Does anyone have one of these they'd like to sell? I believe there is a Sony VCL-EX0877 and a Century HD one, are there others on the market?

yes, there are some, from 0.5 to 0.8, Zunow is probably the best, but pricy,
I use Century Optics, it's a good lens, for the money :)
PMW EX1 wide angle lens (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?Ntt=PMW+EX1+wide+angle+lens&N=0&InitialSearch=yes)

I like the Century brand...but it's so pricey! This one from 16X9 Inc. is my favorite.

I bought one of these wide angle zoom thru's for my own EX3 and could not be happier!

Plus they sell a lens hood to fit.

16x9 Inc. :: 16x9 Inc. EXII 0.8X Wide Converter - 77mm Thread (http://16x9inc.com/shop/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=57)

B&H lists it for a better price.
16x9 Inc. 169-HDWC8X-77 EXII 0.8x Wide Angle 169-HDWC8X-77 B&H

In case you haven't read this thread:
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-xdcam-ex-cinealta/144243-century-precision-vs-sony-vcl-ex0877-3.html

I had the Century .6x lens, and found it too wide for anything but special effects shots. I'm going to try a less wide .8x

I have to awake this old thread. My needs are still the same as written earlier in this thread (http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-xdcam-ex-cinealta/144243-century-precision-vs-sony-vcl-ex0877.html#post1035890).
I still film large sclae fireworks displays from around 150 to 500m distance and I own two Sony VCL-EX0877 (one in spare). I still like this heavy piece of glass, although it is noticeably unsharp at iris open f1.9, especially at all outer parts of the image. But I remember some comments, that this is normal for f1.9 - f2.8/f4. I fully open Iris at light golden effects but use f2.8-f4 for almost all other effects.
But - there are so many displays, where I either have to be too close and there is no chance to move backwards and/or the fireworks fronts are so wide and heigh, that the 0.8x is simply not enough.

So I urgently need a wider angle for my EX1R, 0.5x or 0.6, at least 0.65 for some displays. Barrel distortion is not that big problem to me, if it bends the ground or water horiziont only. I mostly have no other straight lines like buildings in my pictures at night. Light vignetting at the edges is no problem too, since I film at night sky only when using the wide angle.

I've followed theses threads:
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-xdcam-ex-cinealta/504271-wide-angle-adapters-ex1r.html
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-xdcam-ex-cinealta/144243-century-precision-vs-sony-vcl-ex0877.html
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-xdcam-ex-cinealta/235715-ex1-wide-angle-pros-cons.html

So, it looks like these lenses are possible for my needs:
Century Schneider Optics .6X Wide Angle Adapter (https://www.schneideroptics.com/Ecommerce/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?CID=1434&IID=6368) $490
Century Precision 0.6x $390
Red-Eye .65x Wide Angle Adapter (http://www.abelcine.com/store/Red-Eye-.65x-FX-HD-Wide-Angle-Adapter-77mm/) $470
16x9 .6x Wide Angle Adapter $294
Cavision BWA06X86B-EX1 0.6x Broadcast Wide Angle BWA06X86B-EX1 $322
Cavision LWA05X86B-EX1 0.5x Broadcast Wide Angle LWA05X86B-EX1 $495

Search at B&H:
PMW EX1 wide angle lens | B&H Photo Video (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?Ntt=PMW+EX1+wide+angle+lens&N=0&InitialSearch=yes)

I've read this warning at the Century Schneider 0.6x:
Focusing on the Sony PMW-EX3/EX1/EX1R

Like all wide adapters, the Century .6X attachment uses the macro feature of the camera to achieve focus. Be sure the macro mode is enabled and the focus gear is engaged to auto focus, rotate ring 180 degrees.

NOTE: The full manual focus mode will not allow the adapter to focus and therefore CANNOT be used in conjunction with wide adapters.

There is no way not to use auto focus when filming fireworks displays. Normally I use full zoom in, focus with peaking, zoom back to Z0 and that's it. Since probably any lense mentioned above is not zoom through, it should at least allow manual focussing with peaking at 1/4 - 1/3 zooming in and then zoom back. Will that be possible with any of that lenses?

Just from what is written here in forums, at B&H and for my taste these are my favorites:
16x9 .6x Wide Angle Adapter $294
Cavision BWA06X86B-EX1 0.6x Broadcast Wide Angle BWA06X86B-EX1 $322
Cavision LWA05X86B-EX1 0.5x Broadcast Wide Angle LWA05X86B-EX1 $495

Especially the 0.5x from Cavision or the 16x9 0.6x (but with $150 extra for the hood which I need) seem to be fine.
Any recommendation on these 3 (2) lenses for my needs? Especially regarding on manual focussing and image sharpness at full width (with the 0.5x I probably could go to Z5 in most cases)?

Any hint is appreciated, thanks a lot in advance!

The Sony is zoom-through. I have one that I use on my EX1r.

Thanks, but I have the Sony 0.8x and need a wider adapter.
I've found an older thread which has some more info: http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-xdcam-ex-cinealta/471693-best-wide-angle-ex1.html

It looks like as if full manual mode is not possible anymore. Instead one has to go to auto mode with macro set to on - and focus manually. Is this really the case? I don't have to zoom while filming when the adpater is on. I have to find the focus once, best with zooming fully (with the Sony) or partly in (with the 16:9 which ist partly zoom through), check manually the focus with peaking (almost in darkness, auto focus won't work!) and then zoom fully back.
Will this be possible with the 16x9 Inc. 169-HDWA6X-EX EXII 0.6x Wide Angle Adapter?

Most of the wide 'adapters' do not hold focus when you zoom, particularly when on the long end of the lens, thus you can't zoom in for focus and zoom out. You would need to set the focus when the lens is at your shooting focal length.
As long as macro is enabled you should be able to focus manually without having to press the 'auto-focus' button.
I can't speak about the specific lenses, since I use the Sony 0.8 converter.

Thank you, Dave, for making it clearer to me! To be sure:
Does the problem of not holding the focus occur even with adapters, which are "partly zoom through" like the 16:9 0.6x? I would expect that one could zoom in for maybe 1/4-1/3 for focussing, after reading that comment on B&H:
Though not a full zoom-thru, you can zoom about 1/3 of the way in and still be in focus, making it more like a 35mm WA
I really would prefer to find the focus while beeing zoomed in, at least a little.

Does anybody use that 16x9 .6x Wide Angle Adapter, which seems to fit my needs? Some comments would be great before ordering from the US to Europe. I would also order the hood to protect from fireworks debris and hope, it can't be seen in the image even at Z0...

I have the Cavision 0.5x for sale. Pristine condition, used sparingly. Message me if interested (would prefer to sell in the USA for obvious reasons - not sure about shipping overseas).

I have a 16x9 .6 for sale if you are interested. PM me $200

So, the 16x9 0.6 arrived - and I am fully disappointed. Just see the attached image. Although its anly a quick check (1080i at f2.4) with a wild background one can easily see, that the left side is much, much softer than the middle and even the right side is much better. That result can be reproduced on other scenes, with f4 or more - its always the same although its not that visible with more closed iris.
I received the 16x9 from a big seller, obviously heavily used before - so I assume it was ordered and tested several times before reaching me... and always was sent back.

The focus is simply not uniform. One can focus on the left side, then the middle an the right side is soft.
But there is only slight barrel distortion and no visible vingetting at Z0 - but it's unusable though.

I am not sure it this is some fundamental design problem of the 16:9 lense or if this piece I received is damaged/ununiform by chance. In any case it comes to late for the next important job...

Any comment is appreciated.

Hi Markus, I also do fireworks with the EX1 these days so "I feel
your pain."

The zoom lens in the EX1 is operating totally differently at Z99 than Z0 and you
just can't expect it to hold focus with a wide angle conversion lens.
The EX1's zoom lens was not designed to hold focus with the a-focal conversion
lens out front and it won't. At least, not well enough fireworks. In my experience,
fireworks have to be as in focus as possible to look right so you can't take shortcuts
like zoom in and refocus. Maybe if we were running at f/6 but not at f/1.9.

If you want fireworks that are as in focus as can be, you need to focus the camera
at the zoom position you want to run the camera at. For me, this means using the
expanded focus. Due to Petzval and astigmatism induced by the conversion lens,
not all of the field will be at the same focus even with a good converter. The aberrations
should be radially symmetric about the center of the image, that is, if the center of the
field is in focus that outside edges will be (invariably) way out of focus.

With a good conversion lens (century 0.6 non-zoom-through), you don't want to have any
extremes of out of focusness. This means trying to make the focus best in a region of
the image that is a ring around the center. You should be able to balance the aberrations
across the image by picking the mid-point between dead center and extreme edge and
making sure that is in focus.

It sounds like you have a bad conversion lens, though. You can get the left or the middle
or the right in focus. It isn't radially symmetric and this is not the aberration you would
expect from a system that is operating as well as it could given the circumstances. Th
16x9 glass might be tilted relative to the camera or the 16x9's optical axis is not the
same as the camera's optical axis. Or it could just be a bad lens. While the 16x9's may
be great for daylight filming, I am suspicious of them for fireworks.

I have had decent luck with the century 0.6x non-zoom through. I also have the century 0.45x
and although it is not as nice as the 0.6x, I can use it for some fireworks shots now and then.
You really don't want to go much below 0.6x. Every increment below about 0.7x and you
pay a heavy price in uncorrectable petzval/astigmatism with the non-zoom-through
converters. Even the zoom through converters can't fix much of it.

I have also had decent luck with the cavision converters (e.g. a 0.7 on an ex1) but I trust
the centurys for the extreme 0.6x and 0.45x. I haven't tried a cavision 0.6. Based on
the still image of the 16x9 you attached, I am reasonably certain you would have better
luck with the century 0.6x. Now you can't run the century at Z0, though. There is
a big of vignetting and I think you have to move to Z5 or Z8 to get full brightness across
the image.

The only way to get a truly nice wide angle is to go to an EX3 and put a
dedicated wide angle lens on it. I think the good fujinon is $13k USD though. I can't
afford the rental on that for the fireworks videos I work.

Hello Dustin,

thank you so much for hooking in! The pain is not just when it does not work as expected. The pain is much bigger, when one feels alone with the specific problems. The fireworks things we could share via private mail, I just comment the wide angle related points:

The big seller did immediatly sent me a new 16x9 0.6x. Hopefully this time it is brand new, it will arrive next week already.

The 16x9 glass might be tilted relative to the camera or the 16x9's optical axis is not the same as the camera's optical axis.
The 16x9 fits well on the EX1R bajonett, but is movable a little for 1mm or so. It seems, that this mm is not responsible for the huge softness on the left side.
Could be my EX1R be a little "defect" (not perfect optical axis)? With my Sony VCL0877 0.8x there is a softness on the right side of the image. But it is much less so I can live with it, although I would like to avoid. I am somehow afraid that my EX1R has to be fixed instead of buying different adapters. Could this be: heavy softness on left side with 16x9 but moderate softness on the right side with the Sony VCL0877?

I do not zoom while recording fireworks. I film at Z0 only but use zoom in-focus-zoom out to get a safe focus in dawn or even darkness. Often it is impossible to be in position at daylight and wait till the display.

It seems, that the 16x9 is "sharp" (=same focus) from Z0 upto Z50! From Z53/54 it totally loses focus. I have to check how far the focus works in reality on 50'' TV when the new lense arrives.

So, the Century could be better for me?! The few comments at B&H led me to a different opinion:
Century Precision Optics 0HD-06WA-EX1 0.6x Wide 0HD-06WA-EX1 B&H

16x9 Inc. 169-HDWA6X-EX EXII 0.6x Wide Angle Adapter (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/624190-REG/16x9_Inc_169_HDWA6X_EX_169_HDWA6X_EX_EXII_0_6x_Wide.html/BI/2855/KBID/3801)
And zooming in to Z5 or Z8 takes more of the image. In the end it comes again a littler closer to the Sony VCL0877 0.8x. Mmmmhhh, I just would use it for huge, wide front displays. For all other displays and distances the 0.8x is good enough.

Beste regards and thank you again,
Markus

I have no experience with the 16:9 adapter, so I cannot speak to that, but I have used several Century Optics adapters with great success, and can wholly endorse the .6 as an inexpensive and reliable option. You have to accept some barrel distortion on something this wide, (goes with the territory) but what keeps surprising me is the repeated comment that the adapter is 'non zoom through'. While this is technically correct, you CAN zoom through it a considerable amount. This makes it much more versatile, and also reduces barrel distortion as you zoom in. The key is to set the camera for auto focus and macro 'on', and let the camera focus. Then you can turn auto focus 'off', and manually focus if you prefer, as well as zoom to your desired focal length. Once you zoom past the macro range, you immediately lose focus, but zooming back into macro range will bring it right back. (this also can be used for effect) I did some comparisons of different Century Optics adapters a couple of years ago:
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-xdcam-ex-cinealta/477833-century-wide-adapters-comparison.html
You can see the range of zoom on the .6 and fisheye. (I have both) If you truly want a fully zoom through wide, the .75 is a good option (but much bigger and heavier) or if you have an EX3 the Fuji wide lens available is pretty decent for the price. (I also use one of these) For the EX1, you have no choice but to use an adapter.
A bigger question to me is, how can you shoot fireworks with an EX? I would think the flash banding would be a problem on the really bright ones!

Flash banding is a problem for people whose fireworks are too small (e.g. 1.4G
or consumer fireworks) or people who like to record electric flash tubes at weddings.

Big display fireworks that are worth recording emit lots of energy have slow rise
and fall times in brightness compared to a flash tube. You don't get a hard edge
in general because it takes a long time for the chemical reaction to spool up and
spool down, even for the salutes. It usually is a slow fade that is about 1/3 to 1/4
the screen height _if_ you can perceive it. As long as your are doing 59.95 fields
or frames per second, the flash banding is less annoying than other problems like
near-IR pollution, white balance and wide angle adapter aberrations.

Back on the main problem, Markus, you might want to find a brick wall
and test your EX1's lens without an adapter on it. The wide angle adapters
are just going to make the performance worse from there. You want to
face the EX1 straight at the wall and run around f/2.0 with no ND filters in
place. You should see all of the bricks in decent focus with maybe the
extreme corners looking a little unclear. You should be able to have
the left middle and the right middle of the frame is decent focus at the
same time. You should try this at Z0 and Z10. I find that my EX1's
are a little soft everywhere at Z0 but by Z10 or so its good across the whole
image. Zoom lenses are precarious things so you can' expect them
to be perfect at the extremes.

As for the B&H comments on the century, those comments can be divided
into "it isn't zoom through", "it shows dust" and "it has barrel distortion" which
are all things one should expect from a non-zoom through wide angle adapter.


It seems, that the 16x9 is "sharp" (=same focus) from Z0 upto Z50! From Z53/54 it totally loses focus.


Past Z53, the EX1 can't focus close enough given how long the focal length has
become. The focus is really close to the front of the lens to begin with
since you started out in macro mode. Eventually you turn the zoom so far
that the moving parts in the EX1's zoom lens runs up against something and the
EX1 can't maintain the backfocus anymore and blam, everything is blurry.

You won't have this effect with the zoom-through adapters _BUT_ the zoom through
adapters are limited to a narrower range of wide angles. They have twice the
lens elements which can mean twice or three times the lens flare. Fireworks are
not friendly to lenses that are prone to flaring. Even the basic EX1 lens at f/1.9 is
close to flaring. I have not tested the sony zoom through though, it is not wide enough
for me.

@Dustin and Derek
Thank you so much for your comments. All the small hints and explanations, related to my specific questions, make it more and more clearer to me.

I have an old sampler on Vimeo with some fireworks from Germany, Italy, Malta and Shanghai from 2009-2010, which shows how good the EX1 is for fireworks. All the footage was shot with EX1 or EX1R with the same VCL-EX0877 0.8x WA at Z0:
https://vimeo.com/20892280
In the meantime I filmed much wider displays where I would have needed a 0.6x ore more...

@Dustin
Thank you, I will do the brick wall test tomorrow but from my experience with the camera I would assume that I will not notice significant softness with the normal lense of EX1R in the edges. So, if I do not see a real "problem", I do not have to expect a defect at my EX1R and all softness is caused by the adapters?

@Derek
Of course I know your comparison and now I am somehow angry on myself, that I hoped on and decided for the 16x9 instead of the century. I am very, very close to order the century too and keep the better and sell the worse...