I use the Minidisc option as a backup at shoots ie weddings where you do not want to lose that vital speech etc. I use a tie clip microphone attachment and the groom puts the minidisc in his inside pocket.

Recommended by the supplier of my XM2 2 weeks ago. Just make sure you get one that accepts the mic input.

In summary a well designed XLR adapter does NOT eliminate the noise cancelling benefit of balanced leads from the mic to the adapter. However, any wires onthe unbalanced side of the adapter are subject to noise pickup. For short leads this is not usually a problem. How short is short depends on the amount of electrical noise in the environment about you.

A simple XLR adapter that does not provide balanced-to-unbalanced conversion can eliminate the noise cancellig benefit. Concersion can be doen done with special audio transformers or with electronic circuits. The Canon MA-series uses electronic circuits.

Recording using Beachtek DXA-4p Dual XLR
 

I'll be videotaping a Christmass ball at a large hotel next month. The event is basically a short awards presentation from the podium and dinner and dancing. I purchased the Beachtek DXA-4p Dual XLR adaptor to help capture audio with my GL2. I'll be able to get a direct audio feed from the Sound people at the hotel. I'll be physically located next to the mixing board. Should I ask for a mike or line level if they are able to give me both? I've never used the adaptor so I'm not sure what settings to use. Also in the camera's audio menu is there a setting I should select to use with the Beachtek adaptor?
Thanks!

concert, music mixing.
 

Most Music boards will output line, but your beachtek will handle it and convert it to mic level for your camera. There is no fidelity difference between the two. MIC level is used for shorter distances and line for longer (generally) But I would warn of another issue that you might not be thinking of. Most sound engineers for concerts position themselves at the apex of the sound, somewhere within or behind the audience and adjust the levels of the various instruments accordingly. Your mix will reflect their ears and the mix you get will be short of some instruments and heavy on others. as an example, a flute will be heavily amplified, while a trombone will be slightly amplified.

In addition, the mix they give you might be a group output which is a auxilliary output and they might simply give you 'some' audio of each channel.

I've recorded concerts for television. I've found that High Quality microphones positioned at the location of the sound engineer, or somewhere within the audience will work best if you can't mix the audio yourself.

Good balanced XLR input accessory
 

Is there any good balanced XLR input accessory, preferably with phantom power but not necessarily, for the GL2? I was hoping for something that would send the audio straight through the camera digitally as opposed to going through the 1/8" unbalanced microphone jack.

I need something to record the output of a mixing board and I could buy a separate digital recorder but I already have two perfectly good ADCs in the GL2 that I would utilize. However, if the adapter costs just as much as a Korg or Roland recorder, then maybe it's not worth it.

See the Beachtek DXA-4p.

Thanks,
Is there a certain setting in the gl2's audio menu that needs to be selected such as the attenuator or does the beachtek run independently from the camera?

No GL2 setting requirements are necessary. The beachtek takes balanced XLR audio at mic level and passes it thru to the 1/8" stereo connector which simply plugs into your camera.

I set my camera in audio 'auto' and leave the pots on the beachtek fully UP. That lets the camera compress the audio.

If you get LINE level from someone, simply place the mic/line toggel switch on the beachtek to line and it will attenuate the audio to mic level.

If you get one channel, place the toggle to MONO and it will put the left channel on both on the feed to the camera.

Get a good set of headphones. I can't tell you the number of times when thought we had a good mix or audio only to be disappointed.

I use a set of earplug stereo headphones i found at radio shack. They have foam compressible pads you roll between your fingers and then place in your ears. They are like ear protection foam plugs. The block everything except that provide by your GL2s headphone output.

Great, but it outputs via a stereo mini. Doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose?

No, it doesn't defeat the purpose. The DXA essentially acts as the terminus of the signals from the XLR side. The cable from the DXA to the GL2 is also very short and not susceptible to noise. That aside, there would be no other way to get a sound signal into the camera (short of the hot shoe that the DM50 uses).

Search the "Now Hear This" forum for more info on the topic of XLR adapters. There are many threads and posts.

Ok thanks Ken. I think I'm just gonna get a hard disk recorder then. It doesn't seem worth it if it's gonna get converted to unbalanced line-level before entering the camera.

Just my .02, it's hard to beat a dedicated audio recorder. I just bought myself a GL2 and have been trying to justify buying the beachtek or some other similar adapter. I have a Roland 1680 and have been using it instead of the camera inputs for audio recording. Works great, and there is much more flexibility in it than any adaptor for a camera.

I would love to have a nice audio system sometime to mount onto my GL2, but at the same time, I think, why? Why should I rely on the audio circutry in the camera when I already have a good audio recorder? It's too easy to sync up in post and really isn't more involved in setting up than the camera.

Dragging one more case to the gig is worth the convenience of no wires tied to my camera, plus knowing my audio will sound good.

Whew! The 1680 is no longer available. Roland says the VS-1824CD is its replacement. With a list of $2000, about $1700 street, it's a big investment.

Will

Yes, it was quite an investment a few years ago, considering I spent about $2300 on it (yikes!) - But it has definitely paid for itself in the quality of audio and convenience. My buddy just picked up a Yamaha recorder similar to my Roland for about $1000.

I forget what the technique is called when you record the audio to a seperate recorder, but I do think it is the way to go.

Yes, I saw the Yamaha models when I went browsing to research your comments. The Yamaha AW16G is certainly close.

Why do you think the independent audio recording is better? You mention better quality, but assuming the same microphones were used and that the only difference is where the audio is recorded, it's a bit hard to grasp why two digital audio streams would be that different.

Will

Will: To answer that question, go find Jay Rose's feature article from DV mag/.com titled "DV Camera Audio: Real Numbers, Real Recommendations".

Edit: Here's the link to the article, although you'll need to login to DV.com first if you haven't.

http://www.dv.com/features/features_...questid=694010

The short of it: DV camera audio circuits really are pretty crappy, even compared to just a "consumer" level audio device like an MD recorder. From my perspective, I'd say it depends on what you're recording; I'm not going to futz with syncing (and often re-syncing 20 minutes down the tape, since they don't always stay exactly in sync) a separate audio source to video if the audio isn't as important (just someone's speech or atmospheric audio). If the audio quality really is important, a separate source is very reasonable.

Brian pretty much summed it up. I figure, a video camera is primarily composed to record video. The audio circuitry in most cameras leave much to be desired. My audio recorder was designed just for that, recording audio.

I agree, some shoots don't warrant a seperate recorder. But some critical shoots, like weddings, for example, the audio is obviously critical.

I have yet to do an A/B test between my Roland and my GL2, but my betting money would go toward the Roland (or any stand-alone audio recorder, for that matter).

Anyone use the Roland VS-880EX? I think I'm gonna get that with a Jaz drive. 20-bit 48 KHz recording, up to 8 tracks simultaneously - definitely the best features for the value.

You know, I read that article but had forgotten about it. Thanks for the reminder.

Will

Just bought a Roland VS-880EX off ebay for $350 - 6-tracks simultaenous balanced audio recording to any SCSI device. Way better than any XLR converter I could have gotten for the GL2. Too bad they don't make these things anymore - from the sound of it, it's going to be great (48 KHz, 20-bit, etc.)

<<<-- Originally posted by Brian Dickman : go find Jay Rose's feature article from DV mag -->>>

Thanks a lot for that link Brian, fascinating article that I hadn't stumbled across before!

Have fun with that 880 Peter. Those things rock. I wish they had more XLR inputs, but hey, I'm not complaining too much. My 1680 has been a great friend for the past several years... :)

Yeah can't wait. :) Unfortunately this model does not have XLR inputs, only balanced 1/4" ones, but adapters are not terribly expensive, and I don't think this should significantly affect sound quality, do you?

Yeah, you're right. But I guess they'd sound about the same as long as you use balanced cables, which do make a difference. Some adaptors can be found cheap, but may make your audio sound cheap as well, but ymmv.

Sorry that this has become a thread in audio engineering, but it's interesting. :)

My understanding is that all XLR cables are capable of carrying a balanced signal.

I also thought that a balanced 1/4"-connector cable is identical to an unbalanced stereo 1/4" cable.

Am I right or missing something?

Thanks a lot.

I think you're right, but I'm not certain. I know a balanced cable has the TRS (tip, ring, sleeve) and a stereo 1/4" connector, so I guess that would essentially be a stereo cable.

For some reason, I thought unbalanced XLR cables existed, but that could be incorrect.

XLR Adapter Solution...
 

Right now, I have a home made XLR adapter for my GL 2. It technically works just fine. However, it is a hassle. There are many chords involved and it is quite cumbersome while filming; especially for handheld shots.


Now, is it worth it to buy the Canon XLR adapter for around $170? Is there a cheaper adapter/solution?

Will the canon adapter make it a lot easier to film, meaning, will the number of and amount of wire be reduced drastically?


Thank you...

You should also consider the BeachTek DXA-4P XLR adapter. It's become a bit of a standard.

In addition to Beachtek, Studio One and Sign Video also offer similar adapters. Ads are in Videomaker, etc.

Each has its advantages and disadvantages,

I used the second wiring diagram on this web page to convert a spare XLR cable into an XLR->1/8" adaptor for my GL2. It works great with my Azden 1X.

The one drawback it has, though, is that the traditional XLR connector points back from the mic, making use of the top-handle buttons a bit of a challenge. If I get a chance, I'd probably re-do this cable with right-angle connectors for both the camera and mic ends.

Have fun.

We have an article about the MA-100 here on the site if you
are looking for some more information on it.

Which XLR adapter for GL2??
 

I am now in the market for an XLR adapter for my GL2.
I really like the look of the Canon MA-300, but it seems to get mixed reviews for some reason (what are those reasons?? I can't seem to find them)

Is a beachtek unit like the DXA-4P better than the MA-300?
I really like the idea of not having to run a cable to the microphone jack.

Any help is greatly appreciated, thanks.

beachtek
 

I own both. go with the beachtek for several reasons:

-accepts line level as well as mic level signals.
-routes single audio feed to both channels
-leaves the intelligent shoe available for VL3, as an example.
-perfectly balanced wieght distribution for tripod mounting.
-cables don't hang down from above, but rather from below
-has individual pots for signal control that are easier to adjust than those on the camera in a hurry.

however, if you are simply wanting to mount a mic to the camera the ma300 works fine.

be aware that i dock my camera often to a tripod.

I agree with Hank,
-the Beachtek is better, especially with it being underneath the camera.
External cables running into the top of any camera is not a good idea...
The only facility you lose from Canon's own connector is the BNC video socket, but I just use a short av cable with a RCA to BNC adapter at the end - no problemo.

Robin

Is anybody using the Beachtek DXA-6 or DXA-8 with the GL2?

How well does it fit on the camera?

The reason I ask is because I actually own a beachtek adapter, but it is for the sony TRV line and it functions fine with the GL2, but the tripod mounting is so far back that the whole adapter sits so far forward underneath the camera that I can't hardly adjust anything.

I was looking at the DXA-6 & 8 and they seem to have the mounting bolt in the same location as the Sony models, so I am assuming they don't fit the GL2 very good.

That is why Beach makes several models, each is fitted with a top plate that has shifted mounting holes to better fit other cams.

Also consider the SignVideo XLR Pro, it's what I opted to choose over the Beach as it offered 2 line in's and not just 1. The other advantage that I found with the Sign was keeping the XLR in's on the right and not the left. I typically only use 1 XLR input (my boom mic) and I"m able to socket that unit in the rear position making it possible for my hand to comfortably in the strap and the XLR is not obtrusive.

The need to have 2 XLR based sources in at the same time however forced me to order 2 XLR cables with Right Angle Male connectors which I found a custom shop (AVCABLE.Com - Jim Woodier) that custom built my cables for about 20 bucks each.

I've toyed with the idea of getting the MA300, I think that I even shopped them on Ebay for about 150 and still said, no thanks. I have more control with the XLR-Pro, the MA might be a sexier and cleaner install however the flexibility of the XLR beats that hands down.

Hope this helps a little...

XLR Adapter or Hot-Shoe Mic?
 

Which is recommended? Basically I need better quality audio, so I don't have to worry about poor audio transitions from on-board-mic static and such. Does Canon's hot-shoe mic do the trick, or does one have to purchase the XLR adapter to get high quality sound?

If the XLR adapter is recommended, what sort of microphone package would I need to take advantage of it?

I believe this belongs in the GL2 forum as opposed to the audio forum, because it's dealing with accessories specifically for the GL2, but if mods think I'd get a better response in that forum, feel free to move it.

XLR on the GL2
 

What do I need to use XLR mics on the GL2? Will the MA-100 work for this purpose?

Thanks.

For the GL2 you will need the MA-300, or one of the Beachtek adapters.

The MA-100 is for the XL1(s)

Yeah...I have an MA100 so I thought I could use that somehow.
My real question is... does the signal use any amplfication like the MA 100 provides or is it mic-input so that all I need is a simple XLR to mini adaptor?

Thanks. Obvioulsy I'm no sound recordist.