Which would be the better soft box solution?

Lowel Rifa-Lite 66 Tungsten Light Kit
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/285879-REG/Lowel_LC_96LBZ_Rifa_lite_66_1_Light.html

or Build this Combo:
Arri 650
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=WishList.jsp&A=details&Q=&sku=72020&is=REG
Soft box
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=WishList.jsp&A=details&Q=&sku=257337&is=REG
Speed Ring
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=WishList.jsp&A=details&Q=&sku=13668&is=REG

Any and all options welcome. Maybe some of you have used both and have a preference.

Any and all options welcome. Maybe some of you have used both and have a preference.

I've used both, and while I like the rifa light, (it's very easy to setup/teardown/store) it's not as flexible as getting an Arri. With the Rifa, you are only going to get soft light. With the Arri, you can use it with the Chimera, or bounce it off a bounce board, or use it as a hard light. Far more flexible! My other suggestion would be looking at getting a Mole Richardson Baby 1k. You can put either a 1k, 750, or, I believe, a 500 watt lamp. I say that because there are times when I really NEED a 1k softlight, and then there's times I only need 500 watts.

just my two cents,

Matthew

The Lowell Rifa is very portable and sets up in a snap compared to the Arri 650 + Softbox, but you can't really go wrong with either one. I ended up replacing my Rifas with 2x Arri 650s and some frame panels (http://www.photoflex.com/Photoflex_Products/index.html?phase=search&page=0&new_metakey=794). For me, it's a more flexible kit. YMMV.

My other suggestion would be looking at getting a Mole Richardson Baby 1k. You can put either a 1k, 750, or, I believe, a 500 watt lamp. I say that because there are times when I really NEED a 1k softlight, and then there's times I only need 500 watts.

This with a softbox?
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/167457-REG/Mole_Richardson_407_Baby_1000W_Fresnel_Light.html

Fresnels and the standard Chimera is not your ideal combination. The softbox is too shallow and even when the light is at its widest setting it will give you a hot spot.
If you have to use Fresnels Chimera makes the Daylight Junior. This is a deeper (and more expensive) softbox. http://www.chimeralighting.com/products/dspproduct.cfm?productid=3
Also keep in mind that the outputs of Fresnels lights are considerably lower than the equivalent of open face light of the same wattage, if you must use fresnels get at least a 1K. Open face lights are the best sources for softboxes.

I own several Chimeras and Rifas, they both have their own distinctive advantages.

Lowel Rifa has been my favorite for years, particularly when I travel. It’s basically the same size as a Chimera but the light is built in so its one less thing that I have to carry. Being a bare bulb in the center of the light it gives an even light. It's much faster to set-up and also much lighter and easier to fly-it on a boom.

Lowe just released their new generation Rifa EXchange light. It’s the standard design on the outside but it has interchangeable light sources that include the standard tungsten or daylight fluorescent bulbs.
http://www.lowel.com/download/Rifa_exBrochure4-07v3.pdf
I’ve seen the light at NAB this year and it was quite impressive. When using the fluorescent bulbs it’s excellent with the front diffusion screen or without it.

The only disadvantage that I have encountered with a Rifas is that it’s dedicated to its own light sources. I often use HMI lights with softboxes and in that case I have to go back to my Chimeras.

If you are looking for higher output then you can't beat a 1K open face light with a Small Chimera box.

Seems the Rifa is the way to go so far.

Oliver,

Not really. You're getting GREAT perspectives from a variety of users.

The key is that every shooter has different needs and different working styles.

If you're like Gino with a thriving professional practice and you'll be facing a variety of shooting locations, styles, and significant TRAVEL, you'll have need for both of these options - and many more.

If you're starting out you need to focus on the kind of shooting that you're MOST LIKELY to do and be paid for in the first few years. Having a "travel ready" light kit is excellent. Unless you don't TRAVEL in the next few years!!! And then you've probably selected lights based on the wrong criteria - and the same money could have bought you something that would work much better for what you really need to do.

If I was planning on shooting locally - and wasn't sure what kind of work I'd be doing - I'd value flexibility and ruggedness over portability.

Conversely, if I signed a client with stores in 10 states, I'd make nearly ALL my buying decisions based on what travels well.

The very REASON that there are all these lighting choices (and way more!) is that there is no single light that does everything well. Period.

A perfect example is Gino's explanation of the 650-fresnel/standard softbox limitation. The Chimara small with a Tota or other open face light is a SUPERB soft box (even better with a fabric grid!). But that same Tota - while superb for filling a softbox and/or blasting ceiling reflected light into a medium room for a quick wide shot is nearly useless for a dozen other common tasks. The fresnel that is WONDERFUL for throwing a nice quality light a long distance while remaining very "barn door" controllable - doesn't fill a standard soft box as well as an open face. The "deep" softboxes that do work well with fresnel's are typically front heavy, need beefier stands and tilt-o-laters - and are not nearly as light efficient - so that 650 won't give you near as much light at a given distance.

Tradeoffs, tradeoffs, tradeoffs. Again, that's why you have LOTS of choices, and the experienced gaffer understands not just a single light's strengths and weaknesses, but the strengths and weaknesses of many combinations.

You MUST match the lights you buy with what you need to do. Further, you should buy the lights FIRST that you need to use most often.

And that will ALWAYS start with what kind of shooting you expect to do the most. My advice is buy for that - rent the rest until you know more about what you'll be PAID to do in the future.

Good luck.

Thanks everyone for all the great info, gives me a lot to consider.

I basically want a well made, softbox kit that can be used in many beginner DV situations. I will most likely will NOT be travailing.

Currently I have an Arri 650 for a hard light, and an Arri 150 for hair / back light, both with avenger stands (A630B 10'8", and A625B 7' 10").

Bill, taking this into consideration what softbox kit would you buy to add soft light to my existing lights? (does not have to be the Rifa or the Arri 650 w/ soft box! =))

If you have to use Fresnels Chimera makes the Daylight Junior. This is a deeper (and more expensive) softbox.
Also keep in mind that the outputs of Fresnels lights are considerably lower than the equivalent of open face light of the same wattage, if you must use fresnels get at least a 1K. Open face lights are the best sources for softboxes.

Nino, your talking about something like this?

Arri Arrilite 1000 Watt Focusing Flood Light
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/71448-REG/Arri_571100_Arrilite_1000W_Focus_Flood.html
Chimera Daylight Junior Plus Softbox
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/124789-REG/Chimera_8215_Extra_Small_Daylight_Junior.html
Avenger A630B
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/113317-REG/Avenger_A630B_A630B_Black_Light_Stand.html

p.s. why do you say "If you have to use Fresnels" , "If you must use fresnels"
I get the feeling you don't like them. =)

Fresnels are not the first/best choice for souce light in a softbox - hence the phrase 'if you must' - at least that's my take on it.

Since you already have an ari 650 and an ari 150, then sure, why not get a Rifa? That way you'll have it fairly well covered to start. You get also find a DP light (1000w) and throw a soft box on the front of it. Giving you a different option.

But it sounds like you need a soft box solution to round out your kit. Go for the Rifa.

But it sounds like you need a soft box solution to round out your kit. Go for the Rifa.

Thanks Richard, I will prob do that.

I'm also getting a Reflector kit with my order. What do you think of this?

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=WishList.jsp&A=details&Q=&sku=241060&is=REG


Thanks again for everyones help on this, this forum is super helpful.

...I'm also getting a Reflector kit with my order. What do you think of this?

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=WishList.jsp&A=details&Q=&sku=241060&is=REG...
I go super light in a suitcase kit with 2 Rifa 55... but I always have a 5-way reflector with me, and it probably gets used more than the 2nd Rifa.

If you're shooting outside, a sand or water bag or two can be a handy accessory, the reflector catches a lot of wind, it doesn't take much to blow it over.

I am extremely budget limited, and I am curious if anyone here has at some
point attempted making soft boxes. I have a Lowel DP light that I would like to
make one for. It occured to me that the 'glass fabric' used for the diffuser is
probably nothing other than common fiberglass cloth available at marine outfitters. That would only leave me finding a source for the silver reflective material of the box itself. I live in Seattle, and it would not be hard to find a source for the 'bones' of the box, since wands like that are used in the construction of back packing tents, and we have lots of those type of raw material stores here. So if I could find a source for the material which is black
on one side, silver reflective on the other, I could actually make a go at it.

Would be interested in hearing your comments about this.

Cheers,

Jerrold

Jerrold, I didn't fully read these but they might help you get started.

http://www.studiolighting.net/foam-core-homemade-softbox/

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1306/is_n6_v58/ai_12377687

http://www.deviantart.com/view/13594995/

http://thehowzone.com/how/Photo-Softbox/2

i own both set-ups and both are great lights. the arri with a lens is more flexible. i probably like the "look" of the rifa a little better, and it is probably a little brighter. one the other hand, the arri is definitely a more "professional use" light. they are extremely well built, and designed to last for many years. the lowels are a little more prone to wear and tear.

one thing to think about. the arri is a heavier, chunkier light. the lowel folds very compact and light. i find myself using my arris more as "case lights" that live in a box and i carry the box around. the rifas, i can throw in a backpack with a stand and a cable and carry around all day. due to the small form and weight, they are a perfect carry-on light for travel.

Thanks everyone for all the great info, gives me a lot to consider.

I basically want a well made, softbox kit that can be used in many beginner DV situations. I will most likely will NOT be travailing.

Currently I have an Arri 650 for a hard light, and an Arri 150 for hair / back light, both with avenger stands (A630B 10'8", and A625B 7' 10").

Bill, taking this into consideration what softbox kit would you buy to add soft light to my existing lights? (does not have to be the Rifa or the Arri 650 w/ soft box! =))


Oliver.

Price these out.

The Rifa - self contained, lightweight, easy to use, and relatively inexpensive. Not particularly robust. I'd expect it's service life to be 3-10 years in the hands of someone careful. 1-2 years in a rental house.(Which is why they don't typically use them!) Your mileage may vary widely! You're trading flexibility (the Rifa only does ONE thing, but does it well) for convenience. Nothing wrong with that. Screw up any part of it (lamp excluded) and you need to replace ALL of it.

You already have the Arri 650. It's service life is essentially unlimited since with even decent care, it should still be in service 25 years from now. Photoflex makes a series of longer softboxes that fill better with a fresnel. That would be a cheap flexible softlight combo working with what you already have. Screw up a part of the system and you just replace that part - not the whole thing. Downside? If you're using the 650 as a softbox filler, it's not available to do something else.

Buy a Tota light, a Chimera small or medium, and a 40 degree fabric grid. It's lightweight, travels well, relatively inexpensive, and would be the softbox equivelent of your Arri in that you should expect that with minimal care - it to still be working in 25 years. Same repairability as the Arri system.

So the question is how serious are you about video? How long do you need your equipment to last? Do you want to buy stuff ONCE and use them forever or to buy "starter gear" now and move up in a few years?

That's your decision. Each solution is defensible. Each will produce soft ligthing for interviews. Each has accessories available to help you do better lighting.

Make your choice, pay the bill.

Good luck.

Buy a Tota light, a Chimera small or medium, and a 40 degree fabric grid. It's lightweight, travels well, relatively inexpensive, and would be the softbox equivelent of your Arri in that you should expect that with minimal care - it to still be working in 25 years. Same repairability as the Arri system.

Could you post some B&H links to these items?

Thanks for the info Bill.

I just setup the Tota-Chimera combo. Nino is right. It's a great softbox. Very high quality. I feel it will take wear an tear.

You can get these Tota's cheap on eBay:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/32267-REG/Lowel_T1_10_Tota_Light_Tungsten_Light_120_240V.html

I went with this speed ring but there are others. The main thing is that this ring puts the weight of the Chimera on the stand and not the light. That means you can pull the Tota out of the softbox without changing anything.
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/124821-REG/Chimera_9510_Speed_Ring_for_Video.html

This is the Chimera:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/257336-REG/Chimera_8114_Video_Pro_Plus_1.html

As for reflectors, I'm a fan of the Photoflex frame system. The round ones are flimsy and get caught in the wind and can be hard to control handheld. THe frame system gives you alot of coverage. I use it in the studio and in the field.

I'm torn between these two soft box combos.

If you guys HAD to choose, which combo would you pick? 1 or 2.



Combo 1:
Arri 650 Watt Plus Fresnel
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/72020-REG/Arri_531600_650W_Fresnel_120_240V_AC_.html

Photoflex CineDome Softbox, Silver Interior - Medium - 24x32"
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=cart&A=details&Q=&sku=197002&is=REG

Photoflex Speed Ring
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=cart&A=details&Q=&sku=214774&is=REG




Combo 2:
Lowel Tota-Light (It uses bulbs from 750 to 300 watts )
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/32267-REG/Lowel_T1_10_Tota_Light_Tungsten_Light_120_240V.html

Chimera Video Pro Plus 1 Softbox X-Small - 16x22"
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/257336-REG/Chimera_8114_Video_Pro_Plus_1.html

Chimera Speed Ring
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/124821-REG/Chimera_9510_Speed_Ring_for_Video.html

I'm torn between these two soft box combos....
Combo 1:
Arri 650 Watt Plus Fresnel...

Combo 2:
Lowel Tota-Light (It uses bulbs from 750 to 300 watts )...
I think the question is do you want another fresnel for out-of-the-box lighting?

The Arri 650 is a nice fresnel, and can do nice focus/defocus, doesn't splash all over the place, useful for all kinds of things besides softbox work.

The Lowel Tota is amazingly small for the watts delivered, but, once it's out of the softbox it is a bare-bulb fixture, suitable for use as a hard broad, or, to reflect off ceiling or foamcor, etc. In all circumstances it is pretty hard to control when it is out of the soft box, but, there are uses for a broad.

so combo 2 for Seth

so combo 2 for Seth

Um.. no... I'd only go for combo 2 if the Tota never comes out of the soft box, or, if I had a specific application for a bare-bulb broad.

But I don't - I have a Tota and it rarely gets used.

I'm a huge fan of the Rifa and have 2 Rifa 55, but, I travel a lot for interviews and therefore sacrifice durability so that I can get quick setup and light weight for air travel.

I happen to like the Arri 650 a lot, it's a fine fresnel and a very versatile instrument.

We're no longer talking about the quality of the soft light, but about the other reasons that you would buy a fresnel or broad. Your mileage definitely varies on this!

Can I offer a bit of advice born of YEARS in this business?

Either package will do fine. Really.

However, in my experience, what WILL cause problems along the way is the kind of indecisiveness that this thread is starting to reflect.

Seriously.

One of the MOST valuable skills that someone going into the video industry can posess is the ability to judge alternatives and make the best decision they can - and then live with it - "perfect" or not.

Look at it this way. Two beginners are looking for a basic softbox kit.

Shooter A picks quickly on "decision day one", (but picks a solution that's somewhat less than perfect!) She spends a month learning the capabilities and noticing the limitations of that particular light - but STILL gets out there and gets a month of practical experience at lighting and shooting interviews.

Shooter B takes the same month researching the subject to death - and ends up not making the purchase until day 31.

Score at the end? One shooter with 30 days practical experience and one with NONE.

Which shooter would you hire?

I know the desire to choose perfectly every time is tempting. But you won't. No one does. Resist the trap.

The formula for success is often less about perfection then it is about momentum.

Keep moving FORWARD. Make the choice. Move on to the next one.

FWIW.

The formula for success is often less about perfection than it is about momentum.
FWIW.

That's not bad.. in fact it's pretty good.. I think I'll steal that!