Canon GL-2 Camcorder Conversion

[Bob Williams]

Good afternoon all,

What a great forum and group of experts helping those of us who really need it. I am so pleased with every bit of input you all have provided. I am moved by how quickly and ably you all reach out to me and others who could not prevail other than your assistance. I am going to read every comment offered and move foward in my new quest. By the way, the church will want to stream vidio/audio to the web using Home - MyVideoTalk

My Video Talk is a medium that is similar to YouTube except it is purchased by the church and therefore has no commercials or other such problems. It will provide a means of our church providing all sermons to video on our church website. We pay monthly for this service which permits us to send video emails out to members and will permit us to develop a website using various banners, logos, etc. We are pleased to be able to have this service. I just have to figure out how to interconnect it all (smile) and I can do it with the information you all are providing here.

I feel free to post any additional questions I may have. For me, this is a process I must learn since I was quick to want to help our church and pastor. I just celebrated my 75th birthday but am one who does not belive "you can't teach an older person new stuff". (smile) Thanks so much again all.

bob williams

[Bob Williams]

To all who have replied to my request for help so far, is this a possibility? Can I purchase a DVD recorder and feed the output from either of the GL-2 camcorders to the DVD recorder to make a master. Then put the master DVD into a DVD duplicator to make final copies to give out to church members? What am I missing here? Is this process too simple to work?

In other words I don't want to use a computer now if I don't have to. If I can just run the signal directly from either of the 2 Canon GL-2 cameras to a DVD to make a master that would be ideal. We only use 2 cameras to make sure one of them has a good recording of the actual events that took place that day. These GL-2 cameras are totally independent of each other and any other apparatus. By the way, we must have 100 plus tapes of preachings waiting for (me?) to make sense of it all.

Finally, it looks like I will still require a computer to get the output from the camera onto the internet and church website. Thanks again all.

bob williams

[Chris Soucy]

75 eh? Hmm, this is going to be interesting.

OK, yep, the "direct to CD" thing will work, but..........it's going to be exceedingly clunky, as you still need to get that data onto a computer to complete the rest of the process.

Soo, you would be best off performing all computer related tasks on a reasonably grunty laptop, remembering that IT MUST have a Firewire port and a DVD writer.

Do specify plenty of memory, the biggest hard drive they can shoehorn into it AND make it a 7200 rpm drive to boot.

Once you have said laptop, download the free trial of Ulead VideoStudio and any other software that may be suggested, it's FREE for a limited time period with all of those products.

For day to day running I would just use one (1) camera tethered to the laptop and record the service direct to disk, no need to transcribe tapes etc (do run the second cam though in case you get a system crash or other problem on the tethered camera).

With products like Ulead you can pretty well go from close of service to producing a dvd in about 3 mouse clicks, as long as you don't need to do any editing.

Once you have your dvd you can do any file formatting required to work on your web site and to upload to MVT.

As for your back catalogue, well, guess you have 100 X x hours of batch ingesting to do (do put a couple of DV cleaning tapes on the shopping list!).

The question then becomes "what are you going to do with all that data after the event"?

If you wish to have it to hand in a usable form I would invest in a seperate external USB 3 or e - Sata (if the laptop has that interface) 1 TB hard drive and simply dump it off the laptop, you don't want it clogging up that precious main hard drive.

As you get more practised in the use of your chosen software you will find all sorts of amazing stuff it does that you didn't even imagine, and you'll start sprucing up the output accordingly.

Take your time, play and tinker, you'll suprise yourself.

Now I'll yield the floor for other suggestions.


CS

[Bob Williams]

Good evening Mr. Chris Soucy,

YEH! 75 and still very much active. The path you are leading me down sounds like something a little easier than I had imagined. What if I purchase a card for my desk top computer (I have no idea now what kind of card that would be) that can accept the signal from the Canon GL-2 directly. I also don't know, but I am sure this camera has an output that would go directly to the computer. What kind of computer card should I be looking for?

I would purchase a seperate 1 terabyte hard drive that would be mobile. I can take this to wherever I need to. However, it would be the primary holder of the files from the GL-2 camera. I would only need to put the conversion program on the computer. Do you know if the GL-2 is also a digital camera? That would certainly make it easier to do what I need to do. I think the hard drive should be "Fire Wire" Capable" or does that matter??

Once I get the output from the GL-2 into the computer as a digital file it should not be difficult to then get the files onto the church website. What do you think sir? Am I traveling along the right road or have I verred off along the way? Thanks much.

bob williams

[Chris Soucy]

OK, if you have a desktop system without a Firewire port, you would need either a PCI to firewire OR a PCI Express ditto, you'll need to pull the side off the case to check what slots are available and what type they are.

PCI Express slots are quite short. Google for a piccie.

If the system is more than about 10 feet from the camera I can't see any other way to get the data than taking the camera and shot tape to the system - it's too far to get the data as it's shot, which would have saved you the slow pain that tape ingestion is.

Keeping the files on an external is fine, preferably a 7200 rpm beast on a fast interface, USB 3 or e Sata if available, you can get PCI cards for either interface if you don't already have one available, just make sure you have spare slots on the mobo.

I honestly don't know if the GL 2 has a photo facility, someone here will though.

Nope, I think you've pretty well got it sorted, you just need to choose you particular video editing poison and away you go.


CS

[Les Wilson]

The GL2 is a digital camcorder but it stores that digital video on digital tapes. Modern camcorders store it on memory chips like SDHC, Compact Flash etc. The data that is stored consumes 12.6 gigabytes per hour. You can do the math and calculate how much space you need to hold all of those tapes (i.e. 100 tapes of one hour takes 1260 gigabytes which is 1.26 terabytes).

Even after you ingest the tapes onto the computer, it isn't ready for the web. The digital data from the GL-2 is roughly 28 megabits per second. For the web, you need to compress it to about 1.5 megabits per second.

Buy a used iMac for around $600. Think of it as you are buying a video editing appliance. This will save you time and headaches. Get any Intel based one at dvwarehouse.com. This is a great one:
iMac 2.6Ghz Intel Core 2 Duo 1GB 320GB DVDR/CDRW 20" - Pre Owned - $595.00

Add the $35 memory upgrade they offer for it. Then add iLife for $35 to your order:
Apple iLife '11 - MC623 - $34.95

Along with your external drive, you'll need a 4-pin to 6-pin Firewire cable to hook the GL-2 up to the iMac. Your external drive can use the other Firewire port on the iMac.

You can then ingest a batch of tapes directly to the iMac, produce them for the web and DVD then move (not copy) them to your external drive archive. Rinse and repeat this for 10 or so "teachings" at a time.

The iMovie program that's part of iLife will let you trim/edit your raw GL-2 ingested files and then export the version for the web (Share to Web) right from iMovie. While you are at it, iMovie also has a Share to iDVD which puts the video into the DVD mastering program that's also part of iLife ... push a button and about 30 minutes later, out pops a DVD.

I don't recommend uploading video to your website. Instead, create a free account on Vimeo and upload it there. Your webmaster will know how to embed it on your website.

Of course, if you can't suffer learning the computer trick you could create DVDs of the tapes, by just dubbing them from GL-2 camera to DVD recorder for each "teaching" and leave producing them to the web for someone else.

[Don Palomaki]

Bob,

You really need to address the questions in my last post to get a solution that is tailored to your requirements. Otherwise people will give suggestions that may go well beyond your needs and be more tailored to their own experience and uses and the apprach they woud take based on limited information.

The following is a simple, low budget approach that may meet your needs at a minimal level.

If the two GL-2 are recording the same thing and there is no need to "mix" them, just select the better recording to create the DVD. And if there is no need for any menus, captions, and other "fancy stuff" than playing the video tape to a DVD recorder can work well to make a DVD. The DVD can be copied on almost any reasonably current computer. It will take a bit over an hour to make a DVD of a 1 hour service, It will take less thatn 10 miinutes to make each additional copy on PC.

Many moderate cost Epson ink jet printers can print nice labels on the appropriated printable DVD and CD media. They come with label printing software too.

You can use almost any current computer with a DVD drive to "rip" the program marerial from the DVD you created for conversion and upload to your on-line service. I am not familiar with that service, but I am sure they can provide you with alternative workflows to convert and upload video that meets their format requirements. Software to do this ranges from free to modest cost (well under $100). The service might even provide a package to help you do this.

The DVDs (and tapes) can become your library/archive copies. There is no need to store it on a large computer hard drive if you do not plan to go back to edit the video later, or use the computer as a rapid access viewing system for past services. (A one hour DVD worth of files uses less than 4.5GB of space at the higher DVD resolution.)

Similarly, converting your past services is a matter of creating the DVDs as above. Using a DVD Rcorder is about as easy as using a VCR, but with an added step or two to make the recorded DVD usable on other systems (finalizing the disc).

The above is a minimalist apprach.

[Bob Williams]

Good Friday Morning Mr. Palomaki,

Thank you so much for this assistance. You are right on the money when you note that even though our church uses 2 Canon GL-2's, I would only be looking for the camera that has the best showing of our pastor during a preaching session. He is very timely and norally does not go over One Hour.

Since I can't anticipate furture use and needs of the church I am trying to look ahead as best I can. The assistance here from everyone has been wonderful. That is why I am looking at purchasing an RPM 7200 external high speed 1 or 2 terabyte hard drive with USB 2.0, Firewire 400, Firewire 800 interfaces. I assume I can use this hard drive with my PC (I don't have a Mac) and not only back up my own PC but can also store a number of videos for church services. I am also thinking that this hard drive with WireFire will enable me to transfer right from the Canon GL-2 directly to my PC. I can't say now if I will be asked to go back and retrieve certain Sunday or other special services.

I understand that I will still have to transfer from my hard drive to a DVD recorder and than to a DVD duplicator. However, I am hoping that will not be a difficult thing to do. I do hope I am on the right path with this thinking. If not I am hoping you all will stop me from going over the cliff (smile). Thanks again for taking the time to keep me moving in the right direction.

bob williams

[Don Palomaki]

Since I can't anticipate furture use and needs of the church I am trying to look ahead as best I can.

The best you can do to future proof is to have the data in a good, secure format that can be read at the time it is needed and well cataloged. Even today tape appears to serve that purpose well. The DVD serves for a time when finding a tape player may be difficult. The key here is both were distribution media.

Compuer storage media is more problematic. it is not easy to conenct a RLL or MFM drive from the 1990 to a computer today. And good luck finding a new PC with a floppy disk drive or for that matter a ZIP drive, Bernoull, or even a parallel port. IMHO used computers are, well, used computers, a product designed around a 5 year useful life. They may work when you get them, but often are unsupported (both hardware and software) and can be problematic for folks who do not have a technical bent.

My observation is that few people are interested in reediting old video. Even weddings,how many comback a year or more later for more tahtn just an additional copy of the final edited copy. About the only time that happens is if one of the participants gains some sort of notoriety (usually unwanted) and the media beast is seeking some salacious sound bites for the evening news.

Unless you organizationis well funded and prone to going to great administrative and records keeping lengths, the likely case for using the old material may be when the pastor retires or moves to a new calling someone wants to do a "10-Best Lessons" video as part of their farewell party or celebration of their life.

If you have the time, and a community college near by, maybe audio a course in video, read some basic how-to books (is there a Video for Dummies book?) and visit a library to read back issues of magazines like Videomaker (if you can find them).

Note that there are copyright ownership, rights, and control of use implications with content loaded to "free" sites. Be sure you and your organization are satisfied with what ever ownereship rights you surrender in exchange for the hosting of your video.

Also, some other churches in your general area may be doing what you want to do. Visit them to see what their experience is and how happy they are.

[Bob Williams]

Hello and good Friday Afternoon,

Here is my immediate concern all. I will also be responsible for getting the pastor's sermons onto the internet. Won't it be easier to do that if from a computer/hard drive with wirefire? I am just asking. Of course I am looking for a way to do this easy. I am looking for a way that will encompass making DVD's as well as going on the internet weekly with each Sunday service and any other special video shots the pastor might want. I hope what I've just said here is not too confusing. Finally, I can use the hard drive for my own purposes. But, my main purpose is to help my pastor and our church. Is it possible to put stuff on the church website other than using a computer with hard drive and wirefire?

bob williams

[Chris Soucy]

Hi, Bob..............

The reason I didn't like the standalone DVD writer option was because of the "getting it on the web" aspect - you'd simply be replacing one system with two, not exactly user friendly.

OK, lets go back to the software package I mentioned, it's no longer Ulead BTW, but Corel.

Link here: Superior Video Editing Software - Corel VideoStudio X5 Ultimate

Just in case it isn't obvious, I'm talking of Video Studio Pro X5 Ultimate, it's not the only system out there by any means, but it's the only one I know anything about.

So, once you have the data, this allows you to do pretty well anything you want - burn a DVD, format for the web, multi device, the whole box of dice at the click of a mouse.

Want to get fancy? It's got goodies everywhere if you can be bothered to learn how to use them.

The hardest part is sitting there watching it load tapes, one by one, for hour after hour, now that's a pain but has to be done no matter WHAT system you plump for..

Not much you can do for the back catalogue, but get the computer within 10 feet of the camera and future sessions can be loaded "live", meaning the tape is simply a backup, just in case.

As long as your system has a DVD writer, a Firewire port, whatever you're going to use as an external drive interface and a reasonable processor and memory, you're good to go for $50 worth of software.

Can't see see how you beat that.


CS

[Don Palomaki]

Is it possible to put stuff on the church website other than using a computer with hard drive and wirefire?

The easiest way to get video of the service to the internet for sharing is to have some 17 year old with a video capable smart phone do it for you.

The Firewire port (more properly IEEE 1394, also knows as iLink, and Canon calls it a DV port) is mainly used to move video from the camcorder to the computer at the highest quality level. There are other options available, such as using an analog video capture device, but that is beyond your requirement. IEEE 1394 has other uses/purposes as well, but they are less common, and use of of it is fading as new camcorders using tapeless formats dominate the market and USB use spreads..

Today's computers all have hard drives, or an equivalent storage device (e.g., a solid state drive/memory). Even smart phones (which happen to be a somewhat specialized computer with a 2-way radio connection to the phone system).

You need some form of computer to get stuff on the internet, or have a service do it for you.

Speaking as another who is past retirement age (and still active in Scouting): Seriously - check if there is a young person in the church that does this sort of stuff for fun, seek their help. Working with them can make you feel younger, and give them accomplishments of which they can be proud.

[Bob Williams]

Mr. Don Palomaki,

Good morning to you and yours sir. Thank you for this input. It is not often that people like yourself and others reach out to help those of us seeking information and guidance. Thank you so much.

bob williams

[Eric Olson]

Originally Posted by Bob Williams

Thank you for this input. It is not often that people like yourself and others reach out to help those of us seeking information and guidance.

Bob, it sounds like you have the technical stuff more or less under control. Among the options mentioned I favor buying a $12 firewire card and an $8 firewire cable and using whatever desktop computer you already have but never mind that. I wanted to mention an surprising legal aspect of this project: If you are the one who digitizes the tapes and uploads them to the internet, then you are the one legally responsible should any issues of copyright infringement arrise. This most often happens with music. Performance rights are different than recording and internet broadcast rights. Be especially careful with prerecorded music and video lectures. It is theoretically a big difference whether the music on the video is incidental or plays a central role, but realistically it is expensive to determine the difference in court either way. Good luck with your project. It sounds like you have at least a couple months of work with 100 tapes!

I had good luck with the following mail order company:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16815166033
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16812200731

[Bob Williams]

Mr. Eric Olson,

What a pleasure to hear from you and many others who know when a person needs the assistance of great people. I am learning so much about the computer I did not know. For instance, I just learned that the drivers (whatever they are) can become outdated? I've been using my computer since 2010 when I purchased it. I thought surely it would be good for another 3 years without me having to worry about retiring it. Actually, I just planned to increase the memory to it's maximum 16 Gbytes, I have 4 now. I am trying to get this done the least expensive way without sacrificing too much quality. If I can get videos that equal what's on YouTube my pastor and I will be happy.

I am now attempting to find out what's on the inside of my Asus desktop and the particular ports, bays and in/outputs it has. Thank you so much and I do appreciate.

bob williams