Well, that's pretty much what I wanted to say. If the OP needs to achieve a certain look that cannot be achieved with an EX camera, he can go for a T2 and some special lenses to achieve that look. How many times will that be? He is the only one to know what his needs are.

Re DOF, normally I would NOT shoot with any lens opened to it's max aperture, especially if it's a 1,4 or 1,8, unless I have no choice (not enough light, so must open wide), or I really want to get softer image and shallow DOF. The focusing becomes then a real issue. One should better take his time to focus properly and check twice.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but to my knowledge, the Red 1 has a chip that is smaller than the 35mm film frame, so optically they cannot produce the same results with the same lens.

Artistry matters, of course, there's no point arguing that.

I'm currently fighting a dilemma myself about going for a DSLR or a consumer grade videocam for my next project. I need lightweight and small but if that weren't the case, I would go with an EX with no hesitation.

Cheers.
Senad

Yellow. Lots of yellow.

Yellow? Add iron to your actors' diets...

I would think that it's worse under fluorescent lights than daylight. Have you tried WB Shift? You could add a touch of blue to the standard WB.

Also, do you find that the yellow tint is a problem after grading?

Personally, I find that skin can get plastic looking if its exposed on the high side. I hear that the new firmware has less noise reduction, so maybe that will help. Magic Lantern has a 0xb000 zebra setting for skin tones (69%), but that's a bit hot for my tastes. I have a new Marshal monitor, and I have heard that the skin setting for false colors is at 55%. That's a bit cold.

Where is baby bear's porridge when you need it? ;)

A while back i wrote a post about canceling a shoot because of rain - after doing some research, but most of all talking to pros at my local pro photography mall - my fears have subsided completely!

Two weeks ago i was shooting under a threatening sky, which in turn became a torrential, side ways down pour, with nothing but a shower cap over the lens' glass to keep the rain off. i completed the scripted scenes in about an hour and a half. LIFESAVER!

That shoot paid for the camera(ok, it was already paid for but you get the idea). Rain jackets are fine, used them with my Sony in the past...but a torrential downpour is something that i would have avoided like the plague with a regular camera, where one drop of water, or even the humidity can cause grave problems. I love the fact that the 7D is weather resistant (not "proof" mind you).

So like me if you are shooting in an erratic climate, the 7D might save the day. If not, then yes, the T2i is proving to be an equal for vids.

What I'm seeing in the skin tones is certainly aggravated by (even slight) overexposure for sure, and it tends to happen with those who have pinker skin tones. It is indeed a plastic look to the point of a loss of detail. Even at equivalent exposures, those with olive or darker complexions seem to reproduce better. In fact, I've found that these cameras seem to reproduce African-American skin tones better than many other cameras I've used.

One of the "feelings" that I have is that when I have used the WB shift feature particularly by adding magenta (to offset a green cast in the lighting, i.e. from fluorescent), the skin tones really go out of whack. Mathematically this should work out and it would with most cameras, but the Canons seem to have problems in this area. I plan to shoot some tests with steadily increasing levels of green and magenta coupled with countering adjustments within camera and see what happens.

Well this is very interesting, i shoot in Asia (China), the skin tones vary widely, from white as rice to red farmers neck skin tones...

Haven't seen anything jump out at me...yet...as I bang on wood. Got a shoot tomorrow morn, and my talent definitely has a yellow-olive skin tone already... I got stills and a few minutes of test footage of her on location, but i can't upload to dvinfo (China again).

Charles, i wish i could understand or have the experience with cameras the way you do and you're the proiest pro here so let us know your results when you have time:)

I agree Charles, if you overexpose even just a little the shot becomes unusable. But if you get it right the shot can look natural. The trick I find is to keep control of the highlights - particularly in the red channel. If you blow the red channel you'll always have terrible looking skin.

These frame grabs are from some run and gun interviews I did the other day, all had a basic preset WB. All look fairly poor up close (too much yellow), but should scrub up fine with a little color correction.

Good points about the red channel, Liam.

I just posted a link to a series of corporate videos that I worked on with Vincent Laforet:

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/show-you...ml#post1504742

I was quite pleased with the skin tone rendition on this one: YouTube - USAA 2009 Report to Members: Anthony E. Hargrove
But disappointed on these:
YouTube - USAA 2009 Report to Members: Expanded Eligibility
YouTube - USAA 2009 Report to Members: Employees

Both the lady in the first one and the security guard in the second had quite pink complexions and they often reproduced poorly. The lady in particular was quite pale and it appeared that due to miscalibrated monitors we overexposed her slightly, but the results were different than I would expect from most cameras--as Liam indicated, any amount of exposure in red highlights is a disaster.

I'm now using an HP Dreamcolor monitor on set to ensure the WYSIWYG factor for these types of shoots.

do you guys know where i can find the tripod camera back plate for this tripod? i lost the one that came with it...screws on to the camera, and clips and locks in...

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/240474-REG/Canon_6195A003_Deluxe_Tripod_200_Quick.html

Great work Charles, I see your point about the skin tones, but I think the filmmaking skills more than make up it.

I believe HDSLR rigs have come a long, long way. Just take a look at the test that Zacuto released today, the great camera shootout. Philip Bloom, Robert Primes ASC, and a number of other top end cinematographers took the time to actually compare the 5D MKII, 7D, 1D MKIV, and others to the gold standard of quality in the industry - 35mm film stock. The results? Well, you'll just have to watch the first episode yourself.

The Great Camera Shootout 2010 | Zacuto

The first episode is all about latitude. Scenes are designed to really push the cameras across the range of exposure to see where they can hold detail and where they begin to lose out. As expected the HDSLRs handle low light exceptionally well. But, check it out. Like I said, just the fact that there are proven and skilled cinematographers out there who are stunned at the quality of footage that is capable by the 5D MKII and 7D shows that they're rapidly closing the gap on 35mm film.

I tried watching that, but gave up after several minutes because it was so unbelievably self-indulgent.

I think they're allowed a bit of self-indulgence for what they were able to put together here. If it bugs you so much just skip the first ten minutes.

The tests are excellent, it's unbeliveable that these dirt cheap cameras are even being compared to film and that they are holding their own in many cases! Pretty exciting stuff.

Hey Bryan, I just did that, skipped down to the tests. The first few minutes did put me off though and were totally unnecessary. I'm sure Steve Weisz is a top guy and I have no axe to grind with Zacuto - I think they make excellent products - but all that stuff on the front simply undermined the whole video.

Agreed, Liam. I started watching and was waiting and waiting for something to happen, finally decided I had to let the whole program load and come back when I could skip to the actual tests.

On a larger note, I'm utterly fascinated by what passes as "tests" these days. Sure, old-school camera tests were a little on the dry side, but I'm not clear on why it's become the norm to insist on packaging footage like music videos with the obligatory "a film by" credit. Films are films, camera tests are camera tests...

Amen, guys. I waded through it all last night. Interesting, for sure, but they really get caught up in their own "pomp and circumstance". Ridiculous.

My biggest question: why wasn't there a RED in there? Just rent a frickin' one. And maybe an EX3. And one of the P2 cams.

And skip all the Western motif, chest-pounding, roll-the-credits crap.

Man, you guys are rough. It was clear they were just trying to have a good time and I applaud them for putting some fun into it.

(This complimentary post in no way is because they are giving away a piece of gear each Friday if you post a response to their videos on their site.)

Hey, a little cheese goes good with dinner! I enjoyed some of the theatrics, but the dialogue before the comparison's got a little tedious.

Of all the issues, I found the close seating of the two speakers in the brick room very awkward.

ok it is not unbiased, never ever. Too much talk, and why the got no Red, dead simple Red does not want to be compared to small chease boxes. The zacute movie gives about 7 minutes good information, film is not dead, the 5 and 7 are close, the Nicon has too much compression the 1 maybe a bit more detail,(gray scale, but who cares about it really) and the lumix is not a toy, why does it TAKE 35 MINUTES AND WHY the vine yard poem, who knows it is zacuto.....

I agree Liam! (not that viewing on youtube is greatest). There have been quite a few "look at the problems in this footage" posts floating around the forums, and many times the problem is so trivial that...well... maybe we have become too picky.

Charles, the story and execution sell it. I wouldn't worry about it, i doubt that outside the circle of creatives, no one will notice.

...the only problem is i wish, i could take my own advice.

Bryan,

If you are looking at these cameras from a video point of view, I can see where you would think this. But lets not lose sight of the fact that these cameras do replace film in the still world!

If they could make a version that uses the entire sensor area for video then I think the comparison would be even more of a moot point.

With still sensors resolving so much detail these days, I think the available and affordable still lenses would hold up pretty well in a film environment. If one of these hybrid cameras gets made the whole cost-image quality perspective will be turned upside down even more.

I am pretty sure somebody will make this camera, but what will they charge for it? Obviously, the sensors are developed way beyond the resolution needs for video or film. Can you adapt a 21 megapixel sensor to a lower resolution cheaply? Maybe use a previous model's sensor like the 5DMKI? Are they going to put a premium on it since RED already costs $17,500 for the body?

With the install base of still lenses, this convergence seems inevitable. Just who will do it properly?

I do investigate all this since years, first... a higher resolution why?
second as high the resolution goes the frames per second are going down.
I money is no issue go for Arri and if u have a contract for the killer movie go for it.
Remember please fat32 4 gig limit, why do they not restart seamless as any videocam?
easy it would vandalise the videocam market in 9 months.

U got it, all this glasses, pulling focus, that is film, a good rig
and waoh u are there that puts videocam to the end.

guess Panasonic, Canon they do know this and just for the reason,
we have to push magic lantern to do the trick
a d7 d5 will behave as comfortable to use as a videocam....

That test compared D-SLRs to film. The RED One is neither film nor a D-SLR, therefore it wasn't part of the test.

I'm sure this question has already been asked, but i just want to be more sure 'cause i'm about to buy the 7D, so my question is, Can the 7D work with handheld filming?, i mean if you mount the camera in a DSLR cage or something like that, Will it work for handheld long shots?... ¿¿(and could it be possible to work for running handheld long shots)??...

Will it work for handheld long shots?... ¿¿(and could it be possible to work for running handheld long shots)??...

If you don't know what you're are doing I doubt it. Even a sea sickness pill won't help.
IS lenses help a little - a good steadicam will help a lot.

Check out the Deshaker plugin for Virtual Dub It's free). If you tune it correctly for your camera it can do wonders.

How good does the EOS 7D works with manual focus during shots??

Will the EOS T2i give me the exact same video quality??...

the 7d has great manual forcus, but its capabilities are mostly in the lense...a great lense with great AF and fast aperature, will give you great abilities....

the t2i is nowhere near as good as a 7d, if that were the case it wouldnt be 1000 dollars less....

however i believe other than the really wide angle of the 5dmark2 the 7d is better....i think 7d is the "all around performer"

hope this helps

You really think so?... but I've seen some footage comparison and isn't a big difference, shouldn't i go for the T2i and get 2 good lenses, instead of going for the 7D and only one lens?...my budget is low btw....

Corey...sorry but "good" is a very relative term when comparing those cameras. The image sensor is virtually the same and if you look at side by side tests, you'd be hard-pressed to tell the difference in footage.

What the 7D offers is a pro-level build quality which will handle the elements and rough treatment better. It also has much finer control over the parameters (bells and whistles) making it a true pro-level camera. It also uses compact flash which I think is considered more robust.
Another thing that makes the 7D so cool is the full HD out the HDMI port during record.

So that's what the extra $1K gets you, but the images you can obtain are darn near identical.

I'm exceedingly happy with the results I'm getting out of the T2i and that extra $1K went towards my lens collection.

i dont like to cut corners, but theres a few things other than what you mentioned....the 7d is an all around performer...and is rock solid...

no doubt and I'd love to have one. BUT image quality is virtually identical. If you're on a budget...no question the T2i will get the job done.

My buddy's 5D in well lit shots doesn't look all that different from the T2i BUT when there's any question of light...I bow to the 5D. The 7D and T2i just don't compete. (he borrows my lenses though! HaHa!)

the focussing has nothing to do with the body, all to do with the lens.. unfortunately even sometimes the top end expensive lenses are built with photographers in mind and whats important to them (super sharpness for example) isnt always high on the list for us (like a silky smooth focus ring)..

Just realised how EXTREMELY noisy my 17-55 2.8 is yesterday when editing an indoor scene where the IS was switched on, I was shooting dual sound but actually I liked the sound from the camera when the IS was off, would have been nice to have had the option to use it..

Manus, I think it's a fair question, particularly for those that don't have an HD monitor, since good manual focus is achieved with a good focussing screen. The focussing screen is on the BODY, not the LENS.

Unlike many pro cameras you can't change the focus screen on the 7D - one of the major drawbacks with this camera.

It is true that the shallow depth of field due to the larger sensor is a benefit to some, if not all. One can safely use the high ISOs. However, one of the reasons that is not often mentioned, is the relatively smaller size of the DSLRs like 7D. If you are filming in a small room, temple, cockpit etc, you may notice that fitting large video cameras into such places may be tough, if not outright impossible.

There are number of issues. For example, in a DLSR (I shoot with a 1D Mark IV), most often you are shooting in RAW. So I use the neutral picture style. While filming, if you are not going to do colour grading etc later, it is better to shift to a standard or other picture styles. There is option to start filming by the flick of a button. However, you need to press a couple of buttons to change the picture styles.

The other problem is the amount of money you need to invest. After spending 5k USD for a Mark IV, I realise for filming safely another 10K USD can be gobbled up by audio, fluid head and other accessories. A zacuto z finder is 400 USD plus i.e nearly 25% the cost of a 7D. Better to pick up good lenses, accessories etc that will last for a long time. It will take time for the technology to mature. However, this seems exciting and promising.

Most disadvantages of HD on DSLRs due to hybrid nature of cams
 

I've written up a new blog in which I am pondering about the fact that most real issues (aliasing, line-skipping) we have with video on DSLRs is purely because of the fact that they are hybrid cameras that should stills along with video.

HD video with DSLRs – The good, the bad and the ugly.Part 1: the bad & the ugly | Nino Film - Blog - Nino Leitner

Would love to get your thoughts on that!

I'll be writing up a follow-up on that shortly, dealing with the potential benefits this hybrid nature of the cameras could give us ...