and reconfirmation.
Philip's blog also burned me on getting the zeiss softar filter which is kinda pricey, as a solution against moire, I have been using the caprock filter and it can be effective, so I tried what he said and it absolutely doesnt work, you can see my post rebutting the softar's effectiveness on that particular topic on his blog.

I'm not saying that most of his information is wrong, I have also picked up a lot there, but in this one it it was not right.

I have learned to filter information from those whom you think gives their conclusions after doing their own analytical and systematic tests since that is also how i confirm information.

Guy for instance went through the process of reconfirmation and found his initial observations incorrect, we can also learn a lot in these forums.

Peter,

Let me just say it this way, If I were to purchase a DSLR today, assuming I havent one yet, and I'm looking at both 7D and 60D in a store, I'd pick up the 7D. -even if in the corner of my eye is a 5D, and if I can only pick ONE. Thats what I'd do.

AND Then, if in the next week I'd have more money I might come back and get a 5D, if my cash is not enough for the new offerings coming soon, like an af100 and so on.

Thats how i would "probably" think.

Now that articulating screen might seem ok for some, but having worked with the 7D extensively, heres my conclusions; that while using a magnified finder on it to be able to focus through its LCD is ok in some instances, its not enough, so I had to use an external hi res LCD via HDMI.

A sample scenario is when the cam is on a track or dolly, which i do often, it would be difficult to pull focus since your recording while doing the track, and you would need to check it on an external monitor, even if you marked your focus. This is one instance the diminished resolution while recording on the 60D is really a negative thing.

That is exactly why i am leaning more towards the 7d, but at the same time i'm really conflicted because no matter what I buy now I'm sure in a few years/a year i am going to upgrade and the question that really comes down to it is how will the 60d hold its value compared to the 7d. I think the 7d is going to retain it very well but i'm not sure about the 60d. The articulating screen, the sdhc memory, and the manual audio are Huge perks to getting the 60d, but I also think having a 1080p output monitor is really important, especially if i want to undertake any serious focus pulling which is why I am inclined to lean more towards the 7d unless there was some other method to with the 60d.

If canon released a firmware for manual audio on the 7d i'm almost positive i would buy one instead.

For serious work, even if you can control audio in the camera, you'd still rather do it with separate recorder.

I use the Zoom h4n.

I only use the audio of the camera as a guide track. For Not too serious work, then it doesnt matter if it is auto or not.

Let me add, that on one big project, I didn't bring my audio recorder since the spec didn't call for on site audio.
BUT there was this native music performers that I needed to record so I just held the camera near them , recorded their performance and found the music quite acceptable.

See here at 2:10, you can hear that the on board 7D audio is certainly acceptable. NO external mics! - I assume it will have same to slightly better results on the 60D.
link;
Costabella By Ted Ramasola On ExposureRoom (http://exposureroom.com/costabella/)

For serious work, even if you can control audio in the camera, you'd still rather do it with separate recorder.

I use the Zoom h4n.

I only use the audio of the camera as a guide track. For Not too serious work, then it doesnt matter if it is auto or not.

well see the thing is i have the zoom h4n and i love it. i was actually thinking about running a 3.5mm jack from the camera to the h4n. that way audio can be handled primarily from the boom operator but levels will be constant in the camera. that way i can sink sound if i have to but its already in sync so there is really no reason to. the beauty of this way is that the audio doesn't really need to be adjusted from the camera, it just needs to be constant. Whatever adjustments can be handled in the zoom and instantly recorded straight to the camera. and 3.5 mm jacks are really cheap, i'm sure i could find a long heavy duty one for a very reasonable price.

is there any chance of the 60d being able to have a firmware hack to allow 1080p output while recording. or perhaps a 7d crack or firmware update that will give it manual audio. i need one of these solutions!

The cable you use from the zoom to camera need to be attenuated. I had my 2 cables custom made by my techie cousin. I guess you can have it long.

Tremel wasnt able to finish the 7D hack though. I doubt the 60 can be updated for full HD out while recording since it only has ONE digic processor.

I also think that as a stills camera, the single digit models of canon has a higher resale value than the double digits.

So if you would get a DSLR and in the near future decide to sell it cuz a new camera comes along (this is a certainty) the 7D would fetch better than the cheaper 60D.

I say this cuz I truly think, that just like the 35 adapters, DSLRs is a phase we are passing through much quicker than the era of adapters.

I can say that with certainty since I have made and used successfully 3 lens adapters, one for mid format lens and now use a DSLR.

wasn't there a firmware hack for the 5d that gave it full 1080 output. i'm pretty sure thats only one digic chip as well. though you are probably right, the chances are far more likely the 7d gets manual audio. but seriously having a articulating screen and 1080 out with sdhc would be a dream! i just wish that they had given the 7d an articulating screen which iknow goes against all things photo, but the fact that you can use it in the exact same way as well as cover the screen actually can make it better for protection... what am i rambling about, it doesn't matter anyways. now to decide if it makes sense to wait for the release of the next gen cameras or buy something now. i don't really have a project to shoot right now, but i have been stockpiling old manual lenses and i am just inkling to give them a proper test and just film a bunch of footage. i'm really hoping the next gen of dslr's will have less aliasing.