Richard Onslow writes:


Hi

I am trying to research if other people have a problem like myself and a few others have with our Panasonic cameras. In the UK my model is known as NV-DS38B (the B is for UK model, I think). The problem seems to be similar in some ways to that experienced by some MX-300 users until a firmware upgrade became available which amongst other things corrected glitches during DV out to other equipment. I have had some problems convincing people that the camera is at fault. My camera is currently with Panasonic in the UK but I have heard nothing in almost 3 weeks. Should you have any knowledge of such a problem---I get audio glitches/dropouts only but a guy on this thread I started gets video problems too:

http://www.dvdoctor.net/cgi-bin/ubb/Forum8/HTML/002157.html

This is a follow up:

Hi Frank

Thanks for taking the time to reply and for your advice/Aussie contact. I will post on those forums tonight if I get time. I am hoping to get some news today from a guy in Australia whose picking up his camera today from Panasonic after a firmware upgrade. However, he's not too hopefull of it being fixed. If you are interested he will post the result after doing some tests on his thread here:

http://www.colinbarrett.com/simplyBB/viewtopic.php?topic=1783&forum=2&13

He may also post on the dvdoctor thread I started and pointed you to in my email.

Follow up

By the way, the Aussie guy got his camera back but he still gets audio dropouts. He's testing out a possible workaround so check here if you are interested:

http://www.colinbarrett.com/simplyBB/viewtopic.php?topic=1783&forum=2&14

My first actual posting here so hello to everyone and thanks to Frank Granovski for starting the thread off on my behalf.

The workaround referred to in the previous post seems to be holdng up. Unfortunately, it is probably of no use to people with models like the NV-DS28B ( i.e. the UK model) which does not have AV In, if the presence of an incoming signal is the key feature in the method. The Australian DS28 does have AV In evidently.

It would be interesting to know if anyone with an MX300 who has had glitch problems but has not yet had a firmware upgrade gets any improvement using this workaround. I assume the MX300 has AV In.

Richard

Welcome, Richard!

I have the version 1.5 fimware upgrade, not the newest 1.6 version. Before I had my firmware upgraded, I uploaded into my friend's MAC a few times. I did not notice any glitches. But I only did this a few times.

I agree: perhaps someone with a MX300 can try this "workaround."

Even with this "glitch," I presume the best solution is to simply use a deck---there go more bucks, er, Pounds!

Keep us informed, Richard.

I heard yesterday that Panasonic UK are unable so far to reproduce my audio dropout problem although they have tried various computers. This seems amazing to me as I have tried 3 different computes and get dropouts on all 3! I think Monday will be the last day they try.

By the way Frank can you explain what you mean by:-

"I presume the best solution is to simply use a deck---there go more bucks, er, Pounds"

I am new to video cameras etc. so don't kow what you mean by 'deck'. Are you suggesting buying another piece of gear?

Sorry If it's a dumb question

Richard

I meant that instead of uploading from the cam, take the tape out, put it in a deck, and upload into the computer from the deck. But a good deck costs a lot of money.

No surprise, Richard, that you are not familiar with DV decks.

As the MiniDV format is mostly targetted at home and semi-pro level, and in most other parts of the world, MiniDV cameras are sold as Cam-corders, there is really no serious needs for decks.

A MiniDV deck looks just like a VHS deck, allowing record, play back and most other editing function. AV and DV in/out would be available, too. Since the manufacturers assume that only pros need decks, the decks are in the range of US3,000! That means that you may be better off buying a cheap camera with lousy optics just to use as a deck!

My first encounter with a MiniDV deck is at my friends production house (semi-pro) which he owns a Sony MiniDV-cum-VHS deck. In Malaysia, it costed him more than RM15,000 a few years back, that's about US4,000.

I would be interested if anyone wants to sell a MiniDV cam with working AV in/out and Firewire in/out but busted lens or CCD!

Thanks for replies. I must admit I thought the only thing that recorded on/played back a mini DV tape was a digital video camera. I am definately only into video at amateur level and not looking to spend loads of money. It's just a shame that this hobby. for me, has turned into something of a consumer nightmare where I cannot get acknowledgement from Panasonic that a problem actually exists! I can only assume that there is something about the way or the conditions in which they are testing my camera that means dropouts don't occur. But I would've thought the first thing to do if a problem could not be replicated would be to check through things with the person who has experience of the problem i.e. me, but nobody from Panasonic has ever rung me to discuss anything about it. If they did I might feel like I was getting some 'customer care'

I feel your pain, Richard. Yes, it is a very expensive hobby, one which I cannot afford either. I only use AV and S-video out, then use these VCRs as my decks. However, I have good friends with high-end equipment coming out of their ears. So I get to borrow a DV deck, editing laptop, and even mics, when I ask. One guy I know works for the movie industry and makes big bucks. To avoid paying any taxes he spends like crazy on the latest DV gear and computers. But because he's always busy working, his toys collect dust. That's where I come in! What are friends for? Actually, I do him a lot of favours as well---tracking down equipment for him.

I phoned Panasonic UK at Bracknell today and asked to speak directly to the engineer working on my camera. I thought I would be able to double check exactly what they are doing in order to discover why they can't replicate this problem. However I found out that Panasonic UK have a policy which forbids the customer from talking directly to the engineers. I can email and it will be passed to the engineer but I cannot speak to him except through a customer service representative as it were. I have been thinking of actually going to Bracknell with my computer but if I can't speak to an engineer on the phone it is unlikely I will be allowed to meet with one in person. A discussion with an engineer may be all that's required to highlight why we get different results and resolve the problem quickly. Why do some companies not realise that customer care involves actually caring for the customer and adapting to help the individual customer's needs. I asked if an exception could be made but was met with a flat refusal. I have not had a single telephone call from Panasonic or an email requesting any further information from me on this problem. Why is nobody from Panasonic asking me for any details? If they are struggling to replicate a problem after having a customers camera for over 3 weeks why not contact the customer rather than return the camera and say 'unable to find any fault' which the way things are going could quite possibly happen. Why not invite me to Bracknell with my computer? Now that would be cutomer care.

That's so strange and tacky that they wouldn't go for this. I presume they are afraid that they have no immediate solution for the firmware glitch. I guess it is a way of protecting themselves.

I have a friend here in Vancouver, who used to hire me for shooting, and his Panasonic woes were a lot worse. One time, Panasonic had his cam for 6 months! And when it cam back (from Japan), it still wasn't working right. It was an expensive cam too. He finally just threw it in the garbage - about $5,000 Canadian down the tubes. It's too bad that some of these cam companies aren't held accountable.

I have been lucky. All my JVC and Panasonic cams have never given me problems.

Hi, Richard.

Sorry to hear about your troubles with glitches & Panasonic. I truly sympathize with you, because I have gone through similar treatment with Panasonic Malaysia. Remember: only Pana Australia knows about it.

I've had lots of troubles with my MX300EN (PAL) cam bought in Malaysia: dirt inside viewfinder (twice), DV out glitches, more than 20 "always on" pixels on the LCD, color accuracy problems on LCD & viewfinder that needed recalibration.

Today, I am totally satisfied because all these problems were fixed :) :). They cleaned my viewfinder, the DV out glitches were fixed via firmware upgrade 1.6, totally replaced my LCD, took many visits to eventually fix the color accuracy / calibrate the colors on the LCD. All at no charge.

I trusted them, and they delivered, eventually. It's been with Panasonic Malaysia from the next day following my purchase, for a total period of 7 months (!), but in between fault repairs I got back the cam. I must have gone to the service center about a dozen times, to rectify the faults. I would collect it, check it at home, and unfortunately some color on the LCD wasn't correct, so I would send it back within 3 days. So in that 7 months I think I played with my MX for like a total of one month. :(

It was also a learning process for them, especially the firmware upgrade to fix the DV out glitches. It's their first time doing firmware upgrades & LCD color recalibration. For the glitches, I even offered to bring my PC to the service center & they took the bait 'cos they didn't know what else to do. You HAVE to demonstrate the problem without doubt to them, before they can do anything.

One problem was company policy: I showed them all the mails between Stuart of Pana Australia & Frank, even gave their contact numbers. They couldn't talk directly to Pana Australia (different subsidiary) they could only talk to, and get their orders & firmware from Pana Japan! The PDF that Stuart gave me (I've passed it on to Frank, it's available from Frank's website http://www.dvfreak.com) FINALLY did the trick. Patience paid off: I got the 1.6 firmware which is newer than Frank's 1.5 firmware.

I've learnt a lot of patience and dished out a lot of understanding for the Panasonic techies. Being a techie myself for bar coding equipment (Symbol brand) I can empathize with them. All I could do is to dream about the future, that one day my MX will be totally cured... Hope kept me going ;)

Some theories about why Panasonic doesn't allow you to talk directly to the techie: 1) If a customer can talk directly to the techie, he would be always "hassled" to get things done fast, and perhaps even verbally abused. This affects his / her performance. Imagine having 5 or more irate customers hassling you everyday :(
2) There is no black & white / documentation. Nothing to forward to your colleagues in Pana Japan or wherever, if they needed help solving it.
Each visit to the service center, I submitted a thorough explaination of the problem. Typing "DV Out glitches" in the service request report didn't do the trick. A thorough explaination with pictures did it.

All the best to you!

Thanks for the replies Frank and Steven. I've got to rest from typing and clicking the old mouse too much tonight ( maybe longer ) as I think I am getting symptoms of repetative strain injury in my right arm. You certainly have a lot of patience Steven and I agree with you that they don't want customers pestering the engineers all the time but you think they might at least call the customer once to verify the facts of the case to make sure that the problem is understood correctly. Would go on but arm needs resting

Cheers

My MX300 has been at the repair shop twice last year for about 3 1/2 months total time out. on its second visit to the repairer they said they did the firmware update (1.5 I think) but using the camera last week it still has problems. audio droped out twice over 40 minutes and video glitches remain too.
I'm very disappointed!

Really? With the firmware version 1.5 upgrade you still get the interrupted video?

What was wrong with your MX300? Just curious.

Yes unfortunatley the problems continue. (Audio drop outs and video glitches) I was trusting that it was fixed and did lots of backups out of FCP to MiniDV tape thru the MX300, but now i know it can't be trusted for this. Also I believe it still has audio drop outs and glitches recorded to tape while filming. (I can't check the latest tapes again as they are now out of my posession). The MX300 being nice and small, I take it everywhere, and my XL1s stays at home a lot. I am thinking about getting an XM2 to replace it the MX300. And then send the MX300 in to the repairer again and again. I have an extended 5 year warranty, the first year is over but I will keep sending it back if only to get the repairer to keep invoicing Panasonic for work. Maybe then something will be done?

(I was talking to you months ago about this problem when I was known as Morbid666 but Chris Hurd made me change my user name or lose access to these pages)

Oh, right. I remember you (morbid666). So that's your name! This is just a thought. Could some of these problems be a result of using cheap tape, or mixing tape, or even because of possible head problems? I had similar problems with a DVL9500 because the tapes I used were of poor quality. When I cleaned my heads for the final time, and switched to FUJI miniDV tape, I never had problems from dirty heads.

Hi, Andrew. I'm sorry to hear you've still got glitches even after the firmware upgrade.

Just want to clarify something. Am I right to say that you get video & audio glitches on transferring video shot from your MX300 video via DV to FCP?

And if you playback without connecting via DV i.e. through AV OUT or monitoring through LCD / Viewfinder you don't get glitches at all?

Do your glitches look like the one on the PDF Tech Bulletin on Frank's MX500 page (http://www.dvfreak.com, click on MX500 buying info, scroll down to
"Panasonic MX300 latest firmware info (PAL, version 1.6)"
)? 2 to 3 misplaced squares? Or perhaps worst, horizontal stripes?

I'm trying to figure out if your glitches are the ones that can be fixed with the firmware upgrade, or something else... Thanks in advance!

====NEW EDIT=====

I suspect once your DV port is used, either record or playback or merely hooked to another DV device PC or cam, there will be glitches. Somehow, my system (Matrox RT2000) does very well with Sony cams, but is less stable with my MX300 - glitches still appear occasionally on the Capture Movie window of Premiere when I do PLAYBACK PREVIEW (use the Premiere's software buttons to PLAY the tape & observing the Capture Movie window) to find the correct starting place, BUT when I capture to disk, everything goes in WITHOUT glitches. That's what matters in the end. It can glitch all it wants when previewing, but CAPTURE MUST BE PERFECT!

====NEW EDIT=====

I suspect once your DV port is used, either record or playback or merely hooked to another DV device PC or cam, there will be glitches. Somehow, my system (Matrox RT2000) does very well with Sony cams, but is less stable with my MX300 - glitches still appear occasionally on the Capture Movie window of Premiere when I do PLAYBACK PREVIEW (use the Premiere's software buttons to PLAY the tape & observing the Capture Movie window) to find the correct starting place, BUT when I capture to disk, everything goes in WITHOUT glitches. That's what matters in the end. It can glitch all it wants when previewing, but CAPTURE MUST BE PERFECT!


By further optimizing my system (playing with registry, faster memory speed settings in BIOS, BIOS PCI latency set to 64 instead of 32) I was able to reduce the frequency of occurance of playback preview glitches from every 10-20 seconds to maybe as little as once a minute or once every two minutes. :)

Maybe there's some limitation in the MX300's DV port that makes it not as forgiving as say, a Sony's?

Maybe there's not enough buffer / CPU power in the cam?

Maybe too much video data due to wildly changing picture that overwhelms it?. My playback preview glitches seem to appear after changing scenes or if the scene has a lot of action in it i.e. FRAME mode with some wild panning.

Playback preview glitches also happens when I've foolishly rewound back tape that I've shot on previously, and just randomly re-record "patches" of new material in different places. I also get AUDIO + video glitches when I playback - but that's because I upset the timecode & it's really my fault 8O.

Food for thought....

====NEW POST====

Oh, one more fact. I have a dual CPU motherboard (Abit VP6) with double 1 Gigahertz speed Pentium IIIs running MS Win2K Pro, with 1 GIG of PC133 memory. 7200 rpm drives. After the firmware upgrade 1.6, I didn't have any Playback Preview glitches - except when I played back sections of tape that I rerecorded new stuff over old stuff (see above) but that's to be expected & it's not the system's or the cam's fault.

Recently, I removed one CPU. That's when I saw Playback Preview glitches again just like before the firmware upgrade 1.6. AAAGHHH! :( Strange.... I had to do the optimizations and that helped reduce the freq of occurances of Playback Preview glitches (see above).

My theory is that with double CPUs, the capture mechanism worked better 'cos one CPU was used to run OS etc. while the other concentrated on handling Premiere & the capture process. Therefore less bottlenecks in the system & playback preview glitches dissapear. Anyways, VIA motherboards are known to be slower than their Intel counterparts.

Not everyone has double CPUs! :( So my suggestion is to try to optimize your system as much as possible. Don't use NTFS formatted hard disks to store your video, use FAT16 or FAT32!

Here are some tweaking advice for those with WinXP & Win2K:

http://www.videoguys.com/TweaksWINXPVE.html

http://www.videoguys.com/WinXP2.html

For David La Borde's older WinME/98 and Win2K guides, see the left hand side of http://www.videoguys.com/techsupp.htm under "OS Tweaks for NLE"

I will do some more experimenting probably tomorrow but I am quite sure the problem occurs even playing out thru the av into a tv monitor.
I use Panasonic tapes. I only use them once. and never use other brands. I have use the head cleaning tape twice and its been in for repair twice. If the head were a problem surely they would have cleaned them?
My computer is a G4 Dual P 800, OS 10.2.2 760MB ram, 2 hard drives 7200rpm. defraged seperate drive for capture scratch.

Well Andrew, I just don't know. But it could be that your heads get dirty and/or there's something wrong with the heads. It's just a guess.

I am unclear on quite what the problem is with Andrews camera, or is there more than one perhaps. Is it known for sure if any audio/video glitches are actually recorded on to tape, i.e. they are repeatable, in the same place every playback, and therefore will be seen on any output (camera LCD, computer or TV)? I searched for his earlier posts (not in this thread) and they seemed to imply he could rewind the tape and sometimes get no glitches or glitches in different places and this, if I understand correctly, is just when previewing in the camera LCD. So are we saying the computer doesn't feature as such in the problems?

Richard

I realise i'm coming into this thread a little late but i think it's important to understand that the MX300 glitches can be demonstrated by just connecting one MX300 to another MX300! This is exactly what I got Pana Australia to do in July 2001 (AFAIK I was the first one to 'discover' this unfortunate problem/bug.)

Just to make it absolutely clear that my (or yours or theirs) PC is *not* the cause of the glitches get them to just connect two x MX300's via firewire, play one into the other and you will (eventually!) see glitches on both LCD screens - this can take up to 20 mins of carefull watching but then you might get two or three glitches within 5 mins. The problem is very random and never repeatable in the exact same place - it is *not* a glitch on tape, it's within the firewire data stream - 'super-block' (?) corruption or similar term...
I suspect that the intermittant nature and the sometimes loooong time of very careful watching to catch the millisec glitch are the reasons why Panasonic cannot always see the problem...

It's a tough problem but it exists and it can certainly be fixed - my MX300 has been glitch free since around Oct'01.
I find it truly amazing that there is no official upgrade communicated around *all* Panasonic distributors - it sounds as though they are still selling cams with old firmware - ridiculous!

I suppose to be fair to Panasonic it is very easily possible that the PC or some other problem within the cam (tape/heads) *can* cause very similar glitches...
You may have more than one problem - it may be a combination of PC, heads/tape and firmware giving you very similar glitches.

Again, to prove it is (or is not!) an MX300 firmware problem, connect the suspect MX300 to another one or even any other DV camcorder with firewire (I used my TRV900 as an 'input') and play a tape from the suspect cam and that will prove that it's not a PC problem. Provided that you *cannot* recproduce the fault in the exact same spot repeatedly then that also rules out tape and head problems...

Thanks, AngryofMayfair, for the extra tips!

I remember some of those huge threads about this glitch at dv.com (and DV Doctor). Because of your perseverance (and persuasion) with Panasonic, we have all benefited.

Visit us more often, even it's just for a hello, or some news from Down-Under.

I agree with AngryofMayfair. It takes PATIENCE to see the glitches - especially when hooking up via DV port to another cam.

I find that the glitches come out more frequently with computer DV hookup.

Usually the first glitch happens within the 2 seconds of pressing PLAY. It can easily be seen on my Sony Digi8.

When I went to Panasonic Malaysia since I suggested that I could demonstrate the problem, they brought me to the back room & hooked it up to their NV-DS30s via DV port. They couldn't see the first glitch because the NV-DS30 gives a black screen for the first 2 to 3 seconds. We watched for 2 minutes, no glitches. Aagggh!

It seems the NV-DS30 was more "stable" & didn't easily show the glitches in the usual segments that I am likely to have glitches - unlike my Sony. And Sony doesn't do that "first 2 to 3 seconds black screen" thing.

I find that glitches TEND to happen at places where:
1) there's a great luminance change i.e. vidcamming a giant outdoor LCD screen which was showing bright explosions,
2) when I cam in FRAME mode & do wild panning,
3) or when there's lots of busy-ness in the scene i.e. crowd of people.

And that segment has to be say 5 seconds long - long enough for the internal buffer to overflow?. I say TEND because the glitches appear 1 time out of 3 to 5 tries in that general location, with a few seconds variance. Sometimes I get lucky and see it in the same place twice in a row. Play it enough times & it will be seen, eventually.


One sure way to recognize that it's the glitch that upgrading firmware WILL SOLVE: Capture to PC a segment that has the glitch, it will be either 2 or 3 consequtive frames. In those frames, you will see that some blocks of the video has been moved about, usually up or down a few pixels, kind of like a few pieces of jigsaw puzzle have been taken out & moved about.


How do you know it's not the glitch that can be solved via firmware upgrade? If you see:
1) some black squares,
2) discolored squares like when your VCD player fails to read that VCD,
3) horizontal bands of video displaced, like shutter blinds.

All these symptoms only lasts for a few seconds.

It's DV error caused by tape and / or dirty heads, when the error correction cannot rebuild the data. Usually it comes with some "squarks" or sometimes silence in the audio. Time to give those heads a clean! You dont' have to wait for the "Clean Head" error message to come up on your cam.

You may not want to continue using the tape... transfer the contents to another cam/ dv tape / computer.

Sometimes the bit of dust or dirt gets loose the more times you play it, so by the 3rd playback it MAY no longer be there.


As for Panasonic, you may want to capture to PC & print out the frames with glitches, plus attach a detailed report when you send your cam in. This proves that your cam has a problem. So that they know you're serious, and they can log it properly & send it to Panasonic Japan. The fix must come from Panasonic Japan. Show them the techbull.pdf that I got from Stuart in Panasonic Australia - it's with Frank's web page http://www.dvfreak.com/pana_mx5.htm, scroll down to
"Panasonic MX300 latest firmware info (PAL, version 1.6)"
This proves to them that others have recognized the problem & there is a fix.

If this is the first time your local Panasonic service center has come across this glitch, then they don't know about the firmware upgrade, and will blame your PC. I guess Panasonic Australia, Panasonic Malaysia, and perhaps Panasonic Hong Kong (Alan Suen, one of our forum members who got his firmware upgrade is from Hong Kong) know about it, so you won't get any hassles there. I know this chap from Russia who's having major problems trying to get his upgrade.

Perhaps someone in power can pester Panasonic Japan to tell all their PAL service centers about the upgrade?

One more thing. If you've never sent your cam in for service, or did but have never been told your cam has the EEPROM / firmware upgrade, then you've still got the default 1.4 firmware in your cam.

I think 1.6 firmware (fixes glitches & better OIS when zooming over 6x) came out in October 2002 - that's when I got mine fixed.

1.5 firmware fixes the glitches but doesn't have the better OIS fix.


Yeah, it isn't fair to the user: to have mental torture trying to figure out if his / her DV computer is broken. Maybe a worldwide FREE recall for firmware upgrade is in order?

More tips that I learnt from Terrence when I first got my MX300.

Never switch tapes. Use Panasonic. Use tapes once. (Andrew Hogan's practice too).

Record Color Bars for the first 30 seconds of the tape. Then rewind & play back, observing the LCD carefully.
This cleans up any dirt that may be there, shows any imperfection on the tape. Also helps when you give your tape to someone & they need to calibrate their equipment to your tape.

Don't have to get those really expensive high grade Panasonic tapes. It's OK to use LP with your LP90min / SP60min tape if you don't plan to use another deck or give it to someone else. Quickly transfer it to computer after the shoot (the manual says the DV tape recordings last like 6 months?!!!!!?).

Don't leave the tape in the cam longer than you have to, put it in before the shoot, and take it out right after the shoot. Try not to transport the cam with the tape still inside. The tape gets wound around the heads etc. and tape damage may occur if you are unlucky.

My own experience: tape does get bent / bowed at the edges especially if you leave it in the sun, in the car boot on a sunny day. Beware! This has resulted in some glitches in that section of tape - the type that can't be fixed via firmware upgrade.

Whilst I agree in general with your excellent comments about tape/cam care I have to admit that I don't actually follow the advice!
It's strange but I think it's because I had a Sony TRV900 that was an absolute lemon - it chewed up tapes, the mics were faulty and it also had a lens that seemd to leave a nasty green flare on anything that had the slightest backlight in the scene...
I got so paranoid whilst I had the TRV900 - I used to remove tapes after use (despite the TRV900 not having a decent 'end search' like the MX300!), never take it outdoors in showers, lots of little things like that - I was almost afraid to use it because of it's inherent faults...
Since getting rid of it and buying the MX300 I have enjoyed the (almost) total freedom of having a decent cam that does not need such 'kid glove' treatment! I keep a tape in it, threaded up and ready to roll (I do a bit of 'stringer' work for local ch9 news) I leave the battery on the cam, I use it in light showers and I take it everywhere in the back of my car, and it just works!

About the only thing I am not keen to do is use different brands of tape - I *know* that can be a problem, especially for the hyper-sensitive TRV900...

Maybe I am being foolish but for some reason I feel that the MX300 will not let me down, unlike that pile of expensive junk from Sony...

Did you ever get rid of your TRV900? I recall all the problems you had with it.

Here's some info about tapes:

http://www.dvfreak.com/tape.htm

MAYBE SOMEONE CAN HELP THIS FELLOW FROM THE NETHERLANDS?

Hi Frank,

I'm eric (we wrote at dv.com) and want to improve my stabilizer of my mx300 (of course). Sometimes I do have a a F02 error, kind of freezing camera and contacted Panasonic Netherlands for that problem, that seems to be a software problem, so no problem except my camera is gone for 3 weeks.

I called Panasonic Netherlands this morning to have both jobs done: the error and the improvement of the stabilizer. This guy on the phone new about "the stories on the Internet, and about this guy in Australia". He said: "we don't call it firmware, it doesn't exist". But when I asked him if the "software upgrade 1.6" does exist, he refused to give an answer. He said to send the camera and describe the problem and it will be fixed. Well, I asked him if he will upgrade to 1.6 he refused to answer.

So, my camera is gone for 3 weeks and I don't know what they are going do. What's going on? is it illegal? Why do I get this weird answers? If you have some experience with this, please let me know.

All the best, Eric

My response:

Dear Eric,

Do post your concerns on the MX forum at: www.dvinfo.net. Also, I have something about the firmware version 1.6 on my MX page: http://www.dvfreak.com/pana_mx5.htm

Here is a little info from Panasonic for the version 1.5 upgrade:

The MX300A when connected via Firewire as "player" to other Firewire devices may intermittently glitch in the data stream. The block noise will be random in either 1 x field or 1 x frame. When block noise appears it can be seen on the cameras viewer whilst playing and recording Computer or other camera simultaneously. Remedy: EEPROM data must be updated to version 1.50

Software revision is for PAL (NV-MX300). Software changes can only be done by Panasonic or Panasonic Dealers who process TATSUJIN alignment tools.

Perhaps contact StuartC@panasonic.com.au for a contact in The Netherlands?

I think that this guy from Panasonic Netherlands is either not wanting to help you, he doesn't know how, or he's simply a fool. Demand that they upgrade your cam's EEPROM data to version 1.6. Or take them to court and/or start posting in the MX forum about your problems with Panasonic.

Sincerely,
Frank

Gosh, poor Eric! I feel for him!

It can't be illegal. I sent my cam to the official Panasonic Service Center in Malaysia, asked for revision 1.5. After about 3 months, finally got a reply from Panasonic Japan, they upgraded it, BONUS, they gave me the latest, revision 1.6. IT REALLY DOES FIX THE DV OUT GLITCHES & ALSO IMPROVES THE OIS PAST 6X. REALLY.

I don't think Panasonic Malaysia ever contacted Stuart @ Panasonic Australia to check up on the firmware upgrade. They can't "cross divisions", they've got to get their orders from the "top of the tree" / head honcho, and that's Panasonic Japan. The orders as well as the software to do the firmware upgrade HAS TO COME from Panasonic Japan. Sounds like the message is getting stuck in between somewhere. Japanese are very methodical & stick by the given rules, so you've got to have "bereucratic smarts" (sp?) to know how to play by their game, to get what you want. Proper channels, proper procedures, produces results.

Anyways, Pana Japan should reply faster now to Pana Netherlands, since they've obviously been pestered by us MX300 owners all over the world demanding the upgrade, and all pretty recently too.

Maybe Pana Netherlands doesn't have the hardware equipment which hooks via PC RS-232 port to the MX300 to do the upgrade.

Sounds like the Netherlands guy is non committal. I do that too at work, when I'm not really sure if I can really fix someone's hardware equipment . :) Is the Netherlands Pana guy an OFFICIAL Panasonic Service Center that can repair on site, or just a go-between & they send the set somewhere else?

Too bad if you're the first one to "educate" your local Pana Service Center about this upgrade, like I was. The second guy to request for the upgrade will get it done easier since that Pana center knows about it. But I think procedually, you need to prove that your cam has the problem, but that's easy enough to challenge them to hook it up to another DV cam.

It doesn't help when the MX300 is now considered obsolete, the the support / response time isn't that great or critical. :( :(

I hope Stuart can help. Maybe we can get somebody's contact in Pana Japan & do a petition? I mean they can't do this runaround thing to us loyal Pana cam users... 8O 8O The least they can do is to send a proper "technical update bulletin" to all their Service Centers. I will *gladly* sign the petition & even send my personal testimony. Just that I don't know where to send it to!

Finally, the magic words to use in the service request form are:

DV OUT Glitches, please upgrade EEPROM to revision 1.6".

******
Asking for "OIS / stabilizer improvement" is NOT what you should ask for.
******
'Cos Panasonic doesn't officially know or acknowledge that the 1.6 firmware fixes the OIS. Frank asked what is included in the 1.6 upgrade & Pana just have it listed as "improves performance," and overcomes "a problem with capture to PC. The upgrade addresses an issue with Motion DVSTUDIO editing software."
So, nothing mentioned about the OIS improvement, but it's there. Really!

I've just been checking out the actual tape that I'd captured to my Mac and had the Video Blocks and bands and pic freeze for about 4 frames and Audio drop out. And it mustn't be the firewire firmware as the glitch can be seen when playing the tape thru the MX300 and out of its AV socket into a TV.
So maybe the firmware ver 1.5 did fix the firewire problem, but not the camera problem.

Eric, this fellow lives in The Netherlands and owns a MX300. I believe he had the firmware upgraded to version 1.5. Perhaps e-mail him to find out who his Panasonic contact is. His name is Mark:

mail@markonthe.net


Re: "had the video blocks and bands and pic freeze for about 4 frames and Audio drop out."

I still think this is a result of dirty heads or a head problem. But I could be wrong.

Hi, Andrew.

I agree with Frank. Sounds like a head or tape problem. Most likely head problem since you've getting this on multiple tapes, right?. Tapes that have that 30 seconds of Color Bars in the beginning to sweep away stray dirt? Just checking.

Have you run many tapes already through that cam? Maybe the head is worn out already?

Remember I said the firmware fixable glitch lasts 2 or 3 frames, and in each of those 2 to 3 frames there is a "displacement of video squares"? I want to add that the "displacement of video squares" are in DIFFERENT places for EACH of those 2 to 3 frames. And those "displaced video squares" are NOT BLACK, they actually contain valid picture data.

If you see "picture freezes" for a few frames (the picture in the frames don't change at all - the whole frame is repeated x times) then it's problems reading the tape - error correction has failed.

Just to add to Steven's glitch description - the displaced blocks are actually repeated blocks but in the wrong place, they seem to be 'filling in' for loss of data by using a previous piece of data.
If you have an NLE system it's quite easy to go to the actual two or three frames where the glitch is and see that there will be some 'super-blocks' (quite large rectangles of picture, not just a few random pixels) that have been repeated in parts of the frame in places where they shouldn't be...

(Can we post jpg's here? I have some good examples)

BTW, I hope this doesn't confuse the issue but it *is* possible to see 'the glitch' on a TV if you happen to have it connected to the MX300 whilst it is playing via firewire to another camcorder.

So in Andrews' case it *could* be 'the glitch' but it could also be a tape problem. If the glitch is exactly repeatable each time you play it back then it's *not* the 'firewire glitch', it's a tape drop out or a head cleaning issue...

You can send me 1 or 2 low res pics, and I'll upload them to one of my websites (with links). I think I have some room at http://www.8palm.com - I have to start updating http://www.dvfreak.com and make some room there for MX6000 info, along with some of the new stuff---that should be out soon. I haven't seen anything good, though, in way of new cams.

My e-mail is: granit@imag.net

Thanks a lot guys,

I mailed mark, also a mx300 owner in the netherlands, and he said that pana netherlands f_cked up his camera twice, great. maybe send it to dueseldorf, germany, where volkert had his camera done.

Perhaps you could post Panasonic's address, phone number and a contact when you find out---from Dueseldorf, Germany. This would help other members who are in a similar situation. Thanks for this info! Good luck, and let us know what happens.

It was about time I registered for this community, and acknowledged Frank Granovski's kind help in diagnosing my MX300 glitch problem, and providing Stuart Cooper's contact info. Thank you Frank!

Also, I read through all the threads about this glitching problem with the MX300, and all this information was really helpful. Thank you all!

I am a MX300 owner from the Netherlands currently living in Israel. There are no Panasonic service centers in Israel capable of doing the firmware upgrade. When I first contacted the Panasonic service center in the Netherlands, they wrote back to me saying that they did not know about the firmware upgrade. But after I sent them the Panasonic technical bulletin (techbull.pdf, see http://www.dvfreak.com/techbull.pdf, need Adobe Acrobat Reader to read this document), they acknowledged that they would be able to perform this firmware upgrade. They did not say whether it would be 1.5 or 1.6, though.

I posted the address of the Panasonic service center in the Netherlands to the "List of Service Centers who can do Firmware Upgrade 1.6" thread (see http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7265).

I haven't actually sent my camera to them yet, as I am worried about sending such an expensive camera off. I may wait with the upgrade until I am able to take the camera somewhere myself (I travel quite extensively for work). So please do not take this as an endorsement of this service center's quality of workmanship.

If anyone has actually had the firmware upgrade done at Panasonic Nederland, I'd be interested to know if they did it properly.

Welcome Ariel! Nice to see that you finally made it here. The members here are very friendly and helpful, however, I wished more MX owners would join us to make this a larger pool of experience. Thank you for you're other post.

I suggest you contact Pana before sending them your cam. Also, if you do send it, get in insured. You never know what could happen.