The answer is Matrox Axio LE and Adobe Premiere Pro:

True, but it won't run on a laptop. Edius Broadcast should be the answer.

I downloaded the demo for Edius pro. Which also has the Broadcast abilities such as aquisition of DVCPRO HD.

We were at a monthly film meeting. I hooked buddies HVX to the lap top using my firewire cord but I couldn't capture. Perhaps I had a setting wrong?

I'm more of a creative spirit when it comes to film opposed to a tech junky. And although new cameras and NLEs excite me I'm too much of a dumb ass to figure out how to get them to work unless I can have a lot of time with them.

It's not imperative that I figure out how to do this at this time. But one gentleman at the meeting was very adamant that the HVX cannot record to laptop. But I begged to differ. He also said that HVX records 4:4:2 and that it's true HD, but others on these forums have stated it's 4:2:2 and isn't true HD.

At this point I'm getting so confused I don't know what to believe.

I downloaded the demo for Edius pro. Which also has the Broadcast abilities such as aquisition of DVCPRO HD.

We were at a monthly film meeting. I hooked buddies HVX to the lap top using my firewire cord but I couldn't capture. Perhaps I had a setting wrong?

I'm more of a creative spirit when it comes to film opposed to a tech junky. And although new cameras and NLEs excite me I'm too much of a dumb ass to figure out how to get them to work unless I can have a lot of time with them.

It's not imperative that I figure out how to do this at this time. But one gentleman at the meeting was very adamant that the HVX cannot record to laptop. But I begged to differ. He also said that HVX records 4:4:2 and that it's true HD, but others on these forums have stated it's 4:2:2 and isn't true HD.

At this point I'm getting so confused I don't know what to believe.

I hope the mods will forgive for info on other forums, but since there is not a dedicated Edius forum here, there is discussion of this issue on DVX User's new Edius broadcast forum and Canopus runs its own user forum. Unfortunately I have neither a HVX or Edius, so cannot verify.

Edius Broadcast and Avid XPress Pro HD both support firewire capture from the HVX.

It'll be tough to do on a laptop though. The throughput requirements are pretty high. You may need something like an external G-Raid to pull it off. If you're doing 720/24p mode, it'll be much easier to capture because the data rate is lower. Edius lets you capture just the active frames (so only recording the actual 24 frames, not all 60 in the 60p stream).

I was thinking it'd be possible to capture directly to a laptop with no problem when I first read about the small amount of content the P2 cards could capture. Their capacity is not worth anywhere near their price tag for me so this notion of using a laptop is good.

But no matter what, you can't use the camera to control when the computer is recording right? You have to actually use the computer keyboard to "capture" or record, right? I'm worried more for my desktop g5 for the interior shooting.

May I ask why?

TIA

Regards
Leigh

True, but it won't run on a laptop.

can't speak for PC but HVX runs fine through a powerbook G4. a friend tested it this way and results were good. however, if i remember right, the best way is to use firewire 800 and an external drive of course.

i'll be testing this system next week with a 30' firewire cable. will post the results.

tim

I have the HVX200 and have ordered the FS-100.
Will I be able to transfer the MXF files through FS-100 to an AVI file and be able to edit with Premiere Pro 2.0?

Thanks for your help.

I think the current best method is to use either 'Raylight' to create an AVI reference movie to the original MXF or 'DV Film Maker' to re-wrap the MXF essence to Cineform AVI.

The second option would be pricey - it would mean £145 for DV Film Maker and $499 for Aspect HD.

Check out: http://www.dvfilm.com/maker

There is also a note in this thread to say Cineform will release a new version of Aspect HD by the end of the month to support the HVX200, in which case you would not need DV Film maker:
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=54747

Mark

We (CineForm) have an almost-public beta just posted for the next release of Aspect HD that supports the HVX200. "Almost public" means that if you email David Newman you'll get the link - it's not yet on our public site, and won't be for a few days. See the thread in the CineForm forum: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=67198 for details.

David.

David - Is there any advantage of Aspect over Raylight ? Especially since Aspect is $300 more than Raylight ?

I have Raylight now. I use PP2.0 and Vegas on a PC platform. . . .Thanks

Vince, first of all, sorry about the "missive", but I'll mention a few things:

1) Aspect HD is a real-time editing engine that displaces the native editing engine in Premiere. As part of the engine, Aspect HD has its own RT effects, transitions, motion engine, etc. When the Aspect HD engine is in operation, the Premiere interface issues "commands" to the CineForm engine. It is how we achieve performance that is about 4X faster than native Premiere performance.

2) Underneath our RT engine is our CineForm Intermediate codec which is designed for a multi-generation post workflow. Its quality is superb, and it has been used in numerous feature films. Following is a link to a quality analysis we performed a while ago comparing to a native DVCPRO HD post workflow: http://www.cineform.com/technology/HDQualityAnalysis10bit/HDQualityAnalysis10bit.htm. That analysis was done with our 10-bit Prospect HD codec, but you definitely get the idea. For support of the HVX200 we convert the P2 files to CineForm Intermediate for higher visual fidelity through post and improved editing performance.

3) The conversion utility in Aspect HD offers numerous options for DVCPRO HD source files, including 1280 x 720 for native 960 x 720 P2 source files, and 1440 x 1080 for native P2 1280 x 1080 source files. It is then trivial to include files from multiple sources (HDV, HVX, etc) on the same editing timeline. There are many other user options available. In this link we give you a flavor of that: http://www.cineform.com/products/hvx200support/hvx200.htm.

In comparison, Raylight is a DVCPRO HD codec with an AVI wrapper for use in PC applications. It replaces the P2 MXF wrapper with an AVI wrapper for broad PC compatibility. This technique is completely valid, and if the result meets your performance, visual quality, and feature requirements then it'll be a good solution for you.

But I think you'll find that for multi-generation post-production the visual fidelity result of CineForm Intermediate is superior to any DVCPRO HD codec because CI was designed for post, not for tape acquisition. And the performance of our RT engine can't be equalled with any other solution, including hardware based solutions.

You can try Aspect HD on a 15-day trial with full functionality to better judge for yourself. For the next few days you'll need to request the Beta release directly from David Newman as I mentioned in a post above. By sometime next week we'll have a general release that you can navigate to directly from our website.

By the way, our Connect HD is $199, and will include DVCPRO HD support in the next week or so. Connect HD has the same CineForm Intermeditate codec and conversion utility, but without the RT engine included in Aspect HD. It is targeted for all PC apps outside Premiere Pro.

Thanks for the explanation.

I appreciate the HVX200 support for this product and future products. I and others I know have purchased the HVX200 for possible film out and film festivals, and your 10-bit products and HDLink Integration is great.

As I do most of my editing on Vegas, Ill look forward to your continued support with Sony also. . ..

First question: Will this combination work? Cineform says its Aspect HD software will allow Premiere Pro 2.0 to work with the HVX's MXF files. But there is no specific mention of the FS-100 hard-drive. Can Premiere Pro 2.0 + Aspect HD import MXF files from an FS-100 drive onto a PC for editing?

Also, I placed this order on Friday, but I have since been reading some horror stories about the FS-100 Firestore device dropping out, not being recognized via firewire, and even catching on fire! I was planning to use the firestore as my primary/only p2 storage device on a 25-day feature shoot, but now I'm worried. If that firestore drive breaks down, my whole feature will come to a grinding halt.

Then again the P2 cards are very, very expensive, and not as ideal for a movie shoot as a 100-gig drive like the Firestore.

Also, what about variable frame-rates on the FS-100? Can I shoot ten minutes of 24p, then switch to 60p? It seems like the FS-100 has frame-rate limitations that P2 cards do not? Is that correct?

Thanks if anyone can offer advice.

Edit: I guess I could buy two FS-100s? Or maybe get the FS-100 and one p2 card to shoot variable framerate stuff?

Has anyone heard of the CitiDisk HD storage device?

http://www.shining.com/products/totalsolution/citidisk_hd

It appears to store 120 gigs, is small, and only costs $1,100. I could buy two of those.

This is probably real noob question, but I've read such great things about this camera, and I've got such significant investment already into the Adobe Production Suite, I'm wondering, how well does Premiere Pro accommodate the HVX200's formats? Is the camera supported?

Thanks

You have to use Raylight or Cineform to convert the files. . .

this shows how to work with Premiere for Raylight. . .

http://dvfilm.com/raylight/raylightTutorial4.htm

http://www.dvfilm.com/raylight/

and here is another post re: Premiere + HVX200

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=68377

or just use the SEARCH for premiere and hvx200 on this forum or that OTHER one. . ...

Thanks for those links. I couldn't actually read the last one, it keeps taking me to a server not found page, but the first 2 links worked fine.

Anything new on Adobe Premiere Pro supporting P2?

I don't want to spend alot of extra money on CineForm Hardware just to convert the files.

Anyone know if they will be coming out with a newer version with support for P2 anytime soon?

I'm a PC guy and an Adobe Software user for years... I'd like to stay with it.

I'm getting ready to purchase Adobe Production Studio Premium, but I'm sceptical to buy the current version, if the next version will support it. I am purchasing the "Student" version, so NO UPGRADES or PLUG-INS.

Thanks,
Dan

You don't need any hardware, and CineForm doesn't include hardware anyway.

Your Premiere Pro options are:
1) Matrox Axio, which is a hardware board set
2) RayLight, a $195 program that converts the HVX files to .AVI
3) Serious Magic DVCPRO-HD Decoder, a program that works similarily to RayLight
4) CineForm, a $500 program that works similarly but converts the files into CineForm HD codec and offers more features

Premiere Pro doesn't have native support by itself. If you want to use an HVX, and you want to use Premiere Pro, then you've GOT to get something else in-between or the two won't work together.

Sorry, I meant SOFTWARE. I didn't want to have to purchase a different card, or any other software just to convert the files. Their's no reason why Premiere Pro shouldn't support the P2 camera Natively. (IMO) I was worried that I was going to have to shell out another $500 bucks for CineForm.

Anyway... I'm glad you told me about Serious Magic!!!

I googled Serious Magic and Adobe Premiere Pro and got a news release issued in September.

http://www.seriousmagic.com/news/DVCProHDDecoder.cfm

You may notice as well at the top left it says: "An Adobe Company"

I love it!!! It says in the presser that it is available for download for $195 bucks. I wonder if that excludes "Student Verisons" of Premiere?

Also, since they are now supported/owned by Adobe... does that answer my earlier question... "Anyone know if they will be coming out with a newer version with support for P2 anytime soon?" Will they release a new version with Serious Magic already installed?

Thanks for you help Barry. Lots of help.

Regards,
Dan

I'm sure the next version of PP that they release will have full support. Just sit tight for now. It's either that or spend a little cash.

Yeah, what will happen is anybody's guess. They did say that some serious magic technologies would be incorporated in future adobe products. Does that mean they'll bundle the DVCPRO-HD Decoder in Premiere Pro? Maybe, who knows?

The thing is: if you want to work with Premiere Pro TODAY, you've got to spend some cash to get one of the appropriate tools, because Premiere Pro (for whatever reason) doesn't support it right now, as-is, in its stock configuration.

You might write to Serious Magic and ask them what their policy would be for Premiere Pro users who want to buy the DVCPRO-HD decoder; they might have some suggestions already?

Anyone try this yet?

http://www.mainconcept.com/site/index.php?id=18023

Adobe just announced this, and the bundle only pertains to Intel Macs.

Wondering if this means that it will support DVCProHD and/or MXF out of the box or it needs the codec installed by FCP.

Interesting stuff.

Do you have a link? Is it for the bootcamp side or the Mac side?

They are bringing it back for Mac OSX Intel Machines only.

http://www.macworld.com/news/2007/01/03/premiere/index.php?lsrc=mcrss

You can download a Beta copy of Soundbooth for Intel-Macs on the Adobe labs site: http://labs.adobe.com. There is no Beta available for the Mac-Premeire but who knows, maybe they'll release one someday.

I've tried Soundbooth Beta and found it overly simplified; no sound shaping controls available (curves, time etc) but apparently that's not within the mission profile for Soundbooths' intended market.

Raylight came up with a great update, no more conversion between MXF and AVI is needed.
"New with release 2.02: plug-ins for both Adobe PremiereTM and Sony VegasTM to allow you to drag MXF files directly into the project!"

www.dvfilm.com

Although not confirmed it's almost 95% sure that the upcoming versions of FCP, Avid and others will also be able to use MXF natively by NAB or at least announce the launch of such updates. In the meantime Raylight works for PC's, HD Log and P2 Log are my preferred trans-code converters for the Mac.

Great news for Premiere users !

hI,
I know that most of the people edit with finnal cut, but I have been working with Premier for years I now we are buying a HVX and we are thinking who will work premier and which level of PC we will need to work properly.
Thank you very much
Pablo

Hi Pablo,

There is an update coming to CS3 that makes PPro (CS3 only) P2 compatible.

It's not out yet, but it will be very soon.

-Brad

This was announced several weeks ago at IBC.

I don't know whether it will be out "very soon" inasmuch as it was announced and hasn't shipped.

But it was announced.

for more than a year. As I understand it, the biggest difference between Adobe and other NLEs is that Adobe thus far does not like P2/mxf file format, so I use CineForm Aspect HD (and HDLink, when necessary). Aspect HD works as a plug-in to PPro2, while HDLink is a standalone program.

I shoot to P2, offload to a hard drive, then use HDLink to "Convert" the footage. I destine the converted footage to a separate folder, and I'm then ready to bring it in to PPro2. The conversion does add a few additional minutes to the time it takes to ingest, but is still impressively shorter than capturing tape.

Be aware there is other software named Raylight (Raylite?) that is either free or considerably less expensive than Aspect HD. I know that's used by lots of folks on this forum, and I've heard/read it does everything (or nearly so) that Aspect HD does.

Until whatever P2/mxf update to CS3 comes along, Raylight would probably be the least expensive option.

Once you get a good grip on the workflow, you may find yourself thinking you'll never go back to tape again.

Good luck...and enjoy.

DAV’s TechTable by Dave HelmlyPrem Pro & P2

What’s New?

With the new Premiere Pro CS3 and the 3.1 update, you can now natively Ingest, Edit, and Export the Panasonic P2 format. All you need to do is to shoot your video and simply drag ,drop , and edit – it’s that easy. There is no need to transcode your video with an intermediate codec in order to use them on the timeline, and there are no AVI or Quicktime wrappers – just native P2 format.

Premiere Pro CS3 will actually allow you to edit directly on the P2 card. This means you can shoot your video and start making a quick rough cut on your laptop while going to your next shoot. Once you get back to your desktop Premiere Pro workstation, you can copy the P2 clips onto your desktop workstation and continue editing. For those of you with a Matrox Axio, you’ve been asking for a laptop based solution to use with your Axio and it’s finally here.

If you use or plan to buy any of the AJA or BlackMagic products, you’ll be pleasantly surprised with their support for Premiere Pro CS3 (v3.1) as well.
http://blogs.adobe.com/davtechtable/2007/10/intro_to_premierepro_and_p2_su.html

Gary

Thank you very much to all of you for your information.
Another question is what I need to move properly the 100 Mbs in my computer?
We are going to do a docu that will be 55 minutes, so we are worry how we can move of that data.
Thanks in advanced
Pablo

Just viewed the video "how to" over at Dave's site. Excellent integration by Adobe of P2.

If you need additional performance beyond what Premiere Pro 3.1 will give you woth P2, you should check out Matrox RT.X2.

It will add a level of real-time editing to your workflow.
http://www.videoguys.com/Emails/rtx2-bun.html

Gary

Gary,

Shouldn't we be able to get "real-time" viewing with the BM-Intesity card to a preview monitor without using the Matrox RT card....

Not sure if you'll get real-time output of P2 footage w/ Intensity. It should work, but we never tried it. Intensity & Intensity Pro are amazing cards that give you fantastic HDMI I/O.

Just to clarify. The RT.X2 doesn't give you real-time previews, it gives you real-time video editing. Many of us have forgotten how valuable this added performance can be. With DV computers have gotten do fast that real-time hardware isn't needed. With compressed HD formats (HDV, DVCProHD etc.) the RT.X2 adds a level of real-time features that can have a significant impact on your workflow.

Gary

My understanding is that the Intensity card is not compatible with 24pNative footage.

Not certain, but that's what I recall being told in response to a question.

I noticed in Dav's video that he was importing 1080i video from the P2. While he was importing the footage I looked and did not see the option to import 1080p. Does Adobe Premiere Pro CS3 work with 1080p?

Also, Cineform might be worth considering for your workflow with Premiere & P2... I'm honestly not sure how it works with P2 as I've never played with one, but it could make for a nice workflow for ya!

C

I noticed in Dav's video that he was importing 1080i video from the P2. While he was importing the footage I looked and did not see the option to import 1080p. Does Adobe Premiere Pro CS3 work with 1080p?

There is a DVCProHD 1080i 24p preset.

If you need additional performance beyond what Premiere Pro 3.1 will give you woth P2, you should check out Matrox RT.X2.

It will add a level of real-time editing to your workflow.
http://www.videoguys.com/Emails/rtx2-bun.html

Gary

This is true for 1080 HDV, but not DVCPRO HD 1080. The RT.X2 only goes as far as 720P with DVCPRO HD.

From the Matrox website:
• Native HDV 1080i, HDV 1080p, HDV 720p (JVC ProHD), Panasonic P2 MXF 720p, and MPEG-2 4:2:2 I-frame HD editing

What would rendering times be like with the RTx2?
Rendering is the bain of the adage...time is money...arrrrgghhhhhh

What about Glass Valley's (Canopus) EDIUS? I have been using it with great success to edit P2 / MXF files. It is totally seemless - just import the clips directly (no conversion, no rendering) into EDIUS BIN and everything is there, ready to be dragged to timeline.