Interesting discussion on SSDs prompted me to look at Blackmagic's recommendations on building high performance video work stations for DaVinci Resolve. Very interesting note on SSD drives on page 9 of their Resolve configuration. Worth a read

http://www.blackmagicdesign.com/media/4805318/Resolve_Win_Config_Guide_2012-08-30.pdf

Chris Young
CYV Productions
Sydney

Jeff I use Acronis True Image Home for disk cloning & back-ups. Samsung Data Migration Software works if you have a Samsung SSD.

Interesting, Jeff. Will certainly take that into account when I choose my data SSDs.

On the subject of cloning, I use Paragon Hard Disk Manager 14 (for backup as well). Served me well in the short time I've used it.

Now, a cautionary tale:

Two things have left a little fly in the ointment:

1. I was unaware that I should have disconnected the original system drive when installing Windows on the SSD. I couldn't work out why when I subsequently removed the old drive I got an error on booting. A little research has put me straight on that. I've read a few posts that suggest I could use BCDEdit or EasyBC to fix this, but most posts suggest I need to reinstall the OS. Annoying - and lesson learned!

2. Although the performance boost has been phenomenally good I have discovered that it's about half what it potentially could be. I believed all my SATA ports to be SATA III but when I eventually found the manual I discovered it's only 2 SATA III and 6 SATA II - and I had connected the SSD to a SATA II port. It was when I tried to swap the ports to put the SSD on a SATA III port that I first discovered the problem in (1) above! No matter what I tried, based on extensive research that took up most of yesterday and well into the night, I just could NOT get the SSD to function on the SATA III port. I learned about all sorts of interesting stuff, but nothing to help me with my problem. And then I read a tiny footnote on the ASUS product page for my motherboard, relating to the 2 SATA III ports hanging off a Marvell controller - "These SATA ports are for data hard drives only. ATAPI devices are not supported". How disappointing is that? Like I said, the performance improvement is huge, so I'm not regretting doing it, but how frustrating!

Sounds like it's time for a new motherboard Ian :)

Oh great, Nicholas! Just what I wanted to hear! ;-)

To be honest, the performance I'm getting is still light years ahead of what I had before, so I'm not really complaining, just cross with myself that I didn't pick it up sooner. The motherboard (an Asus P6X58D-E) is superb in every other respect and it's only a three year old model. Maybe next year . . .

On a positive note, I just ran the Paragon Alignment Tool and my overall score using AS SSD has literally doubled.Obviously it's not the (near) 6Gbps speed I was hoping for, but I can enjoy that when I eventually get the data SSDs installed on the two SATA III ports :-)

I've been pondering that article in the Blackmagic documentation. I'm not convinced it makes sense. Consider a device like the Atomos Samurai which captures 10-bit 4:2:2 video and audio straight off the camera sensor via an HD/SD-SDI output - that uses SSDs (or HDDs) and allows you to edit straight off the device. I wonder if the Blackmagic views are based on older technology?

Yeah, Ian, gotta remove old drive.

I downloaded wrong tool for benchmark! So I don't know about my speed.

The tool you recommended Kim is a free download and it's located on CNET and other places I don't trust. Last CNET download I did had malware on it. I was VERY disappointed and will never use the site again. Have trusted them for 15+ years, but no more.

If anyone knows of a reasonably priced free benchmark tool for hard drives let me know please!

I second the vote for Acronis True Image for cloning, a reliable old staple of mine.

Although not perfect, V12 64bit has overall been the most stable of the Vegas versions I've used since V9.

2 1/2 years ago I configured online and ordered a Dell XPS L702X laptop with 1920x1080 panel, i7 2.2Ghz, Nvidia GeForce GT555M with CUDA and 6.9 GB video ram, Samsung 2.5 inch SSD and Toshibla 7200 rpm HDD.

Now out of date, still the only complaint I have is that it runs out of video ram when using the GPU to render 4k, so like the others I have to disable the Nvidia GPU processing, which causes the render to take 2 1/2 times longer.

All other times except rendering 4k, I enable the GPU processing, and it renders HD and previews decently. I still have the the option to create proxy video which then the preview is realtime.

Vegas will occasionally halt and give the message that it has stopped working, but it keeps a backup. Same old Vegas on that count, but considering it's not rental software, and extremely easy to use, I put up with it.

I put 4k XAVC, XDCAM and AVCHD all on the same timeline, no issues there. It's just important to set the project properties to the highest spec 4096x2160 or 3840x2160, and on the render template set to 1920x1080 for a HD output in AVC, DNxHD or uncompressed AVI.

For 4k output, XAVC or uncompressed AVI are the best options. x264 accepts the uncompressed AVI and renders out a nice 4k, 2k or HD output in a good quality 28 mbps that plays nice with Sony PS3 (HD) or Windows Media Player (HD or 4k).

Yeah, Ian, gotta remove old drive.

I downloaded wrong tool for benchmark! So I don't know about my speed.

The tool you recommended Kim is a free download and it's located on CNET and other places I don't trust. Last CNET download I did had malware on it. I was VERY disappointed and will never use the site again. Have trusted them for 15+ years, but no more.

If anyone knows of a reasonably priced free benchmark tool for hard drives let me know please!

Jeff....

You have to trust me on this...

When you enter: CrystalDiskMark - Software - Crystal Dew World (http://crystalmark.info/software/CrystalDiskMark/index-e.html)
You click on the green image which is the "Standard Edition" of CrystalDiskMark3...
Then you will be redirected to: a sourceforge.jp download page

Soundforge.jp stand for the very famous open source application sphere, but the japanese version of it..

This software is used by magazines and other reviewing folks out there when testing disks every day.. This is a trusted software believe me...

/Kim

If anyone knows of a reasonably priced free benchmark tool for hard drives let me know please!

Blackmagic Disk Speed Test. Available a part of Desktop Video 9.7.8 for Windows from Blackmagic at:
Blackmagic Design: Software Archive (http://www.blackmagicdesign.com/support/archive?sid=3945&pid=31786&dlSeries=&os=win&custom=true)

Or on its own from:

Blackmagic Disk Speed Test - Download (http://blackmagic-disk-speed-test.updatestar.com/)

What version of Disc Speed resides there I don't know.

Regards the smoothest and best playback in Vegas I find a four or six drive video raid to be the answer. The drives really don't seem to be the problem for playback in Vegas its the CPU / GPU decoding demand that seems to be the root cause of most of Vegas' playback issues.

For short form projects, TV spots, corporates etc I edit with the uncompressed Sony YUV codec. On a reasonable PC, oldish i7, 950 @ 3.07 running at 3.1 GHz, this uncompressed can play back 50p at best full without any problems. At Preview Full it will play back at the full 50 fps to an external monitor with no issues whatsoever. Leaves ProRes, DNx HD and Cineform codecs for dead when it comes to smooth editing and playback. CPU load on the above PC runs between 4~6% with uncompressed as opposed to a jerky AVC HD 50p chewing up between 55~70%.

I batch convert all camera files, mainly XDcam MXF, Sony and Canon AVC HD and MOV files to uncompressed to get a trouble free smooth editing experience. Apart from playback the uncompressed files handle grading more robustly. I then render the master to a YUV uncomp file and from that make my web H.264, DVD or BD files as required. Rendering these files from the YUV uncomp is way quicker than rendering from any compressed intermediate file. No decoding is required. Just encoding to your chosen output format.

Obviously for long format recording uncompressed is possibly a bit impracticable because of file size. It’s in the order of about 460~470GB per hour on 50Hz systems.

For long form programs I batch render using the Vegas scrips ‘Add Regions to Events’ and ‘Batch Render’ using the Matrox VFW MPEG-2 I frame AVI HD codec. Downloadable from the Matrox site. Search for their Video for Windows Codec Pack.

This is the only MPEG-2 I frame codec that I have found that can be customised to render 50 fps progressive. It also supports selective bit-rate from 50~300-mbit. At 50-mbit the CPU load is around 12~18% on average, it also delivers very smooth editing and preview playback in Vegas. This codec supports ‘No Recompression Rendering’ and on the above PC will render an hour of 1920 x 1080 25p in about 6~9 mins back to its own codec. Very fast indeed.

Since switching to using Sony’s YUV uncompressed for short form and the Matrox’s MPEG-2 I frame HD codecs for long form in Vegas the whole workflow process has become much smoother and way faster. Vegas is once again a joy to use.

BTW I also have a feeling, not yet confirmed, that setting the Preview window to 960 x 540 with ‘Scale video to Fit Preview Window’ option turned ‘off’ works best. This exact ½ HD size preview seems performance wise a much easier size for the graphics cards to display rather than having to compute some odd size preview window. Mathematically it’s a 2:1 reduction so I believe easier than trying to compute and scale some odd figure like 67.8% or whatever size you preview window is set at with the scale function turned on.

Chris Young
CYV Productions
Sydney

Thanks Chris, that write up was VERY helpful. Hard disks and RAID arrays are so cheap now, that I might consider your suggestion.

You said that a 4 to 6 drive array will work. Can you be more specific? Is that normal 7200 RPM drives and a <$1000 controller? Or is that using high-end SAS 15,000 RPM drive, and an enterprise class controller?

Vegas is the most amazing software, but choppy playback completely ruins the editing experience. It's so hard to know if an edit or transition will work when the playback is choppy. I tried switching to FCPX because 90% of the time playback is silky smooth. Everything else about that program drives me crazy!

If I could get Vegas to play as smoothly as FCPX, and then find some premade themes that are as professional looking as the ones in FCPX, then I'd be one happy camper :)

~Jay

Jay there is nothing exotic at all in my raids.

When I say 4 to 6 drive raid I mean just simple e-SATA 7200 rpm HDs. I’m using WD Black Caviar drives in Raid 0 for speed. Not worried about redundancy because should a raid fall over I can always reconstruct it quickly and drop the files back on. It’s then open up the Vegas project where it will most likely request a file re-link so you just navigate to the new raid and find the files and all is well.

All my drives in the raids these days are configured as software raids under disc management in Win 7 Ultimate. If you want added security you can always use Intel’s Matrix Storage Manager where you configure a firmware raid in your Bios.

https://downloadcenter.intel.com/SearchResult.aspx?lang=eng&ProductFamily=Software+Products&ProductLine=Chipset+Software&ProductProduct=Intel%c2%ae+Rapid+Storage+Technology+(Intel%c2%ae+RST)

I used to do this all the time so as to never lose the raid config plus the Storage Manager Software lets you monitor the health of your raid and can warn you of any impending disc issues. Coming from the old school of 72GB Ultra Wide SCSI drives on the old Discreet Edit* Win NT systems you would understand why. You had to save your raid config or you could lose the lot with a system failure.

I guess I’m getting lazy these days as I find modern drives if kept well ventilated and cooled, especially enterprise quality drives that are designed to run 24/7, are very reliable. For years now I have been using Western Digital ‘Black’ drives but next time around I would use their ‘Red’ drives which are designed specifically for raid operation.

A four 7200 rpm drive raid 0 will give you as I previously posted very low CPU usage with uncompressed. Just as a double check I have just run Blackmagic’s Disk Speed Test on a 4 x 7200 raid 0 and it indicates that it could handle 10 Bit RGB 4:4:4: Write / Read in 1080i and in 10 Bit YUV 4:2:2 Write / Read it can handle 1080 50p. Seeing that most of my material is Matrox 50-mbit 8-bit I am well in the clear.

Chris Young
CYV Productions
Sydney

That's amazingly inexpensive. I'll give that a try.

In experimenting with FCPX, I noticed that a project in which the source footage was about 20GB had somehow multiplied itself to become 325GB. Using your method of creating an uncompressed file in Vegas, it would only have been slightly larger.

Can you be more specific on how you use a script to create the uncompressed file in Vegas?

thanks again for your help.
~Jay

Jay, it’s probably easier to explain this in images so have a look at the attached JPGs.

JPG 01 = select all your clips.

JPG 02 = tools / scripting /add regions to events (This script is not a standard inclusion in Vegas. Download the attached script and drop it into your scripts folder in Vegas. Next time you open Vegas it will be in the scripts menu. There is also a ‘Rescan script menu folder’ option if Vegas is already open.

JPG 03 = Once you have done the above your timeline should now look like this.

JPG 04 = The next step is to run the ‘Batch render’ script. This is part of the standard Vegas selection of scripts.

JPG 05 = You will now see the batch render menu. Select the template you require and make a selection from the bottom three options. Normally this would be ‘Render Regions’ if you want to keep each clip as a separate identity, your choice. IMPORTANT NOTE: Browse and name and nominate where you want these files to go otherwise they will fill up your system drive in no time with their default location!

One last point. If you modify and save a new render template for any reason you will have to close Vegas down and re-open before the new template will appear in the batch render dialogue.

Give it a go and be surprised.

Chris Young
CYV Productions
Sydney

There correct scrip, sorry, Christopher...

Doh! My bad. Finger trouble again. Thanks Juris. Would be hard to do it with the other one.

Chris Young
CYV Productions
Sydney

Thanks Chris, that's really helpful.

I'm always amazed at the power that's available in this often under appreciated NLE.

~Jay

People who knock Vegas don't know it. I have delivered over four hundred, yes 400 + one hour TV shows covering everything from sport and entertainment to docos along with countless TV spots and yes all produced on Vegas Pro.

I am 5 episodes into the official Government production of the "History of the Royal Australian Navy." to commemorate the Australian Navy's Centenary. Over 3000 hours of archive material that has ranged from SD to HD from MPEG to Uncompressed from NTSC to PAL and with most of the old material in 4 x 3. All the old 4 x 3 material has had to be scanned and panned and key-framed. Every single clip has had to be graded and all the old archive material has had to be 'Neat Video' noise reduction treated. All of this has been done INSIDE Vegas with very few issues.

A big job in other words. It started in V10 and has now evolved through to V12. Vegas' ability to handle any format, any frame rate, any dimension, any bit-rate and almost any codec natively on the timeline is where it has blown the others away. We also use Premiere, Edius and Avid. All very strong in many areas but overall on a five year project like this where we are shooting in XDCam HD and having to integrate it with battered WWI 4 x 3 footage Vegas has proved to a most versatile, capable and stable 'craft' editor. In conjunction with the Decklink HD cards it has been great to work with.

Vegas flies under the radar most of the time. It is just another tool in the tool set but if it is used well is a very powerful tool.

Chris Young
CYV Productions
Sydney

People who knock Vegas don't know it. Great statement! I'll quote yah - if I may?

Grazie

I have been using Vegas for years. Our world wide radio broadcast used Vegas Audio 1.0 the day it came out. It was only in 2013 that we stopped using Vegas Audio 2.0 for the broadcast. The reason for the change was that the old engineer retired, and the new guy preferred something else. He uses Nuendo.

I use Vegas video mostly as a hobby. At work I have Vegas 12 installed and use it primarily for occasional in-house videos. To date I have only produced two publicly released videos. I guess you could call it professional because I was paid to do it, and they each have about 10,000 views on YouTube.

I think the challenge in America, is that almost everyone is obsessed with Macs. It's nearly impossible to be taken seriously as an audio, and especially a video professional if you don't use a Mac.

Early on, we used Macs with Sonic Solutions for audio. About 12 years ago, I made the switch to PC because I believed the best tools for the job were on a PC, and the PC was better for networking back then.

If Vegas were more sexy looking without losing any functionality, and were available on the Mac, I bet it would get the respect it deserves.

For me personally, after my home Mac experiment over the Christmas break, I am a firm believer that Windows is better. I tried the Mac because I was under the impression that it would be better for video.
Here's where it let me down:
I use a Sony video camera, OSX Mavericks QT won't play the the video files.
I use a Sony SLT camera, OSX Mavericks won't show the raw files.
Old DV footage won't play natively in QT
FCPX creates an insane amount of temp files which equates 10 times the size of the source footage!
FCPX has no master bus for audio. How do you keep the mix from clipping?

All that to say, I love Vegas!

~Jay

Oh yes, the Church of Apple. Plenty of Mac adherents down under believe me. Though I know a few died in the wool FCP editors who felt incredibly betrayed when FCP was dropped. Some of them had major investments and numerous seats of FCP. That shook the faith.

Not trying to start an Apple vs. PC thing here but have you noticed when you go into a major Apple store that the top chosen products are displayed on tall display stands that sit on elevated platforms. Very much like an altar on a dias. Brilliant subliminal marketing without a doubt. I will say no more on this particular subject other than to quote Abe Lincoln

"You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time."

All platforms can produce good programming. It's all down to the people, a good script, great story telling and well cut vision backed up with a great sound mix.

Chris Young
CYV Productions
Sydney