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Rob deJong October 24th, 2009 01:19 AM

how can you shoot with fixed LCD?
 
Hello,
I am thinking of buying a HDSLR for the full HD video capability. I was looking at the GH1, because all canon's lack the flexible lcd. I have been shooting with camcorders (vixia series) and cannot live without the lcd. Never use viewfinder. I was very disappointed that canon again comes in the 7d with a fixed lcd. In the announcements I read that it has a good viewing angle and contrast, but I doubt that it will be enough for me. I film insects in bright day-light and usually low to the ground. Are some of you filming under the same conditions with the 7d or with the 5d mark 2? What is the actual viewing angle by which you can still judge the sharpness of the picture? Or is there another method, such as a small external lcd that I can easily plug into the 7d?
Thanks,
Rob

Chris Medico October 24th, 2009 06:50 AM

The 7D has HDMI out that can be used with an external monitor.

It also has composite out and thats what I use when I put it on the Steadicam Pilot.

Rob deJong October 24th, 2009 09:03 AM

Thanks for the respons.
Is there something simple (and small) on the market that is easily plugged in the HDSLR, fixed on it and maybe even fed by it?

If it is something big or complex, i go for a PAN GH1 or maybe even NIKON.

Bill Pryor October 24th, 2009 09:26 AM

Most everyone uses a magnified viewer, like the Zacuto Z-finder, or one from Cavision or IDCPhotography. http://www.zacuto.com/z-finder-dslr-viewfinder or http://www.cavision.com/viewfinders/MHE52-5DBGSET.htm or http://www.idcphotography.com/kart/i...=129&parent=31
It is very difficult to shoot hand held or in bright sun without one of these.

Rob deJong October 24th, 2009 10:11 AM

But these are straigtforward. It is not possible to view into it from above with let's say an angle of 45 degrees. Does something like that exists? Anyway I have been shooting in bright daylight with the lcd on the hv20 for years! For me only the angle counts.

Steev Dinkins October 24th, 2009 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob deJong (Post 1437262)
Is there something simple (and small) on the market that is easily plugged in the HDSLR, fixed on it and maybe even fed by it?

If it is something big or complex, i go for a PAN GH1 or maybe even NIKON.

I haven't seen any monitors small enough. I have a Marshall monitor if I really need to get specific with the 5D/7D...

Marshall Electronics - V-LCD70P-HDMI
http://www.lcdracks.com/monitors/V-LCD70P-HDMI_big.jpg

But it's rather large and needs battery power.

I also have the GH1, and I'll tell you right now, it's the best thing out there right now with a large sensor with articulating display (for the price).

I couldn't decide between the 5D and GH1, so I got both, and the 7D on the way as well. Different tools for different needs.

Ger Griffin October 24th, 2009 08:27 PM

i find the lcd to be ok in daylight. having to be on the same level all the time is annoying.

i was thinking (not very seriously) about a set of video glasses. If there was such a thing as an eyepiece for one eye it would be sweet!
http://www.allvideoglasses.com/video-glasses-reviews

David Chapman October 24th, 2009 08:27 PM

Hey Steev,

I was looking at that Marshall monitor, but I'm curious to see exactly what you see on it connected to the 7D.

Could you post a photo of the live view in action on the Marshall monitor?

Charles Dasher October 24th, 2009 11:28 PM

I am also curios about the Marshall on an articulating arm. Originally I was going to get the Ikan 5.6 but then I saw the Marshall with Peaking and other functions and thought this would be a better purchase. Wish I could get a smaller screen with HDMI and peaking.

Bruce Foreman October 24th, 2009 11:39 PM

Rob,

One of the things I would consider is "rigging" a small mirror you could look down at. Maybe a piece of aluminum sheet bent at a 45 degree angle with a hole for 1/4x20 short bolt with knurled thumb knob to secure it to the bottom of the camera and a mirror glued to the "bent upwards" part.

Rob deJong October 25th, 2009 05:00 AM

Has somebody used these items:

lcd viewfinder canon, Photography items at low prices on eBay.co.uk

With the Viewfinder LCD protector I will have a mirrored image. i suppose you can get used to that.
With the LCD Angle-changing Viewfinder from LinkDelight I am not sure about the angle.

Rob

Steev Dinkins October 25th, 2009 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob deJong (Post 1437540)
With the Viewfinder LCD protector I will have a mirrored image. i suppose you can get used to that.

I'm also curious as to whether their using optical grade mirrors. If not, you'll see ghosting and focusing will be near impossible. However, it might be acceptable for snagging some still shots with auto-focus.

I'd like to hear if anyone has tried one. As for flipped image, that would drive me crazy. This all brings me to a few thoughts. If we're that serious about a video shoot, bringing along an external monitor should be standard. If just trying to run and gun it, I'd bring the GH1. I'll be testing mixing footage from the two cameras sometime this week.

I'll also be testing the Marshall monitor with the 7D this week as well.

Rob deJong October 25th, 2009 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ger Griffin (Post 1437444)
i find the lcd to be ok in daylight. having to be on the same level all the time is annoying.

i was thinking (not very seriously) about a set of video glasses. If there was such a thing as an eyepiece for one eye it would be sweet!
Video Glasses Reviews | Video Eyewear

Why would you need an eyepiece for 1 eye? The glasses will work on 2 eyes. I just wonder if the resolutions of the glass AND of the video output of the camera will match.

Ger Griffin October 25th, 2009 09:00 AM

Back in the good old days when there was no LCDs the best approach was to keep both eyes open. The inside eye was looking through the viewfinder and the outside eye was kept open also. After matching the diopter the outside eye would match up with the angle of coverage of the eye looking through VF. This served as a way of getting an extended view of whats actually happening outside the frame. Useful for both creativity (in terms of planning ahead when shooting live) and safety.

A set of videoglasses as they are could work very well too though. Even if it was just a regular cheap set of SD glasses with a composite video-in. I would love to be able to try it out without outlaying the expense. The other offputting factor is how one would look going around with this kit. Candid shooting would be gone out the window anyway!

Ger Griffin October 25th, 2009 09:19 AM

That link delight angle changer looks interesting Rob, cheap an cheerful.
i'd nearly always need the lcd pointing straight up as these days i usually shoot with the camera below my head level.

LCD Angle-changing Viewfinder For Canon 450D 500D A1F on eBay (end time 27-Oct-09 09:40:31 GMT)

Bill Pryor October 25th, 2009 09:22 AM

If you want to do low angle shots and not get down on the ground, a small LCD monitor is the only practical answer, I think. They're lightweight, and you can get a swivel hotshoe mount to tilt it up. Another few hundred dollars.

Rob deJong October 25th, 2009 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ger Griffin (Post 1437577)
The other offputting factor is how one would look going around with this kit. Candid shooting would be gone out the window anyway!

I am between animals with my camera!

Rob deJong October 25th, 2009 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Pryor (Post 1437587)
If you want to do low angle shots and not get down on the ground, a small LCD monitor is the only practical answer, I think. They're lightweight, and you can get a swivel hotshoe mount to tilt it up. Another few hundred dollars.

The cheapest I see are the marshall's. Those aren't a few hundred pounds but thousand and I find them to big. Need something small: 3 or maximum 4 inches. What types are you referring to saying a few hundred dollars?

Did anybody on this forum ever connected a pair of video glasses to any HDSLR?

And Steev, do you really have the 5D, 7D AND GH1? Amazing. I am very interested in some comparisons.

Bill Pryor October 25th, 2009 06:05 PM

http://varizoom.com/products/monitors/vztft7.html
Not HD but good enough for composing and focusing.

David Chapman October 25th, 2009 07:15 PM

Just an observation from reading, but wouldn't you benefit more from a 4:3 monitor since the output is 4:3 on the 7D/5DM2? Unless I'm missing something, you can't take off the overlays. A widescreen monitor would still leave black sides and your actual "widescreen" footage would be cropped in. Of course, I don't have a monitor yet, but this photo makes me think I'm right:

http://blog.vincentlaforet.com/wp-co...s/img_0771.jpg

Rob deJong October 25th, 2009 11:54 PM

LCD Viewfinder Set with Plate for Canon 5D Mark II with Battery Grip

Bill, you were suggesting this thing. It says that it features horizontal, vertical and forwards/backwards adjustment, but what does it mean exactly. Can I change the angle?

Bill Pryor October 26th, 2009 07:37 AM

No, none of the LCD viewers will change the angle. The only solution is a separate monitor.

Steev Dinkins October 26th, 2009 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Pryor (Post 1437943)
No, none of the LCD viewers will change the angle. The only solution is a separate monitor.

Amen - all these LCD angle hacks are to be used in frustration and disappointment. Ya really gotta use a separate monitor, or using a conventional camcorder, or the GH1 is what I'd recommend. Furthermore, I'd warn against getting cheap LCD external monitors - their resolution really sucks. If it's not HD capable, with component or HDMI, don't buy it.

Next year, hopefully, all this will be some moot points with the next generation of pro camcorders with larger chips. "But what about Scarlet?" That'll need an external monitor too!

Bill Pryor October 26th, 2009 10:13 AM

Just for framing a low angle shot, I don't think an HD monitor is critical. I just ran across this. Don't know if it would work, but looks very handy. It's different from the viewfinder LCDs in that it appears to take a video out rather than anything from the viewfinder.

Amazon.com: Aputure Gigtube Live view LCD Viewfinder for Canon EOS 450D, 1000D, 500D, Digital Rebel Xs, Xsi, T1i; GT1C: Camera & Photo

Kin Lau October 26th, 2009 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Pryor (Post 1437745)

Along the same lines, has anyone tried the 5" or 7" GPS units with video in? The video in is designed for backup cameras on trucks/SUV's, but the size of the unit w/ a built-in battery would make it interesting.

Steev Dinkins October 26th, 2009 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Pryor (Post 1438010)
Just for framing a low angle shot, I don't think an HD monitor is critical. I just ran across this. Don't know if it would work, but looks very handy. It's different from the viewfinder LCDs in that it appears to take a video out rather than anything from the viewfinder.

Amazon.com: Aputure Gigtube Live view LCD Viewfinder for Canon EOS 450D, 1000D, 500D, Digital Rebel Xs, Xsi, T1i; GT1C: Camera & Photo

Aha! Well, I'm skeptical about the resolution, but I'll try it out.

*Purchased*

Ger Griffin October 26th, 2009 12:52 PM

Would be very interested in your after-purchase thoughts Steve.

Khoi Pham October 26th, 2009 01:12 PM

I want to get one of these, but don't want to be the first one. (-:
80" 3D Virtual Video Glasses with VGA Connection (Connect to any PC, MAC, Laptop Zetronix

Rob deJong November 1st, 2009 02:44 AM

The gigtube live view looks very interesting. I am happy if I can focus with it. Thats the most important. Thanks for the tip.
The videoglasses are nice too, but IŽld like to here some experiences from somebody using it with a camera.

Steev Dinkins November 3rd, 2009 09:12 PM

I got the Gigtube, and created a new thread for it.

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/1442442-post1.html


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