Gene, there is NO replacement camera for the Z1 due out in the next 12 months or more.
Contrary to popular beliefs on this forum, the FX1 has NOT been discontinued either. I live, not only in Japan, but in the heart of Sony territory. Here in Kumamoto are 2 very large Sony factories mainly turning out Bravia TVs. My dealer has regular meetings with Sony technical staff and even plays golf with some of them. I met some of them at the weekend and asked about the rumours around the FX1. There is no truth in any of them..... At least not here in Japan. I guess that even the USA cameras are made here - so they should know. See my reply near the end of the "FX1 out of stock at B&H" (maybe on page 5). I am of the opinion that the "out-of stock" is directly connected to the american love of dollars! The FX1 is not selling well, so why should a store keep it in stock? Better to remove it and sell a mover instead. Just tell the customer that it is discontinued and no longer produced and you can more easily push another brand ! |
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Dollars and profits! Why carry a product that is not selling? Instead of saying "We can get it for you in 2 weeks...." say, "It has been discontinued...why don't you take a look at this XXX camera. We have it in stock now. It is a better deal. etc.etc." My home town of Kumamoto is in the heart of Sony territory. There are 2 very large factories churning out Bravia TVs here...as well as many other products. My local Sony dealer has regular neetings with the Sony technical staff here....and even plays golf with a few of them. I tend to believe the Japanese here at the centre of things rather than someone over in the USA who is trying to make a profit by selling equipment of many brands ....... (I have nothing against making money....but......) |
I'll check on that Mic next time I'm at Toys-R-Us Fred. Thanks :)
Douglas, thanks for the input. I guess that's all I needed to hear. I just didn't want to buy another one when it's public knowledge that there might be a replacement coming out soon. Cheers |
I have a friend in film school back east who gets to test all of the new Sony models against each other (most recently being A1 vs. FX1 vs. Z1). He has given me a lot of advice, and knows an incredible amount about their DV and HD camcorder lines. This is because he has a friend who works on the prosumer-side at Sony in New Jersey (not sure what office or his exact title). I posed the FX1 query to him to see if he could get any info. He emailed his friend and this is the response that came back:
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<i>The FX1 is not selling well, so why should a store keep it in stock? Better to remove it and sell a mover instead. </i>
Curious, where does this information come from? |
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I must say, with much respect to Douglas and Boyd, that i do find the statement that the FX1 is not selling well really quite surprising.
-it's always been a good seller AFAIK and it just doesn't seem to tally well with the fact that B&H have had the FX1 on back-order for quite some time now. Back-order implies either a demand for the machine in excess of normal expected unit-sale levels, or some manufacturing or shipping-from-Japan problem. Just seems to conflict a bit to me. - just my viewpoint. - interesting situ anyway ! |
The report of the FX1 "not selling well" is actually from me -- or rather from a phone salesman at EVS I spoke with on the phone yesterday. See this thread: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=65575
Personally, I don't buy it, but no other credible explanation has been provided for the FX1 disappearing from the shelves of reputable camera stores. Sorry to hijack your thread, just wanted to provide the source of "that" discussion in case anyone would like to join. As for me, I'm now looking for a Z1, considering most of the stores still selling the FX1 are doing so between $3300 and $3700. Ouch. |
And if the life expectancy of the Z1 can be equated to the PD150/170, then it has another 3 years in production ahead of it.
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Shane,
I'm afraid your friend was misinformed on the Apple issue. Apple didn't relist the FX1 at the SRV of $2,999, they completely removed the camera, along with other Sony video cameras from their site and claimed they ran out of stock. The camera still remains absent from the apple store page to this day. And as for the FX1 reaching "end-of-life" cycle, I was informed a couple of months ago via Sony that the camera is no longer in production. Perhaps I spoke with the wrong person, or maybe Sony changed their mind, but recent revelations would indicate that it has in fact ceased production and the reported limited quantities would only reinforce this claim. |
I took the quotation about the FX1 not selling well from this post.
"FX1 out of stock at B & H"... thread number 75 by Shane Coburn. He states that......... I spoke with Ryan at EVS this morning (EVS is also out of stock), and he said that he didn't know anything about the FX1 being discontinued. He said the reason they don't list it on their site, and have stopped carrying it, is because it wasn't selling. He went on to say that they even had a couple of returns on the camera from people who didn't like it; As he has spoken to a person in the sales dept. of a reseller in the USA - I thought that it was reasonable to quote from his statement. Please direct any questions about the truth in this to "Ryan at EVS"...... Sorry I confused you all by not making it clearer from the start where I had found the information. |
ooops.... I was a bit slow in replying....seems like while I was waking up others have already replied as to the source of the "not selling well" rumour.
I know that both cameras are very active and selling well over here. The Japanese police have installed a lot of the FX1 and Z1 cameras in their patrol cars. They like the clarity of the licence number plates on the footage. makes it easy to identify the cars. |
FX1/Z1 discontinues - a new angle!
In the midst of all the rumours let me throw in a new approach to the question that covers most Japanese products.
In Japan most people speak Japanese. Their spoken English is very limited. I quite often get information in broken English that I find hard to believe....when my Japanese wife puts the question to the person again and he/she answers in Japanese the facts come out different. The information I get here is in Japanese and is interpreted by my wife - who is an English teacher. I tend to believe this information, rather than information from a native english speaker who has been informed by a less than perfect english speaking Japanese. This "language barrier" and all its possible misunderstandings is probably the root of many of the rumours that circulate concerning japanese products. I also know that company representatives over here in Japan will avoid giving all the facts if they think it is bad for their company...... but they won't lie if you ask them a direct question. An example I have from last year: I had been invited by Sony (via my dealer) on a tour of their factory in Kumamoto and see the new Bravia production line. I asked one of the staff, "So the Bravia TV is made completely here in Kumamoto?" He said, "NO! We have many components from Samsung in the TVs. We have a very good co-operation with the Samsung Comapny in Korea" The bottom line is when asking questions and getting answers and 2 or more languages are involved - be careful of conclusions. |
EVS had had a couple of returns of the FX1 because 'people didn't like it?' What sort of people are these? Do they order one not knowing anything about the camera other than the price and they like the pretty thumbnail picture they've seen? Are they surprised at its size? Did they think the FX1 was a television perhaps? Did they buy a Canon Optura while they waited for the postman?
Do stores have to refund on things like this - and what happens to the returns? Do hapless, genuine customers get a pre-fondled unit passed off as new? tom. |
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When I asked him why the FX1 wasn't selling, he said that it was because it didn't generate timecode, did not have XLR inputs, and could not shoot in PAL. He said that "professionals" demanded a real camera with these options. Now, I'm not a full-time video professional, but I've been making money shooting things with a GL1 and VX2000 for a couple of years now, and neither of these cameras shoot PAL or have XLRs. Furthermore, one can always get an XLR attachment for the FX1. I can see the timecode argument, but I don't personally demand it in a camera, and I know there are plenty of other people that don't either. Now before I go on, I'd just like to say that what follows is my opinion. Please don't reference me like I know what the hell I am talking about... Based on what has been shared on this board, and the other outside information I have gathered, I would perceive that Sony is indeed inclined to discontinue the FX1 and try to distance it more from the Z1. If the majority of semi-professionals are quick to buy and recommend the FX1 over the Z1, and the Z1, being a professional camera, needs to stay in the line for three years or so, than Sony is certainly losing money in the professional HD category -- and will continue to do so. If their "pro" customers aren't buying their pro camera, and are instead opting for a model priced $1500 less, than they need to do some reshuffling. In this way, I don't expect to see an improved version ala FX2, but rather, a) a camera with less features and a lower price-point, or b) nothing between the A1 and Z1. |
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What would be wrong if Sony updates the FX1? I hope they do.
I hope to get a new camera this summer and I'd like to see some updates on what we can probably call the first wave of HDV cameras. Z1, FX1, whatever that JVC was, HVX, etc. The are all good, but I'm sure you can all say, I wish it had this or it did this or didn't do that. Someone even posted on another board that Panasonic is coming out with a 16:9 DVX non HD. Lot's of talk but something will come out sooner or later. If a camera is not selling they will improve it, repackage it. |
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However, if we follow the rationale you've outlined in your last sentence wrt to a poor selling item and the necessity to improve it and repackage it, then we might as well conclude that if a product is selling well, they'd cripple it, repackage it, and/or probably remove it from the roster entirely. Not too bold of a claim considering it's what they did with the HC1 to the HC3 and appear to be doing with the FX1. Also, when observing Sony's behavior in the digital camera market, they've reportedly made no plans to provide a successor to the prosumer R1 and instead focus on the DSLR segment which they recently acquired via the Minolta fold and subsequent release of the Alpha100 and a plethora of rebadged lenses. |
Guys, this thread has strayed pretty far from reality and is filled with speculation, wishful thinking and conflicting third party accounts from dealers and "friends at Sony."
This is all fine, but it really belongs in our "area 51" forum, so that's where you'll now find it :-) There was also a lot of overlap between the "FX1 out of stock" and "Buy Z1 now?" threads, with people posting the same responses to both. Therefore I've merged everything together here so the discussion will be easier to follow. |
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I got this e-mail on June 19th:
Thank you for your inquiry for this item: Sony - SOHDRFX1K - HDR-FX1 HDV Camcorder with Canopus Edius Package We would like to inform you that this item is now available from bhphotovideo.com. But it is already out of stock again. |
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I saw a FX1 at a Apple store once. It was awesome video. You should like it.
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Sony's just frustrated that they're wrong putting interlaced HD chips in their cameras and they don't want to admit it. Sony needs to suck it up and start doing progressive, the right way. They're going kaikaze with the interlaced chip, holding onto it until the very bitter end to shield their pride. For me it doesn't matter if they discontinue the FX1; unless the new model has 1080p, sales will suffer.
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FX1 price at B&H gone up about another $100 last day or two.
now $3,299 for FX1 (NTSC). PAL model on B&H gone up 500dollars (yes) since about 4 weeks ago. Was $2,999, and now priced on B&H at $3,499. |
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