Generally I like this camcorder some improvements over the VG 10 freezing software, AGC, Noise 25p 50 p (PAL)

I cant belive what SONY has constructed here:

Terrible Audio delay (Headphone to Live Sound)
2x Photo Mode Buttons (where the thumb rest with my hands) instead the Record button should be there. Often I land in the Photo Mode and not stopping the recording
Focusassist with the pinky
The tiny Manul Mode wheel is Bonsai Style, while filming hard to find.
No Scene Mode as advertised (many Treads about this)
Push White Balance goes only down to 3000K even the old Nex 5 goes down to 2500K
Color balance only 2 D
To high sharpness
In Play mode with the Remote it is not possible to select a recording

Did we need to live with this? Is SONY simply not listen to us?

Only one real way to make Sony see the light - return your camera. Because there is nothing in Sony's history to suggest that they will "see the light."

I'd think that for many buyers, $1,600 way too much money for a camera so intentionally crippled. If it had built in ND and XLR inputs, perhaps the lack of features would hurt less.

But it doesn't.

I dont think SONY care about me sending the camera back.
Have to live with it and earn money for a real camcorder like FS100...

I don't know man... if everyone (or even 50%) of the people who buy the camera return it - including the lenses, batteries, etc - then I don't know ow they could it be ignored.

Of course, this is Sony we're talking about, so maybe.

It seems the VG category isn't wanted by the NEX photo group nor by the FS100 NEX camcorder group. However, the 16MP chip is perfect for Quad HD, so maybe the VG will be used to introduce this in 2012.

Poor mans Fix Focus Puller and handling...

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/30801792/Poor%20Mans%20fix.zip

After a few days with it I can say its good for handling run un gun.
I made a Shoulder mount like the big ENG cams with some pads.
Cable Binder/Strip for Focus ion the 18-200 mm. The right hand for Zoom & Start Stopp Record Operation. Left hand on a Pistolgrip mounted underneath the cam, Manual Wheel for Gain Operation & AE Program ON OFF.

sounds good - can you show some pictures?
how do you zoom with the right hand?

charlie

Simply by holding the pistol grip ( underneath the camcorder) with the left hand. Left hand cannot used for zooming, because I want manual aperture and operate Iris, Shutter on the left side.... I think for me I can do smoother zooms with the right hand. The whole construction is stabillised from the shoulders and breast even my cheeck can press against it. In the photos you see my old rig and the 5n holding grip. Poor mans zoom with cable binders are ver good to operate. Afternoon my girlfriend is coming she could do the photos of the new Rig. Tryed shooting in the mirror its stupid...

Not sure what to make of this camcorder.

Would like to get a big sensor in a body designed for video shooting, with headphone jack, proper mic and a top handle. But not sure this is it ...

One guy reported that image is close to his FS100. Many say image is better than 5D.

Why aren't more people trying it out. Is it just the lack of image adjustments?

Yes Dave, that is the issue. The image as is comes off very nice. Problem is we want to be able to adjust, sharpness, contrast or saturation down, so color correction won't be hindered in post. The camera doesn't allow it as it stands.

I actually had a FS-100 in my office along side my VG20 one day. My friend and I took them both out in the local street in early evening for some impromptu shooting. I subsequently kept both set of files to get a feel for the difference between the two. The shooting was't done scientifically and it was a bit of a rush to shoot like we did, and I think I had my variable ND on when he didn't on indoor shots, he shot at 30p or 60, while I shot 24p, but my feeling was the two camera really produced some very close footage. I wish I had proper time to shoot more footage and do some real testing.

Why aren't more people trying it out. Is it just the lack of image adjustments?


Dave - people who have it seem to like it (see this (http://vimeo.com/groups/115787/forumthread:250052) thread over on Chris' Vimeo channel, if you haven't seen it already), but, in addition to the lack of color control, at $1600 body-only, the entry price is pretty high.

I rented one for a weekend and shot a few test exteriors and interiors (http://hybridcamerarevolution.blogspot.com/2011/12/sony-nex-vg20-and-panasonic-dmc-gh2.html) with both the kit lens and a Canon FD. And it turned out to be a great still camera (http://hybridcamerarevolution.blogspot.com/2011/12/sony-nex-vg20-and-panasonic-gh2-as.html) too. I liked it so much, I'm saving up to buy one to complement my Panasonic GHs.

EDIT: First three reviews (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=NavBar&A=getItemDetail&Q=&sku=818266&is=REG&si=rev#costumerReview) at B&H are very positive.

Cheers,

Bill
Hybrid Camera Revolution (http://hybridcamerarevolution.blogspot.com)

...I actually had a FS-100 in my office along side my VG20 one day. My friend and I took them both out in the local street in early evening for some impromptu shooting. I subsequently kept both set of files to get a feel for the difference between the two. The shooting was't done scientifically and it was a bit of a rush to shoot like we did, and I think I had my variable ND on when he didn't on indoor shots, he shot at 30p or 60, while I shot 24p, but my feeling was the two camera really produced some very close footage. I wish I had proper time to shoot more footage and do some real testing.

Chris - When you get some time, I'm sure that a lot of us would love to see your side-by-side FS100/VG20 footage - frame rates and ND filters notwithstanding!

(Also looking forward to seeing your narrative work - but I know how difficult and time consuming it can be to be an unpaid camera reviewer and a creative filmmaker at the same time ;-)).

Best of the New Year,

Bill
Hybrid Camera Revolution (http://hybridcamerarevolution.blogspot.com)

Bill, This is the narrative film we shot with the VG20 for the DVInfo charity challenge. All shot with this camera.

I will say the green screen stuff was shot in poorly lit quick shooting situation. We shot the entire film in about 5 hours, and it was just me and a novice sound guy and the talent. So I wasn't expecting a lot, but I could tell from the shoot that a lot can be done with this camera. The lighting in the non-green screen shots was strictly window and any in home lighting there.

The Life and Times of Grandpa Don Coyote on Vimeo

Just a random comment... not directed at anyone or any post, but I see this over and over.

How good a camera is can't be based on just it's image or worse, it's image in ideal circumstances. Isn't a camera that can be setup in 2 minutes better than one that takes 20? Or one that dials in exposure and focus in 10 seconds better than one that takes 2 minutes? Isn't a camera that can expose, follow focus and record great audio by one person better than one that takes 2 or 3? And so what if you can get an $800 DSLR to record something under certain conditions that looks as good as $2500 FF DSLR or $9000 film-corder? There's reasons why the VG20 is $1500 and the AF100 or FS-100 are $5000. If those things aren't important to you, it doesn't mean the cameras aren't better than a camera that costs half that or more. .... it just means is not better for you.

It's good to give feedback to manufacturers. In many ways, the VG-20 has improvements that were complaints about the VG-10. Having a large sensor in a camcorder body at $1500 isn't a right. To be fair, Sony's the only one out there giving it a shot. At that price it's the VG-20 or a DSLR. Choose your poison. You aren't going to get all the great things of the F3 in the FS-100 and ditto of the FS-100 in the VG-20. YMMV.

Just a random comment... not directed at anyone or any post, but I see this over and over.

How good a camera is can't be based on just it's image or worse, it's image in ideal circumstances. Isn't a camera that can be setup in 2 minutes better than one that takes 20? Or one that dials in exposure and focus in 10 seconds better than one that takes 2 minutes? Isn't a camera that can expose, follow focus and record great audio by one person better than one that takes 2 or 3? And so what if you can get an $800 DSLR to record something under certain conditions that looks as good as $2500 FF DSLR or $9000 film-corder? There's reasons why the VG20 is $1500 and the AF100 or FS-100 are $5000. If those things aren't important to you, it doesn't mean the cameras aren't better than a camera that costs half that or more. .... it just means is not better for you.

It's good to give feedback to manufacturers. In many ways, the VG-20 has improvements that were complaints about the VG-10. Having a large sensor in a camcorder body at $1500 isn't a right. To be fair, Sony's the only one out there giving it a shot. At that price it's the VG-20 or a DSLR. Choose your poison. You aren't going to get all the great things of the F3 in the FS-100 and ditto of the FS-100 in the VG-20. YMMV.

Very well written and reasoned. I agree with 99.9% of this, Les. It is a little frustrating, though, when manufacturers remove features while simultaneously increasing prices in order to protect products higher on the value chain - as Sony seems to have done between the VG10 and VG20.

Cheers and Best of the New Year,

Bill
Hybrid Camera Revolution (http://hybridcamerarevolution.blogspot.com)

Thanks Bill and Chris for your input. Interesting comments about the FS100 Chris. And thanks for the link Bill.

And thanks Les for your input. I'm a self-shooter who does a lot of video journlism here in Guatemala, so ease of use is really important to me. That's why I'm still surprised there hasn't been more of a fuss over this camera. I know it's not ideal for filmmaker types, but for people like me looking for a small, unobtrusive, large sensor, audio-capable, hand-holdable, zebra and peaking included camcorder, there aren't too many options ...

I used to shoot with a Sony A1E, then switched to the Panasonic GH1/2, which has made me a better videographer. And if I could combine the best of both cameras, well I'd be in heaven!!

@Bill - yes losing functionality is disappointing. Imagine how Canon XH-A1 users felt with Canon's follow-on models having one sensor and one ring.

@Dave - Video journalism is a tough nut to crack. Seems to me you need the AF and AE of ENG cameras yet the ability to grab beauty shots for cut aways and B-roll. Frankly, if the VG20 doesn't cut it, the FS-100 is probably the closest thing. I believe it has one lens that gives you AF yet still delivers the beauty shots. I went the route of ENG plus DSLR to do both. YMMV

Bill, This is the narrative film we shot with the VG20 for the DVInfo charity challenge. All shot with this camera. ]

looks good. wondering about the motion artifacts - is that from encoding for Vimeo or does the original footage looks like that? what were the camera settings?

thanks, charlie

Here is side by side footage from VG20 and FS100, referenced earlier in thread. I claim nothing scientific from these clips. Neither one of us had the time to get cameras set up as we normally would.

Comparison, VG20 and FS-100 on Vimeo

Thanks for sharing, Chris.

Short Clip with Zeiss 2.0 100mm and the 18-200mm + 30db Shutter 1/50 Zeiss 1/20 SONY

I like the very quick acess to the Push Whitebalance

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/30801792/GN.zip

Short Clip with 1.9 58mm Primoplakn +30 db 1/50

Singing Michael Stillwater 21.12.20111 Zuerich - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBhbunSt-u8&feature=youtu.be)

Trailer for" good new year" movie

GUETS NEUS -- schöö, wüescht, schööwüescht Silvesterklausen im Appenzellerland - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCMck9u4w4M&feature=related)

As I found out is the Live Sound from Camera terrible delayed on the headphone output. Handling noise is also present while zooming and touching the camcorder.
I work since 2 years with EMU Pipeline Wireless System,and tested if it is possible to use it with the Nex, It is working very well.
Headphone Monitoring is coming from the Reciever 3.5 mm Minijack. Parallel Cinch Output to the VG 20 Microphone Input. Dont crank up the volume Output Settings on the SONY. Very confusing the Volume for the headphone Output is corelated with the Recorded sound ! When the headphone Volume is high a lot of noise is in present on the Recording a BIG BUG not a feature. I have never seen something like this in my life.
Setting the Input Volume a bit less then half way up. The Tranciever is connected with SONY PCM 50 or Tascam DR 680. EMU Light Pipe LIne Input is very sensitiv, be carefull not to overload it.
It is is small light cheap, has internal power for 5 - 8 hours. Works only they way you feed it. Either SPDIF 48 kHz IN/OUT or Analog iIN/OUT not mixed! 5-8 Meters safe working distance, exeed it noise is coming later complete cutoff.

E-MU PIPEline Product Tour - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24juCxgU_Oc)

Not finished Rig
I mounted off axis, breathing was moving the camcorder up and down, Quick Release Plate Manfrotto Foam Grip left hand can control everything front & left side camcorder. Zoom with right hand. On the back Counterweight and a Silicon bend to shoulder

SONY don't wot any feeeback for the VG 20!!
It is not possible to give a statement.
But for the 5 it is very welcome.
This speaks for it self.

I enjoy watching videos of middle-aged men playing with their toys, but I am less enamored with video that has severe motion artifacts that are *not* produced by the camera, by shaky-cam, and by poor exposure (the indoor backlit VG20 shots are under-exposed badly).

More importantly, tell us about those motion artifacts. Do you need editing advice?

I have shot video with my NEX-5N, which is identical in sensor and lens to the VG20, and my Vimeo videos (whatever else they may be worth) do not have this problem. Take a look at one (used 108060p):

Sony NEX-5N Video: Palm Beach Beach on Vimeo

This was shot with the 18-200mm video lens. Demonstrates dynamic range and motion tracking capabilities as well as the OSS, as everything was handheld.