So, I did it. I built something.

I stole/borrowed the Matthew Cherry design posted elsewhere, almost exactly.

http://www.birthofthecool.com/dolly.html

So, you can see my spectacularly crappy photos of it (they're frame grabs from my XL2 taken at night outdoors).

The only real issue so far is that as the wheels turn, the seem to unscrew themselves. Each wheel (these are inline wheels) has a washer on either side of it, and a nut on the outer edge against the washer. The wheel turns the washer, the washer turns the nut, and it starts to unscrew. Any way to prevent this? Do I just need to oil everything? This world of building stuff is new to me.

Josh,

Good Job. I mentioned in another thread I just built one as well. To keep wheel nut from loosening, use the locking kind of nut with the white teflon/plastic insert.

I've never heard of those before. I'll go look tomorrow. Are they found at any hardware store?

If anyone wants details (detailed parts list, etc.) let me know. I won't even charge anyone $40.

wheels unscrewing aside, should I oil all those parts anyway?

By the way, if it was unclear, the url link in my initial post is to Matt Cherry's stuff; the dark grainy pics at the bottom are mine.

I've never heard of those before. I'll go look tomorrow. Are they found at any hardware store?

If anyone wants details (detailed parts list, etc.) let me know. I won't even charge anyone $40.

wheels unscrewing aside, should I oil all those parts anyway?

By the way, if it was unclear, the url link in my initial post is to Matt Cherry's stuff; the dark grainy pics at the bottom are mine.

Josh,

The lock nuts should be available pretty much anywhere. The bolt that serves as an axle should be 5/16".

The bearings I bought for the wheels are sealed. I don't think I could lube them if I tried. Maybe you need to back off on the nut slightly if there is too much friction.

Lubing the bolt/nut may cause it to loosen more. You can always use some 'Loctite' to help hold the nut in place.

Actually, my bolts going through the wheel are 1/4". I don't think 5/16 would fit, it's just barely fitting at is.

No lubing, then. I'll find these locking nuts.

When I was thinking of the oiling, though, I meant oiling the washers and nuts, so they'd slide against each other with no friction.

I'm surprised that the bolt is 1/4". In Dan's 'Killer Camera Rigs' book he says that all skate bearings are 5/16". I don't suppose it matters as long as the bearings spin and they fit sort of snug.

I think if you lube with WD40, you might pick up dirt etc. I've heard of a teflon spray lube that doesn't attract gritty stuff.

Yeah, I tried wiggling the bolt inside the bearing, and it doesn't seem like there's another 16th of an inch of room in there.


The locking nuts worked great! Only problem is that Home Depot only had 6 left. So only half the wheels have 'em. I gotta drive around the damn city looking for stupid pieces of metal and plastic.


Seems like the wheels without locking nuts (I hope that's why) are tightening as you push the dolly, loosening as you pull. I hope the locking nuts'll fix all that. And I may have to space the wheels more, as there's not much of a groove for the pipe (I got some 1.5" PVC) to fit into. I guess I could just use more washers.

1.5" is pretty big PVC pipe. If you're having trouble, you can always use 1" or 3/4". Dan's dolly was designed for 3/4" metal (to run up high) or PVC for the ground. Of course then you're stuck with the 1.5", unless HD will take it back.

It sounds as if the nuts are tightening on the wheel when you push one way and loosening when going the other???

I don't think they'll take it back, being that I cut the 10 foot sections down to 8 feet.

I guess I just assumed 1.5" was the proper size. . .it looked like the same kind of pipe Plus8 had when I borrowed their skateboard dolly. Yes, I do realize a skate board dolly hugs the wheels more.

I thought about getting metal, but for some reason everyone always mentions using PVC as track.

I'll try working with the 1.5" pipe for a while, see how it goes.

Yes, you're right about the nuts. I think getting the locking ones will solve that problem. It takes a tremendous amount of force to twist the locking nut, so the mild pressure of a washer shouldn't be able to do it.

Yeah the PVC is standard stuff. The reason the metal (electrical coduit pipe) is good is that you can then run the track elevated, because it's strong enough to support the weight of the dolly,tripod and camera (but probably not a cameraman). A good trick i read about was using sandbags to prop the track up for quick set ups over really rough ground.

You can do the same with PVC if you fix to a wood base (2x2 or 2x4). Drill a -just big enough for the screw to fit through- hole on top of the PVC pipe, and screw the pipe down every couple of feet. You then have the PVC track mounted on a rigid wood base for quicker set-ups on rough terrain. This would also work over elevated areas.

Oh BTW, I also read somewhere it's a really good idea to screw in a hook or two into the dolly platform. Then run a bugee cord up and around your tripod and back to the dolly to prevent any tipping (yikes!).

That's not a bad idea, about the hook.

I have a sandbag I can use to secure the tripod.


I forgot to mention, the only problem with the design I used (again, Matt Cherry's design) is that the push will only come off if you unbolt part of it--you can just unscrew it. My solution was to have one of the flanges be unboltable (I mean, technically they both are, but one of 'em should always stay on) then the whole thing swings out, and you can start diassembling. I could've just made a T-bar, but I didn't.

Ok, I keep lying when I say "the only problem. . ."


So, here's some more--

The way the pushbar is assembled, it tends to unscrew (only up to a point of of course) if you put pressure on one side. Any way to fix this? Remember, I need to be able to disassemble it for transport.

Also, the pipe is just to big, the dolly keeps rolling itself off the PVC. So what's the proper diameter for the inline wheels? I'm assuming the wheels are supposed to be as close together as they can without having friction impede them from spinning.

Hmmmm.

I don't have a push bar handle yet, but was leaning toward a T-handle. I shot some footage yesterday and I can see where the dolly works more smoothly with weight on the platform but I was just walking beside it.

If the handle parts thread together, there may be an opportunity to drill a hole and put a cotter pin through. Or you can use the old standby, gaffers (duct) tape and cover the join between the 2 parts. I doubt that they would be able to unscrew with the tape over them.

If the pipe's too big, I'd ditch it. I used two washers between the two wheels and it's about perfect to span the 3/4" PVC. The 3/4" PVC is like $4 for a 10' length x 2. I suppose you could spread the wheels as long as your bolt (axle) is long enough.

Yes! I had just thought of that last night. . .spreading the wheels along the axel 'til they fit. I'm using 3" bolts as the axels, so we'll see if it works.


What would be the advantage of a smaller pipe diameter vs. longer axel/greater distance between the wheels? If I have to buy new stuff, which should it be? Why? Only thing I can think of off hand is that a greater distance between wheels could make the dolly effectively wider, which would be a problem in some places.

Alright, well, spacing the wheels out aint' the answer; the axel flops around if the wheels aren't close enough together. I suppose I could lock it in place with more lock nuts, but it seems smaller pipe may just be easier.

I experienced all these problems when I built my dolly too. It works very well now, but looking back on the effort I think I should have just rented...

Best of luck to you.

Eh, renting.


Then it's not YOURS. You don't OWN it. It's all about material possessions--owning them and having them at your disposal whenever you want, even if you don't use them often.

So what if you don't own it? What matters to me is total cost. I estimated that renting would have been cheaper, after factoring the time, materials, labor, etc.

Owning makes sense with name-brand equipment that can later be sold. Who can you sell your home-made dolly to?

I was being silly.

I would actually be less motivated to spend money on something I only get for a day or two (especially on one of my self-funded no-budget projects--what I expect to be using this dolly on), and then it's someone else's again, then to spend more and build it myself. Within reason, of course. Let's say I spend $200 on materials, and it costs $50 a day to rent something like this. I'd rather have my own, in that kinda case.

Emre,

Me, if I had a rental shop down the street who only charged me $20 to rent one for a day, I'd rent. Now, I'd buy or rent a crane, but the cheapest I could find a dolly for was close to $500.00 by the time I had it shipped.

I found Dan Selakovich's book to be worth the $40 for the comprehensive instructions for the dolly. I don't expect to make much else out of there, but it was worth it just for the good dolly plans.

I feel like owning gives you a kind of freedom. What if you want to experiment? What if you want to screw around one day? If every time I wanted to do something like that, as opposed to a real shoot, I had to think about renting, I'd do a lot less. Having the stuff right there gives you that freedom to take it out and play with it at a whim.

I feel like owning gives you a kind of freedom. What if you want to experiment? What if you want to screw around one day? If every time I wanted to do something like that, as opposed to a real shoot, I had to think about renting, I'd do a lot less. Having the stuff right there gives you that freedom to take it out and play with it at a whim.

Absolutely agree.

But now I want a crane...

Someone had a video of their homebuilt crane. It was all wood. It was posted on here, somewhere.


So the 3/4" pipe seems the right size. If the track is relatively parallel, the dolly stays on it. Of course, now you have the issue of very very bendy PVC pipe, being that thin. I guess I could always get copper/metal pipe, though then your track is at least $40 instead of $8. And I know about using boards under the pvc, as well.


I liked the idea about the cotter pin, the only thing is that the flanges have a very little "lip" through which the pin could go. . .maybe 1/4" inch that sticks up. Could that be worked around?

The tape idea isn't bad, but the thing has to be removable, so that's kind of a pain. Seems the pin idea is better, if I can make it happen.

The thing I was thinking about with the handle coming apart...

Can you just secure the handle all together, and make it lift out of the platform in one piece, or does it have to unscrew piece by piece?

Well, the problem is that the pipes thread into the elbows, and also into the flanges. According to Matt, this a little more secure. So you can't lift anything out without unthreading it first.


A guy at work had a good idea, to put a third pole between the two on the pushbar, which would keep the ends from pivoting. I'd leave one flange attached to the dolly, and put the rest of the pushbar together when needed. A little bit of a pain, but you'd only have to do it when transporting it in a small vehicle. That would work.

Ok, so what does it mean when the wheels are all squeaky? Is the rubber too soft?

I would suspect the bearings or the way you mounted the wheels. Are the bearings new? Are the wheels carefully mounted?

I'm sorry, I should have been more specific.

It's not a metal-y squeak, it's more rubbery. It's something to do with the surface of the wheels.

Josh,

I think it means if you don't fix it, you're going to f-up your audio.

Seriously, it may be time for that oiling you were wanting to do before. just be careful what you use though.

Seems funny though. I'm no expert, but I don't think it should be squeaking. I mean even if you have a lot of weight on it... you've got 12 wheels under it.

How are those 1/4" axles holding up?

It's actually 24 wheels, 12 pairs of two, 6 pairs on each side.


As I said, it's not a metal squeak, it's something about the interaction between the rubber on the wheels, and the PVC.

Are the wheels too tightly bolted? Too close together (meaning that they hug the PVC really tight)? With the wider pipe that I had before (I've been testing it with 3/4" now), the wheels rode on top, as opposed to kind of gripping/hugging the pipe.

I feel if I loosen the nuts too much, the wheels will wobble (they did before), unless I get like ten washers or something for spacing on each axel.

There's no squeak when I tried the dolly on some boards for track, rather than the PVC.

The axels are holding up fine.

Perhaps your wheels are too hard? Try putting more/less weight on the dolly, and lubricating the track.

I think if anything, they're too soft. They're 82A.

I can try lubing. What would you recommend?

I think if anything, they're too soft. They're 82A.

They squeak when there's nothing on the dolly, as well as when I stand on it.

I can try lubing. What would you recommend?

There's some pricier dry type lubricants (teflon or silicon) that won't attract dirt grit. Maybe call one of the big automotive parts suppliers and tell them you've got rubber on PVC and you don't want it to squeak. Those dudes are usually pretty sharp.

I'm at a loss, dudes.

I got a silicon lube, still squeaking.

I've noticed there seems to be an issue with slight misalignments, meaning that it's difficult for all the wheels to be touching the PVC pipe at the same time, which causes several problems. I guess the slotted angle iron isn't perfectly straight, or something.

I tried loosening the wheels (more space on the axel between them), tightening them as much as I could, while still allowing them to roll.

The dolly squeaks when I'm on it, and squeaks when there's nothing on it at all.

They just keep squealing away.

I really hope they're not too soft, 'cause I don't want to spend another buttload on another, harder set of wheels.

I have alignment problems too, but my error is tolerable (so there is no sound). Do not buy harder wheels!

I can't offer much help because I used the V-shaped design, where the wheels are perpendicular to one another.

I would call it more of an "L" than a "v". I'm not sure how much good that would do. The problem is pretty minor---- If angle between the two parts of the metal is supposed to be 90 degrees, than mine might be 87. I tried taking some of the washers out that space the wheels apart, so I'll see if that helps.

Josh,

What if you put a lot of weight (sandbags, etc.) do they still squeak?

I stood on it and moved it, and it squeaked. I'm about 150 lbs. I think the squeaking didn't start 'til I spaced the wheels out more (with washers), so I'll try it again with some of the washers removed.

I stood on it and moved it, and it squeaked. I'm about 150 lbs. I think the squeaking didn't start 'til I spaced the wheels out more (with washers), so I'll try it again with some of the washers removed.

want it, then put another identical nut on and tighten it Hard on top of the first, it will lock it REAL well, and cheap, easy to find, just more of the same.

does the dolly squeak when you put it on tile or concrete and move it with weight on it? If not, I would reco RAIN/x from an automotive store or walmart, put on the pipe, let dry polish off. you also might try rigid cpvc pipe (hot water pipe), might be dif noise, might self lube, some materials do.

with three contact points on each side you will NEVER (i don't think) get all to rest on the track at one time with the weight evenly distributed. try taking the middle ones off. with the L shape like Safire's you are almost always getting permenent contact. think about it.

I'm a little lost.


Here's what my wheels look like:

I'm a little lost.


Here's what my wheels look like:

just kidding. forget the two nuts on the end of the bolt, your bolts are not long enough, rain/x is a superslipery lubricant that goes on your windshield to slide rain off (it is really something to see, no need for wipers over 5mph) I thought it might be cheap (relatively), dry, and not pick up dirt to use to lube the tubes(if it is wheel against tube squeak (known as 'WATS' in the biz).

if it don't squeak under load on concrete (directly on the concrete, no tubes), its not the bearings. most bearing today are sealed lifelong bearings and don't need/use lube anyway.

for three sets of wheels to contact equally _____O____O____O____ the line of the pipe must be absolutly leavel, the ground (any ground or floor) will rarely be, take the middle ones out, then it can't push up in the middle and change the bearing of the front or rear ones. (think, josh, think---dammit jim, I'm a doctor, not a plasma mechanic!)

I actually did take the middle set off.

Let me try the it with the washers taken off (the pipe's at a friend's house, so I won't be able to try for a few days), see if that helps.

No, it doesn't squeak on other surfaces, just the pipe.

Hey Josh, I think I know why your wheels squeak - you have both wheels on the same axle, trying to straddle the pipe - when you put weight on the dolly, the wheels are trying to spread apart and ride further down on the pipe. As the wheels rotate, they're "scrubbing" along either side of the pipe, giving the same effect as if you SLID your rubber-soled shoe along the floor instead of ROLLING it.

That design can't work without developing noise - I don't remember where, but I saw another home-built design that puts the wheels in two separate rows, angled so that one set of wheels is at 90 degrees from the OTHER set of wheels, and on separate axles (the bolts you're using) - that way, each set of wheels rides CENTERED on the pipe but NOT in line with each other; instead, the two rows of wheels for each pipe would be at 90 degrees to each other.

I don't have a site to post pix to, or I'd do a sketch to clarify.

I also can't think of any store-bought hardware that could accomplish what I'm talking about without some welding (I do a bit of everything, so this is common for me)

Mainly, I think you're wasting your time trying to get your wheels to stop squeaking as it's built right now - they need to contact the pipe perpendicular to a line that passes through the center of the pipe so they won't "scrub" along their sidewalls.

If I come up with a practical solution I'll find a way to post it somewhere for you... Steve

I got the design from Matt Cherry a (former?) member of this site. He seemed very happy with his results, and never mentioned noise. I don't understand why it worked for him and not for me.

I guess I could always go with the skateboard wheel configuration, though I don't feel like spending the money right now.

Yeah Josh, you have too much wheel surface scruffing against the pipe. The way to do it, as Steve suggested, is to use angle iron mounted with the V pointing down. When you attach the wheel axles to each side of the V, they will angle so that the outer tip of the wheels contact the pipe on each side.

You can buy the angle iron that has the holes already in it. Also, buy a 5/16 bolt and see if it will fit through the bearings. You want as little slop as possible on your wheels.

As for the push bar, keep the screw in flanges mounted to the dolly base. Take two short sections of pipe and screw one into each flange. Make your push handle out of a pipe one size smaller such that when you assemble it into a U-shape, each end will insert into the pipe stubs sticking up. Drill a hole completely through on each side and use a hitch pin to secure. A hitch pin is the type used to connect trailers or implements behind a riding lawn mower and they will be available at HD.

For tear down, remove hitch pins, dis-assemble u-shaped handle, then unscrew each mounting stub from pipe flange. Should take all of a couple minutes to set-up, tear down.

-gb-

I guess I could still use the same wheels, and just mount them at 45 degree angles, instead of buying skate wheels. That wouldn't be too ridiculous, cost wise. I still don't get why the same design I used worked for someone else. I've also heard of other people using inline wheels the way I did, instead of the 45-degree design.

The design does work Josh, I took a pic from Dan Selakoviches book to show you. Sorry Dan, I know it's copyright infringement but this is a dolly emergency.

It looks like you took that pic that you posted from Matt Cherry's original?

I can't figure out why you're squeaking, but the design works.

The other pic is of the dolly I built based on Dan's EXACT instructions. The angle bracket is heavy duty, he even lists the manufacturer (Simpson - Strong Tie). Dan's design only has 4 sets of wheels. He actually calls for a thinner 'jam' nut between the wheels to use as a spacer. I couldn't find one, so I used 2 washers.

BTW,

For anyone else who is thinking of building a dolly and hasn't yet, I HIGHLY recommend spending the $40.00 for Dan's book, even if it's just for the dolly plans. He walks you through, step by step.

I have been thinking about building a crane though. He has plans for it in there as well.

Well, that is a little different from the way I did it.

Yes, that pic I posted of the closeup of the wheels is from Matt's dolly, not mine.

Let me try it again, with the wheels closer together. As I said, I don't remember it squeaking 'til I moved 'em further apart with the extra washer on each wheel, but maybe that's just wishful thinking.

If it's still a problem, I believe a 3 foot piece of the slotted angle iron is about $5, so 10 more dollars and I can try the angled wheel design, using all the same parts I have on it now.

What durometer wheel does Dan's dolly use? My wheels are 82A. I wonder if the angled design might not work if the wheels are too soft.