Hey everyone, love the board and just signed up. Maybe some of your guys can help clear up some of the remaining issues I have concerning wide angle lenses. I'm interested in purchasing a wide angle lens for the dvx and not really sure what differences I'll see when I purchase one. I see on and B&H that they now are selling some new ones by centruy optics. First question revolves on the differences between the lenses themselves(i.e. 0.7x etc.) I understand that the higher you go, the wider your angle but will these lenses cause a fisheye effect. I assume not because they are somewhat pro lenses. Should I wait for the Panny one coming out soon? Like I said, any suggestions in this area would be a great help. My second question involves remote zoom and focus control. Now I have used both the varizoom and zoe controllers and I can honestly say that they both perform subpar. The throttle control on the varizoom is simply rediculous and does not allow for any smooth zooms at all. As for the zoe, yes it is a better design and imitates the professional more but the slowest zoom on it is barely slower than the panasonic's and does not warrant the $299 pricetag. In order to fully compliment the 24p of the camera you must have a slow, slow crawl to obtain cinematic results. Either controller merely looks like a standard dv cam. But this is what I am asking you all for comment about. I read that varizoom was making a zoom and focus controller that imitates the type found ont he xl1. Machine controlled and allows for manual focus and zoom. This would be fantasic. Anyone who has heard anything on this topic would be greatly appreciated. Thanks again in adavnce to anyone who is able to help me with my questions. Thanks and keep up the good work. Glad to be a member.

Hello Mike, and welcome aboard!

<< I understand that the higher you go, the wider your angle >>

Actually it's the exact opposite... the lower the number, the wider your angle of view through a wide-angle adapter. Remember it's a multiplication of focal length by a value less than 1, so that:

100mm and a 0.7x adapter equates to 100 x 0.7 or 70mm

100mm and a 0.5x adapter equates to 100 x 0.5 or 50mm

Whereas a teleconverter is a multiplication of focal length by a value more than 1, such as a 1.7x converter.

<< Should I wait for the Panny one coming out soon? >>

Panasonic doesn't make their own glass, they contract it, so it'll be third-party anyway. As it is, you can't go wrong with Century Optics, they make superb products.

<< the slowest zoom on it is barely slower than the Panasonic's >>

It's important to understand that this is a limitation of the camera, not the controller. On rare occasions a controller might be able to access one step slower or faster zoom speed than what's on a particular model camera's zoom rockers, but this doesn't happen very often. Again, this is a limitation of the camera, not the controller.

Hope this helps,

I'm sorry for the way I phrased the question about the lenses. I meant exactly what you explained. Base on your opinion, which lens would you reccommend? Should I go for the widest, or something in the middle. As for the zoom controller, I fully realize that it is the camera that basically is in control of this yet all I meant was that neither controller available is really worth the money right now if you are looking to simulate that film look. Thanks for clearing up some issues though.

Check out this link:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5827

In a nutshell, Varizoom is already working on an external FOCUS mechanism for remote focus on the DVX100. This should be available in the next month or two.

As for ZOOM controllers that allow a very slow, cinematic zoom, the rep from Varizoom said they're toying with the idea of making an external zoom controller, possibly combined with the focus controller. This, however, is not definite, as of yet.

Hope this helps!

Chris:

Any sponsors going to carry these?

Hi Stephen,

You mean the controllers? VariZoom itself is a DV Info Net sponsor and sells direct. Other DV Info Net sponsors such as ZGC and Pro-Tape are also VariZoom dealers. See www.dvinfo.net/sponsors -- hope this helps,

Nope - sorry, I meant the Century Optics adapters.

Oh. Well, I don't think so as of yet. We need one, definitely.

Guys, thanks for the help so far. One more question though. If I purchase one of the lenses,(I', leaning more toward the .7x for the versatility) do I need to purchase any other accesories in order to view this? I dont think I should at all right? It should just be widening the range of the lens. I just want to make sure I'm doing this right. Thanks again.

If anyone is interested in seeing the new lens adaptors for the panny 24p by century optics then just go over to their website.
type in www.centuryoptics.com and then click on the new products banner at the top of the page. On the "new products" page you will see a list of all the adpators that they now carry. They give both pictures, prices and descriptions, etc.


john,


p.s. can anyone confirmed if and when panasonic is coming out
with there own 16x9 anamorphic adaptor for the panny 24p?

John check this out, hope it helps.

http://www.zgc.com/html/anamorphic_attachment.html

I was reading about the DVX-100 and noticed that there were several mentions about how the standard lens is "wider" than most, but after looking at the specs, I don't see it.

DVX-100 4.5-45 mm
PD150 6.0-72 mm
GL2 4.2-84 mm

Am i missing something?

Thanks

Carl

No, you're not missing anything Carl - you've written down the figures correctly. The VX2k goes down to 6mm but the DX100 goes down to 4.5mm. Both have 1/3" chips, so the Panasonic lens is like having the VX2000 with a 0.7x wide-angle converter permanently in place.

But the Panasonic lens is only 10x zoom, so a max of 45mm (against the VX's 72mm) means that even with 1/3" chips it's goodbye differential focus.

Forget the GL2. It uses 1/4" chips, so the focal length of 4.2mm is the same as the Sony in wide-angle coverage.

tom.

Can anybody recommend a retailer in the US (online or otherwise) with good prices for a wide angle lens for this camera? I've searched a bit, and can't seem to find any lenses (72mm?) for this camera..

BTW, I got my DVX-100 last week, and I love it. The video tests I've done so far are incredible. Very happy with it!

<<<-- Originally posted by Brian Cupini : Can anybody recommend a retailer in the US (online or otherwise) with good prices for a wide angle lens for this camera? I've searched a bit, and can't seem to find any lenses (72mm?) for this camera..

BTW, I got my DVX-100 last week, and I love it. The video tests I've done so far are incredible. Very happy with it! -->>>

I just got mine from Safer Seas...I know someone at Century and they got me a better price than 20% off....I highly recommend the .7 Century...It's nearly as wide as the fisheye with Zoom Through Capability and no distortion...It's a really nice piece of glass! It was 636.00...I normally Shoot 35mm and I'm pretty damn impressed with this Camera.
http://www.Saferseas.com

Hmm... I'm a skateboard videographer, and I've filmed with the VX2000 with the Century fisheye and also the XL1 with the 16x lens with the Century fisheye and I can honestly say that the 0.7x Century does not even remotely approach the wideness of the XL1 fisheye even when mounted on the 3X wide lens.

Thing is Dave that the DVX100 starts life with a wide-angle end of the standard zoom the equivalent of the VX2000 fitted with a 0.7x converter! So anything you fit over the DVX100's lens is a lot more powerful than the same converter on the VX.

But the wince-factor is that huge 72mm filter thread. This limits your options hugely, and at the same time ups the prices dramatically.

tom.

First off, please forgive my general ignorance - I am a hobbyist, and have no formal photography training, so I may ask questions or require clarification about lens technology/effects/etc that you all may take for granted.. =]

The Panasonic accessory list for the DVX-100 lists a wide angle lens adapter for about $450 USD.. Is this a "wide angle lens", or is this just an adapter for another wide angle lens? I'm trying to decide what wide angle lens to buy, and I would like to get the crystal optics .7 wide angle. Will I need this adapter in addition to the lens?

I figured $450 was too cheap for a wide angle, especially since somebody here told me they got their crystal optics for ~$670.. Thanks in advance for any help / insight. This forum has been great for info ever since I bought my camera.

there is a difference between an adapter and a wide angle lens.. the adapter can be fitted on to a standard/long lens and will then give a view witch will simulate that of a wide angle lens. The quality of the wider angle however is most of the time less then that of a real wide angle, distortion, extra glass in front so less light and less quality of picture, or worse some adapters are not completely zoom through... the adapter is an adapter and nothing more! but i think, that you cannot change the lens of the agdvx100 so you will have to make do with the adapter anyway, but you will see the distortion at the edges, you can somewhat work around it by never using the wide angle in its widest setting....that will take the "edge" of it!!

David

Hey guys--I'm need to get the Panasonic Wide Angle adapter for a shoot this weekend but B&H is out of stock. Anyone know where else I can find it? Thanks!

Peter

Did you try Zozt Digital or ProMax? Zotz is a forum sponors (others are in that forum here - might look around.

I'll try them. THanks Stephen.

Anybody have a preference between these two? Is the Panasonic Wide Angle adapter full zoom through, like the Centruy Optics .7mm? Thanks!

Peter

I believe it is, from the press release /NAB reports. The .6x from Century does not zoom through.

Thanks Stephen. What about optical quality? Everyone on the boards seems to like Century Optics. Any difference in the Panasonic? Also, is the Panasonic a .7 or a .6? Thanks,

Peter

I'm pretty sure that the Panasonic is .7x but don't hold me to it. I've always been happy with Century Optics quality - not sure about the Panny. I have seen a side by side yet.

Hi, can someone explain the "zoom through" process? I'm a total camera noob, and I'm learning a lot w/ my DVX100.. Is the zoom-through meaning the wide angle effect will be continuous throughout a zoom, whereas the .6 will only show the wide angle effect with no zoom? I want to buy a wide angle adapter for my camera, and the .6 is about $350 from b&hphoto/video, while the .7 adapter is about $679.. Is there no point to owning the .6 adapter? Thanks in advance for the help.

Hi Brian--The "zoom through" means that the camera gives a usable image through the entire range of the zoom. The .6 mm from Century Optics is an adapter (meaning it has no zoom through. You can zoom for a while, but then the image goes completely out of focus and you cannot render anything but a blurred image). The .7mm from Century is a converter, which means you can zoom through the entire range of the lens and still have a usable image. I'm not sure of the actual optics and physics involved here, leave that to someone more experienced than me to explain. I just got a .6 mm from Century Optics about five minutes ago and did some quick testing. On the widest lens there is quite a bit of barrelling...like a lot, which I'm not particulary a fan of. The overall build and construction seems very high, though. The only reason I would get the .7mm is if you want to leave the converter on and if it has less barrelling (like I said, the .6 mm has a lot). Otherwise, there is overlap between the longest lens you can use with the .6mm adapter and the shortest lens on the DVX100 without adapter, so you have all your focal lengths covered.

So does anyone have side by side experience with the .6 and the .7? Is there any less barrelling with the .7? Certainly it's not as wide, but at the equivalent short focal lenghts to the .6 is there less barrellling distortion? Thanks!

Peter

Peter,

I'm considering getting a wide angle adaptor/converter. If you have a chance could you please try a little experiment for me?

At the widest angle, how many feet away from the front of the lens does a 5'8 or so person need to be for you to just barely see the top of their head and the tips of their shoes at the extreme top and bottom of the frame?

Thanks very much,

--- Mark

Peter, thanks very much for answering.. Can you describe what 'barrelling' is? Is this a distortion of the images around the edges of the frame, where the image is manipulated? Thanks again for your help. I will be happy to trade you back in car/computer information - I know more about those than videography. =]

- Brian

If I am not mistaken, it may be that the Panasonic adaptor is manufactured by Century Optics. Not 100% sure though!

- don

Hi all,

Anybody used the Panny wide angle lens (part # AG-LW7208G)? B&H has it for $389, and I was thinking of getting it instead of spending the $649 on the Crystal Optics .7 wide angle adapter.. Is the Panny wide angle a good lens, or should I just bite the bullet and make the investment on the Crystal Optics .7? Can anybody give me an idea of the differences between the two? Thanks in advance for the advice.

- Brian

There are three major differences between them.

1) the Century Precision Optics .7 is twice as expensive.

2) the Century lens attaches with a quick bayonet system, whereas the Panasonic screws in. The Century is very quick and easy to attach or remove, the Panasonic takes longer, but the Panasonic will work on any 72mm-thread camera whereas the Century will only ever work with the DVX.

3) The Century is wider, at .7x instead of the Panasonic's .8x.

You can see pictures of each lens in action at www.icexpo.com/dvx100/index.html and www.icexpo.com/dvx100/century.html.

Faced with the same choice, I ended up going with the Century .6x. It's much wider than the Panasonic, it's less expensive than either, it seems to be quite sharp. The only drawback is that it isn't full zoom-through, you can zoom in to about Z70 and everything's fine but after about Z70 it loses focus and can't be used. But I figured that it was less than half the cost of the .7X, and if I wanted a wide angle, I wanted a WIDE angle, so the zooming didn't matter so much. It is a bit annoying though that you can't just leave the lens on all the time, because sometimes you do want to zoom in and you can't.

Thanks Barry, that helps a lot! I think I will get the .6 to start, and see where that takes me.

I was wondering if anyone with any experiece with this adapter could tell me if there is any noticable picture distortion with the addition of this adapter?

There is mild barrel distortion, but then again, there's barrel distortion in the DVX's stock lens without any adapter added to it.

See pictures of the various wide-angle options at:
http://www.icexpo.com/dvx100/century.html

Thanks for the response Barry. The link with the .BMP's of the different adapters was very helpful.

The .6x full wide and the .7x full wide seem to have got transposed.

Hey Brian, you're orginal question was the same as mine. Was wondering if you are happy with the panasonic wide angle adaptor?

I got the .6 Century WA and love it! One thing I noticed recently is that you have to go into "macro" focus when using it. When I did my initial testing... I was switching between 60i and progressive modes, so the auto focus was setting it up. Now in production, I am shooting exclusively 30P... I need to manually focus but it isn't always maximum macro and needs to be tweaked for each shot. hmmmmmmm!

Dear DVX 100 users
I am curious as to what options this camera has with interchangable lens'. I speffically need a wide lens. I have done some searching and the only one I can find looks cheap. I really like the canon 3x wide lens for the xl1... I even really like that camera. Can you use the 3x wide lens from the xl1 for this camera? They both are 72mm... so I would assume so.

When i go to purchase my camera, i must decide between the xl1 (which I have used before), the DVX100 (Which i will test first) and the new JVC HD camera. Any thoughts?

I want to get as far away from the video look as possible with the greatest depth of field, for the cheapest. I just don't know.

Michael Estepp

Hi Michael,

Please review the product brochure for the DVX100 (ftp://ftp.panasonic.com/pub/Panasonic/Drivers/PBTS/brochures/B_AG-DVX100.pdf) -- you'll see that the lens is built-in, that is, it's integrated right into the camera body just like the Canon GL2 and the Sony VX2000. Since it's not a "removeable lens" this means that the Canon 3x XL-mount lens is not compatible with the DVX100 or, for that matter, any other camcorder other than a Canon XL1 or XL1S.

When you point out that both the DVX100 and the Canon 3x wide angle lens are 72mm, you're referring to the filter thread diameter on the front of both lenses. This means that a 72mm UV filter will work with any 72mm lens such as the built-in lens on the DVX100 or the 3x wide-angle or 16x standard lens on the Canon.

You can attach a 72mm wide-angle adapter to the front of the DVX100 lens -- there are several 72mm wide-angle adapters to choose from, including Century Optics for example -- but be aware that the built-in lens on the DVX100 *already is* a wide-angle lens. In fact this is one of the unique selling features of the DVX100.

In my opinion you will be most satisfied with the DVX100 or the new DVX100A.

Be careful how you describe depth-of-field. To say that you want the "greatest depth-of-field" would indicate you want deep focus and a very broad focal plane. Video already has that. Many people who are trying to get away from "the video look" are actually seeking the smallest, not geatest, depth-of-field with a shallow focus and a very narrow focal plane. Hope this helps,

Thank you, I read and read about this stuff, and it just doesn't stick. Just one more example me being a person who needs to do things to learn. I need DOP :-)

Hi all,

Just wondering if there is any alternate wide conversion lens out in the market other than the pricey Pana's version?

Search the web but seem to be very little info on the massive 72mm lens filter thread other manufacturers have.

Thanks

By "wide coversion lens" do you actually mean an anamorphic lens?

Nope. Just normal wide conversion len for my 72mm filter theaded DVX100. But cheaper......

I'm about to embark on a project using a DVX100a, and I know it's currently got the widest stock lens of any prosumer cam, but I'd still like to find something wider to stick on the end for certain situations.

I've seen the century optics brochure that talks about the wide angle solutions. . .seem to remember it's just as it is for my XL1s--they have .6x fixed focal length adapter, and a .7x full zoom through converter, and a fisheye (definitely not the one we want).

So, just wondering if anyone's used or owns one of the wide angle adapters/converters for this camera, and how good they are, with regard to barrel distortion (in addition to that which already exists on the DVX100a at it's widest focal length), and soft focus (on my XL1s, when using the .6x century adapter, I've noticed some softness toward the edges of the frame).

Thanks.

I have the Century Optics 0.6 WA adapter. Here's the rundown:
* Only weighs 7 oz. (The 0.7 is almost 1.5 lbs!!!)
* My initial tests show good sharpness, even at the edges.
* It allows partial zoom-through, out to about Z60.
* Barrel distortion is fairly noticable.

I shoot mostly 16:9 (masked, not anamorphic) with my DVX100a, so I really like the wider view of the 0.6 WA.

Good luck,
David

But the DVX100a has in-camera anamorphic, unlike the '100. Isn't it pretty good?

Check this out: I've learned that Panasonic makes their own WA adapter for the DVX series? I was unaware of this. It's an .8x, I'm told. That means about 20% wider than that DVX's stock lens' widest angle of view, correct? Or totally wrong? Anyone know anything about it? Seems like if it's only 1/5th wider, not really worth the effort.