Why, Sony, why? It's the perfect camcorder except for that one little thing. Am I missing something? I'm pretty sure the manual said something about it not being possible, but maybe I read something wrong. I tried hooking everything up but it looks like the AV port is an output only. Can somebody confirm that this has been left out?

You are correct. It's an output only.

That $1400 pricetag for the HC1 is the minimum entrance fee for HDV resolution period. If you want anything else useful beyond that, then the price more than doubles to an FX1. Thus we come to realize the true consumerish nature of these little cams. Therefore, it's not something that has been "left out", but rather something that was never designed to be "in" the first place.

What I am saying is that just because a comparable miniDV product may have all these bells and whistles, doesn't give license for those features to be included on the HC1. What makes the HC1 better than those feature packed miniDV cams is the resolution. That's it, nothing else. It's a first generation HDV camera of it's kind.

Ok so it's an extra $200, but easily solved:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?A=details&kw=CAADVC110&is=REG&Q=&O=productlist&sku=349146

Cheaper still:

http://www.videoguys.com/pyroAVlink.html

You are correct. It's an output only.

That $1400 pricetag for the HC1 is the minimum entrance fee for HDV resolution period.Well, there's the HC3 which is same 1080i HDV res, and it's less than $1200 at B&H:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=423689&is=REG

I know. However, I was referring to the HC1 itself.

Do you just want to use the pass-thru to get analog video to your PC or is the camcorder/firewire an integral part of what you're trying to do?

I just wanted the passthrough. Looks like I'll have to pick up the Pyro then.

What kind of "video" you want to convert to analogog to digital?, because there are many cards in the market, many of them ver cheap, taht can make this kind of work.

Alex, I was thinking of the same thing. Most of the cheaper units use USB or a proprietary card like my Studio Plus 700-PCI version 10.5.

Is firewire a must for the transfer?

Firewire is a must for I/O and this is true of essentially anyone. I'd be surprised if the HC1 is different than the HC3 and A1 in that regard, and the A1 does allow analog monitoring of a Firewire input.

Firewire is a must for I/O and this is true of essentially anyone.

Douglas, we were talking about a 3rd party device without using a camcorder at all to transfer analog video to your PC. Definitely firewire is the preferred method of transfer with digital video.

I understand. But in reading the thread, I didn't understand you were looking for analog input for pass-thru-only, I thought the discussion was also including preview/capture. Apologies.

Canon now has a HDV cam with analog-digital passthru.

http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelFeaturesAct&fcategoryid=177&modelid=14059&pageno=11

Canon now has a HDV cam with analog-digital passthru.

http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelFeaturesAct&fcategoryid=177&modelid=14059&pageno=11

That's a month away, but it looks very interesting. It also has optical image stabilization. And a full one year warranty.

Hi,

I fully understand Sonys logic here. It makes sense to leave this feature out. Not many would have had use for it anyhow. And HC1 is a pure digital unit, even if it has analog outputs - a necessity still for some years to come.

External analog video input is commonplace in Cam's having a CCD. A CCD outputs the signal in the analog domain, and thus requires an A/D-converter to convert the signal into digital. This A/D converter's input can be easily switched to another analog source, such as external analog video, using a cheap video multiplexer. Thus implemeting this feature costs nothing.

The CMOS sensor used in HC1 has an integrated AD-converter directly on the sensor chip. The CMOS output is already in the digital domain. So there is no need for an external AD-converter elsewhere in the HC1. Adding one just to digitize external analog video would not have been clever, just adding to the cost and complecxity of the camera.

This is the logic why there is no analog video input in HC1. It would have been possible to design the CMOS chip in such a way that there would have been also an external input for analog video. But, hey, it is an image sensor chip in the first place. Please remember that the CMOS chip is scanned using completely different frequencies and line counts than PAL/NTSC. Digitizing a PAL/NTSC video using the same AD-converter would have been very difficult if not impossible.

So, in order to digitize analog video, you have to use other equipment. Not a big problem since such devices exist and does not cost very much. You can also use your older camcorder for that. Probably you want to keep it anyhow for playing bakc DV-cassettes without wearing the HC1 unnecessarily.

Best regards,

Christian

Since the HC3 doesn't have analog pass through, does this mean the camera cannot be used for digital to analog conversion for video editing external monitor preview? Thanks.

It can be used for digital to analog preview for monitoring, but cannot be used for Analog input to digital output, for digitizing VHS tape, or other external, analog sources.

Thanks DSE, I'm glad to know the HC3 supports this function. In shopping for a new camera I'm really uncertain how I know if a MiniDV camcorder supports the digital to analog preview ability. It seems like there's no way of knowing from the features and specs of the camera. Maybe I'm worrying about nothing and most if not all camcorders operate in this manner.

To my knowledge, all of the DV camcorders (in the US, different in some non-US regions) support ieee1394 pass through to analog, but not all DV camcorders allow for analog input, 1394 output.

Hi,

I had the opportunity to have a look at the HC1's schematic and block diagram. It seems that the video A/D converters are EXTERNAL from the CMOS imager chip. I was wrong in my earlier assumption that these were ON-chip. SO, it would have been possible for Sony to make an analog pass through with just some minor effort. Seems to more be a political decision. HC1 is regarded as a full digital cam, the analog outputs are a must because the majority of monitors used today have analog inputs...

Christian

My buddy sold me his PV852 and I haven't regreted it. It has the ana-dig passthrough. Maybe look for some similar cameras in a lower price range.

Hi,

I had the opportunity to have a look at the HC1's schematic and block diagram. It seems that the video A/D converters are EXTERNAL from the CMOS imager chip. I was wrong in my earlier assumption that these were ON-chip. SO, it would have been possible for Sony to make an analog pass through with just some minor effort. Seems to more be a political decision. HC1 is regarded as a full digital cam, the analog outputs are a must because the majority of monitors used today have analog inputs...

Christian

also i think the video input is a very different kind of signal to the one originating at the CMOS. at the very least this would require extra circutry to deal with PAL/ NTSC systems. also i believe that all the DV camcorders with analogue input use some type of TBC or simmilar. also not something you need for reading out from a CCD / CMOS.

i still think an A/D capability would have been immensly usefull for me, but i can see that for the most part people have stopped using analog sources. the whole input / ouput is very limited on the HC1. no digital display output. no input other than firewire. to be honest i would have even expected sony to include an HD component to digital (i.e.HDV) conversion. it is an HD camera after all - how else are you supposed to record an analog HD signal?

i still think an A/D capability would have been immensly usefull for me, but i can see that for the most part people have stopped using analog sources. the whole input / ouput is very limited on the HC1. no digital display output. no input other than firewire. to be honest i would have even expected sony to include an HD component to digital (i.e.HDV) conversion. it is an HD camera after all - how else are you supposed to record an analog HD signal?

How many analog HD sources do you have? There are component input add-in cards for computers. Based on the prices for those, putting that feature in the camcorder would make it a lot less attractive for most buyers.

Hi,

You can record a DIGITAL HD signal with the HC1, for example using Vegas and export to HDCAM... Ok, you have to get the analog HD signal first in into Vegas, and there HC1 has no role :)

Mauritius, you are right that the analog video is completely a different signal than what comes out of the HC1'S CMOS sensor. However, the A/D bandwith would be enought to sample a composite DV signal directly with color subcarriers etc. I just would have required some digital post processing. This circuitry would have been required as an additional part just for this A/D function - and for nothing else.

I am not sure if any camcorder analog inputs have timebase correction? Most decks have it - though. Anyhow - all this would have added to the complexity in the already quite crammed HC1.

Most of us still probably have an DV cam with this A/D capability. I have one and have no intentions of getting rid of it, i prefer NOT to use my HC1 for unnecessary playback of just plain old DV cassettes...

Regards,

Christian