The theme of UWOL 18 is "intimate details". Yet, trying to get decent detail into 60 MB of low rez footage is getting to be a real drag. I don't get why this is the last challenge on the web that posts its entries that way.

Dear Chris:

Patience friend! Yes, this forum is about spectacular film footage. It is about wildlife and our love for the wild creation around us that bless us everyday. It is about pushing ourselves to the best we can be as filmmakers... it is about all of this, and more...

But there is also one other reason for this forum and that is in the name of Meryem Ersoz. And these are her parting words for this forum:

_____________________________________________________

Here is our plan for the future:

Your next 3 Challenges will be run by our Interim Field Guide - Cat Russell. I selected Cat to take the reins because I believe that she -- and the work that she has done here in our UWOL Challenge forum -- best embody the spirit of the contest. She has learned so much since the early days and is always quick to share that knowledge with others. I know she will try her best to serve all of the players with wisdom and integrity. Plus, she has that deep, abiding planetary love, which you all share, and which has always been the heart and soul of the Challenge.

She will be running the next 3 Challenges with the consistency of the original Challenge, every other month, to get the UWOL mojo flowing again. At the end of the trial, if she likes the work, she will take over as your permanent contest coordinator and will be free to make any changes to the contest.

I know that UWOL rules need an overhaul to get them up to speed with changes in technology, and some of the reasons that we had for establishing the original rules are now obsolete. But it will be easier for her to stick to the guidelines, initially, because she knows them well, and to re-establish the consistency of the contest.

After that, if she chooses to accept this Ultimate Challenge, it will be hers and it will be open season for you all to make all the changes you like. An overhaul of the contest is overdue, and this will be the appropriate time to make changes. Give her a little space to navigate the waters first.

Three Challenges will also give us plenty of time to see if the contest still has longevity or whether, like a flower, it was something destined to blossom, flourish, bring a little beauty and happiness to our lives, and return to seed.

I always have said that UWOL is the players, not me, or my hare-brained ideas (apologies to hares everywhere...). I hope that I have left you in good hands and thank you for all of the inspiration and love that the contest has brought to me. And to your planet, spaceship Earth.

________________________________________

There are many ways to train ourselves, and one of the best ways is with a serious liability (I can attest to this personally). The first film I ever made was because of the UWOL inspiration and challenge. For two years I shot with a low down standard camera because that was all I had to work with. The only time I placed in the UWOL forum was with the challenge "Night" where it evened the playing field just a tiny bit and I placed not only with horrible footage, but with a fun story line. I make this point not to bring the attention to me, but back to the spirit and inspiration of UWOL and to Meryem. I can only speak for myself, but think about it... is it not in your own limitations that you find yourself that you learn to excel? We find a way, we define our own signature in film not only by our strengths, but our weaknesses.

According to Meryem, we have two more UWOL challenges to go before we as a group reassess everything. How we play, who will lead and if you as filmmakers feel it is in your benefit that UWOL continue. I am here first to make certain Meryem's concerns for UWOL continue as far as she has spelled out for us. After that, everything friends is all up to you. I am backing you guys up all the way.

So Chris! To make a very long-winded entry shorter... you make a wonderful point, but wait just two more challenges before you pose the proposition again!

Until then....

Cheers, and have fun with all the grace that you have to run with!!!!!!

Cat

Chris

The idea was always that we wanted to store the uwol films in a way that developed a back catalogue. It was also to create an even playing field. It would be lovely if uwol had its own integrated encoding and auto storage engine. I have actually looked into this and who knows, it may happen.

However I don't really see what the problem is. Go and look at Per's entry this round. A great looking video in 17mb ! (I don't know hows he's done that either...but anyway). Added to this everyone can and usually does also post vimeo/youtube versions !

Mat

I do believe that the 60 mb limitation does not work very well for those shooting HD! I never watch them and always watch the larger vimeo/utube files. Perhaps if you want to spend 5 or 6 hundred dollars on sorenson squeeze you might get slightly better images.

Dale - It makes no difference what you're shooting when the resolution is 428x240. Also bare in mind someone's having to store (and pay) for all these videos, so we need to keep a lid on the file sizes.

And as I said in my previous post, what's the problem when everyone can post alternative versions anyway!?

However I don't really see what the problem is. Go and look at Per's entry this round. A great looking video in 17mb ! (I don't know hows he's done that either...but anyway). Added to this everyone can and usually does also post vimeo/youtube versions !



Not sure how he does that either, but also it doe have something to do with what is in the frame. In his case, he was defocused in most of the frame, and so in a variable bit rate scheme, probably a lot less resources taken up. In my file with a lot of plant lift blowing in the wind, the limited amount of available bits causes loss in the images.

Looking back, I see less and less participation in UWOL, and I wonder if it is partly because of this limitations put on the presentation of the films for judging.

Of course, I don't do this for a living, and I use UWOL just to get my butt out in nature once in a while, but I would think those who take wildlife filming seriously want their work to be presented in the best format possible.

less and less participation in UWOL is my fault, period -- primarily due to my increasing inability to follow through based on too many demands on my time.

I don't think the lack of activity has anything to due with the required compression schemes.

In any case, it has already been stated that this issue will be re-visited at the close of the next 3 Challenges, one of which has already ended - this gives Cat a chance to administer the game by rules which are familiar to her and the regular players. After that, if she wants to continue running Challenges, she will open a discussion with players and with Mat and Kevin to make the necessary revisions. If not, I'll do it. UWOL won't die, as long as players want to play, it just needs re-invented a bit.

Mat's point that we have all of our films in one place has been a very important one, UWOL has a tremendous archive, catalog, and resource that is pretty much unrivaled anywhere on the web.

Major changes are going to happen in a timeframe which benefits everyone involved in UWOL, not just players, although that is an obvious consideration, but also the judges and contest coordinators.

For example, it's a disservice to an outside judge and an additional imposition on his or her time to have to wade through the chaos of threads in a sub-forum to find everyone's Vimeo. What you may perceive as solving one problem creates unintended consequences of a different order. The coordinators' job is to think these things through, on your behalf and with your input, to keep an orderly contest. When the time is appropriate.

But no one is disagreeing with you, Chris, that it's time to change the way we post films - it has already been a matter of discussion among your friendly contest coordinators. Just give Cat a chance to understand how the contest runs from the other side of the fence. You are in good hands.

I’m sure this is one of those situations where I should probably just keep my mouth shut, but I’m going to jump in here because of one statement with which I very strongly disagree. I do not at all think that any loss of participation is due to Meryem. To the contrary, I think she has worked very hard to keep things going in the face of other factors which may be in play. Some people never intended to participate more than once. They had an idea to express, and having done so, have moved on to other pursuits. Some of us have had changing circumstances in our lives-like babies or new jobs- which now, by necessity, take up the time once devoted to the challenge. Some do not possess an extensive kit of expensive equipment and may feel that their efforts are not appreciated around here. (To which I say, Posh!) Other people are very competitive. Let’s face it, we have a handful of very talented and experienced people around here with which it is very difficult to compete. Some, I think, have decided-”I’m never going to win, so why bother?” (Again I say, Phui!)

I think there is a larger issue here which should be addressed. We seem to have fallen into a rut where the only ones which comment on the videos are those which have completed a video that round. It’s almost like commenting on everyone’s videos has become a duty of completion rather than a privilege. Some feel that if you cannot (or will not) offer a suggested improvement or point out a fault, then don’t comment at all. Nonsense. I can only offer myself by way of example. In my personal life I have absolutely no one to talk to about video. Everyone I know thinks what I do is foolish and an extreme waste of my meager resources. Few pass up any opportunity to express their opinions. At times I get very discouraged. While I very much value the comments with concrete suggestions on how to improve, the comments which have meant the most to me are very much along the lines of-”I watched your video. It isn’t perfect, but keep going!” Your encouragement has got me through many a lonely night. I think rather than pointing out in the rules that by signing up for a challenge you are committing to completing a video we should recognize that sometimes life intervenes and prevents that. (I think increasing the time from three weeks to four weeks will help in this respect, but this is a tangent to be pursued at a later time.) I think the rules should say that by signing up you are committing to try to complete a video, and further that you will watch all the videos and offer comments- even if the only thing you have to say is “I took a few moments from my busy life to watch your video”.

If somebody would please make up a 300x250 banner for
the UWOL Challenge, I'll be more than happy to put it on
the front page of the DVi site...

Chris,

How about we use the uwol logo as a banner?
What file format do you prefer?

Mike,

I actually have to agree with you!!!

I have virtually no one to cominicate with about what i do, the perk of living out on the fringe (in more ways than one). I learn as much or more from watching others and reading the various critiques as from my own!!



The bar is pretty high and is just about unreachable for this slightly older guy, and I really would not want it any other way.

Competition is fun and a driving force, but in the big picture that is not what it is about.

To me it is all about learning and inspiration, in this game (so to speak) this is the best place I have been able to find.

To me it is all about learning and inspiration, in this game (so to speak) this is the best place I have been able to find.
This is the main reason I'm here too. Not to forget the great friends we got here.
I could care less if I win or not. I have so much fun making the uwol videos, I learn a lot from the feedback I get from all of you, and by watching your videos.
UWOL is a big part of my life.

Oops, looks like Meryem wrangled a banner for me awhile back.
I thought so just after I made my post above. Here it is... about
to go on the front page... but it's 250px wide. I'll use it until some
kind soul provides one that's 300px wide. Need JPG, GIF or PNG.

Very good, Chris!
That banner will be great!! Thank you!

Edit:
Added UWOL banner for Chris... And bummer, it's too tall.
Stay tuned for a correct sized banner in next post...

Ehm, edit once more:
This one is actually 300 x 250. I screwed up the one in my next post instead...

I made one too, but you're way ahead of me Trond. Go for it!

UWOL banner, finally in the requested 300 x 200 pixels.
Chris, I hope this one is good enough.

Edit:
Yeah yeah, wrong size... next post will be the best. I promise!!!

Mike. I agree with a lot of your sentiment.

Apart from actually being motivated to get out there and finish a project which I think is the main thing uwol gives us the critique has always been something of importance. That said I've always moaned that there is too much in the way of pats on the back and not enough constructive critique. The uwol family has helped me to achieve some very cool things over the past year and I now have plenty of real world wildlife film making contacts. For a number of years I was very much in the same situation of doing something some friends didn't really understand or thought was a little odd. Funnilly enough that has now changed!

I'd like to say that I'd involve and help any of our community in a much bigger way than a few words of critique if they need it. Just shout and I'll do anything I can.

Okay, here we go again. This time with the 300 x 250.

I'd like to say that I'd involve and help any of our community in a much bigger way than a few words of critique if they need it. Just shout and I'll do anything I can.
This is the true UWOL spirit! I'm sure most of us here would be happy to help in any way we can. I know I would too.

Thanks Mat. I very much applaud your attempts to move us toward more constructive comments. I’ve been trying to do more in that regard lately and I hope you’ve noticed. (I certainly wasn’t trying to single you out and I hope you didn’t feel that I was!) As you know, it’s a delicate balance. Some people are very sensitive to any criticism. It has to be offered gently. Also, I really don’t want to lose the sense of encouragement which has meant so much to me. You are very much better at this than I. (Take your comments on my video this round for example.) I’m trying to learn from you in this regard (and others!) and I think this is an area where we can all improve ourselves.

Thank-you so much for your kind offer of help! I know many of us will want to take you up on that. I do.

I’m sure this is one of those situations where I should probably just keep my mouth shut, but I’m going to jump in here because of one statement with which I very strongly disagree. I do not at all think that any loss of participation is due to Meryem. To the contrary, I think she has worked very hard to keep things going in the face of other factors which may be in play. Some people never intended to participate more than once. They had an idea to express, and having done so, have moved on to other pursuits. Some of us have had changing circumstances in our lives-like babies or new jobs- which now, by necessity, take up the time once devoted to the challenge. Some do not possess an extensive kit of expensive equipment and may feel that their efforts are not appreciated around here. (To which I say, Posh!) Other people are very competitive. Let’s face it, we have a handful of very talented and experienced people around here with which it is very difficult to compete. Some, I think, have decided-”I’m never going to win, so why bother?” (Again I say, Phui!)

Mike, as a "relative" new comer to the UWOL Challenge I could not agree with you more. It's unfortunate that this is buried in this topic since I fear it may get over looked. I'm sure we'd all like to win, but speaking for myself; winning is not my ultimate goal. I enjoy getting out into the world and making videos; hopefully that others can enjoy watching.

I think there is a larger issue here which should be addressed. We seem to have fallen into a rut where the only ones which comment on the videos are those which have completed a video that round. It’s almost like commenting on everyone’s videos has become a duty of completion rather than a privilege. Some feel that if you cannot (or will not) offer a suggested improvement or point out a fault, then don’t comment at all. Nonsense. I can only offer myself by way of example. In my personal life I have absolutely no one to talk to about video. Everyone I know thinks what I do is foolish and an extreme waste of my meager resources. Few pass up any opportunity to express their opinions. At times I get very discouraged. While I very much value the comments with concrete suggestions on how to improve, the comments which have meant the most to me are very much along the lines of-”I watched your video. It isn’t perfect, but keep going!” Your encouragement has got me through many a lonely night. I think rather than pointing out in the rules that by signing up for a challenge you are committing to completing a video we should recognize that sometimes life intervenes and prevents that. (I think increasing the time from three weeks to four weeks will help in this respect, but this is a tangent to be pursued at a later time.) I think the rules should say that by signing up you are committing to try to complete a video, and further that you will watch all the videos and offer comments- even if the only thing you have to say is “I took a few moments from my busy life to watch your video”.

Although I think this may be "straying" into some areas of discussion that Cat and Meryem would prefer we put aside for now; you touch on some points that are central to my goals for UWOL -- "how do I make better videos". I am my own worst critic and so far most of the critiques of my videos have pointed out faults that I am painfully aware of; but I still want to hear them. And of course the real nuggets are when someone suggests an alternate approach or an addition that would have made the video better.

I think all of us enjoy finding other film makers to talk to. Most of my friends just smile and nod when I tell them I am going to spend the next several hours hiking up some trail just to take some pictures or shoot video. Although she supports me, I'm sure my wife thinks I have entered my second childhood.

Apart from actually being motivated to get out there and finish a project which I think is the main thing uwol gives us the critique has always been something of importance. That said I've always moaned that there is too much in the way of pats on the back and not enough constructive critique. The uwol family has helped me to achieve some very cool things over the past year and I now have plenty of real world wildlife film making contacts. For a number of years I was very much in the same situation of doing something some friends didn't really understand or thought was a little odd. Funnilly enough that has now changed!

I'd like to say that I'd involve and help any of our community in a much bigger way than a few words of critique if they need it. Just shout and I'll do anything I can.

Mat, at least for me the motivation is really important. The motivation to film, to edit, to just get out into the world is one of the key benefits of the challenge. And offers to help those of us just getting into the world of UWOL are priceless. I know I always cringe a little when reading some critiques, but in the end I think I'm becoming a more accomplished videographer.

on the contrary, Cat and Meryem are always excited to see you all discuss - any way and any time - the topic of "how do you make better videos?" - it is the heart of the endeavor. side conversations on the subject are always most welcome.

we only ask that you table the "how do we make a better contest?" discussion until Cat and I complete the transitional tasks at hand, and then you can unleash all of your pent-up suggestions, grievances, and brilliant ideas onto the UWOL community.