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-   -   Are they going to update the XHA1 (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/canon-xh-series-hdv-camcorders/103617-they-going-update-xha1.html)

Robert Bec September 15th, 2007 12:39 AM

Are they going to update the XHA1
 
hi guys

Since Sony released there XDCAM EX is Canon going to be bringing anything out new soon.

I just like to know before i make any purchases

Robert

Bill Pryor September 15th, 2007 12:23 PM

It's been out for only about 9 or 10 months.

Brandon Freeman September 15th, 2007 02:37 PM

Honestly, I don't know what Canon would do to update this unit. Unless they decided to go tapeless and use the space the tape deck would leave to incorporate a larger chip set (as the XDCAM EX).

All I know is, I'm very happy with my new XH-A1. The only update it REALLY needs is a solution to the Chromatic Aberration issue at wide angles, but that doesn't affect my films because I shoot telephoto more often than not (and then pull the camera way the heck back), and I haven't noticed any CA at telephoto thus far.

Really, just spend $3500 on an A1, $1500 on a good 35mm adapter (minus the cost for lenses, of course), and another $1200 on the Canon FireStore, and you've got a better system (IMO) for under $7k.

My two cents.

Mel Enriquez September 15th, 2007 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Bec (Post 744711)
hi guys

Since Sony released there XDCAM EX is Canon going to be bringing anything out new soon.

I just like to know before i make any purchases

Robert

Robert,

If Canon ever releases a replacement for the A1, I doubt if it will be in the same class. The XDCAM EX is 1/2" sized sensor. That would mean we are not talking anymore of the same price bracket.


Plus there are other things that need be addressed. Will Sony license the XDCAM format to Canon? Does Canon have another format in mind? Now, that alone is a big headache because you better have a way for NLEs to edit that, unless you can proxy into DV and have an intermediate software render it to your native format.

There are other things I am sure that will have to be considered. But another thing I see is the price. Once you hit 1/2" or some larger than 1/3" we may see a bump in price, and I'm sure it's not just U$500 over the current A1 price. However, if Canon somehow found a way to create 1/2" CMOS chip for a much lower cost and are willing to go on a price/performance war, well that can only be good news for us.

As far as it goes, any improvements on the A1 will be incremental. More of addressing the weakness of the A1. Things like a larger and higher rez LCD, or redoing the battery compartment, or other niggles that may be of concern for the current A1 design. Other than that, unless they use a new sensor with better low light capabilities that will be close to a 1/2" sensor, any updates will be irritation or niggle fixes.

I think if you need the A1 now, and you are aware of its weaknesses, you can buy it now and still be in the game even if they somehow snuck a new model in 6 months. Personally, it's really Sony that is ramping up models and modifying basic designs to hit all perceived segments in the market. That's where I would be looking at if I were to be surprised by any new models. After all, the FX1 and Z1 are 3 year old models. I would not be surprised if they came out with a substitute for these cameras in 3-6 months. They are really overdue.

Mats Frendahl September 15th, 2007 04:44 PM

Canon must do something to compete with the EX. Tape is not going to be around in 5 years. If nothing happens Canon users will jump to Sony when the EX hits the 4k price - which it will, by time.

The CA in the lense exist in all L-lenses (and with Nikon... etc... too). I don't think they will do something to make it better. Look at their other lenses (for SLRs) and you will see that even the best lenses have quite high CA.

Perhaps Fujinon makes better lenses, I don't know. There are some pro Canon lenses for video for some 20k or so. Don't know what you get. Prob. dead-on focus at any zoom-level etc. etc. Someday I might find out... Greg has a F355 I think - I'm sure he can tell what you get for the extra bucks.

Evan Donn September 15th, 2007 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mats Frendahl (Post 744899)
Canon must do something to compete with the EX. Tape is not going to be around in 5 years. If nothing happens Canon users will jump to Sony when the EX hits the 4k price - which it will, by time.

It doesn't even have to hit the 4k price for me - I've already decided to make the jump barring any unexpected shortcomings in the EX. I've only had my A1 for a year, and I think it's an incredible camera - but the opportunity to drop tape, go full raster with a higher bit rate and variable frame rate, plus step up to 1/2" progressive sensors without having to go up to a larger form factor is just to good to pass up. The way I look at it, taking into account the resale value of my A1 plus the tax write-off on the new camera, the upgrade will likely only really cost me $2-3k, maybe even less - depending on the street price of the EX.

Bill Edmunds September 15th, 2007 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brandon Freeman (Post 744870)
The only update it REALLY needs is a solution to the Chromatic Aberration issue at wide angles

What??? What's the issue? I shoot a lot of stuff at wide angle settings and am considering the A1... but this doesn't sound good.

Jay Legere September 16th, 2007 12:06 AM

"Tape is not going to be around in 5 years"

I disagree. Tape will be around for many generations. Whether or not fresh batches of prosumer cameras require tape is another story.

You will be able to ingest tape into your computer for years to come.

I work with high-end pro equipment every day and the tape we sift through to add to current daily news dates back over 30 years. Thankfully it looks thirty years old to convince viewers of its authenticity. This archived footage must be retrievable on thirty more years.

One shouldn't fear losing a competitive edge when choosing to purchase the A1 because of tape. In the end, using tape boils down to how much time you have to finish a project. News stations all around the world produce hours of TV every day...with tape. Unless most of these stations have an influx of riches, they won't change unless they have to.

Tapeless operations will take over at some point, but by that time the A1 will be as historic as 3/4" Umatic.

Mats Frendahl September 16th, 2007 04:11 AM

Evan. It will prob. drop some 1500 very quickly, but if it saves you time then 1500 is nothing. Time is money. When it is close to 5k or so I'm going to pick one up - unless Canon made a better one. I'll still keep my A1 as it is a good lense, capturing directly to disk anyow.

Bill. CA exist in all lenses - even the best. Under extreme conditions it looks very bad, but most of the time you never see it.

Jay. Time will tell. Let's return to this topic in 2012 and see how much tape that is left. As for Evan above and many other - time is money - and tape is not an option then. Do you buy a VHS tape rec. today? I don't - I have a hard disc rec. It took about 3 years for the HDR to kill the VHS market. Same will go with tape vs. solid state, IMO.

Martin Saxer September 16th, 2007 05:21 AM

I was looking for a HV20 in Hong Kong a couple of weeks ago. Difficult to find. I kept hearing the following: "There is no market for tape based solutions in the consumer sector any more". It really happens very quickly.

Nothing against tapes. I still like them (for most of my work).

Mats Frendahl September 16th, 2007 06:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Saxer (Post 745045)
I was looking for a HV20 in Hong Kong a couple of weeks ago. Difficult to find. I kept hearing the following: "There is no market for tape based solutions in the consumer sector any more". It really happens very quickly.

Nothing against tapes. I still like them (for most of my work).

Interesting. I do most my recording with A1 directly to laptop so it will be a good camera for a long time still - tape or not - but I will certainly have a look at the EX next time (or Canon version if that exist at that time).

Meryem Ersoz September 16th, 2007 09:32 AM

if canon upgrades anything in this line, it will most likely be the H1, to get embedded audio via HD-SDI...the A1 is still one of the better values in the market. solid state recording is still in its infancy--relative to tape, it is still expensive and recording times are short. it's not that efficient for the majority of applications. certainly this is changing fast, but not that fast....moreover with 3rd-party apps which allow portable recording to flash drives, they will probably be monitoring that market demand closely before they make any sudden moves.

XDCAM EX is more of a competitor to panasonic's offerings than to canon's, so other than dropping prices and maybe adding the audio feature, i'm guessing that they will sit this one out.

i'd be happy to be proven wrong though!

Mats Frendahl September 16th, 2007 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meryem Ersoz (Post 745102)
moreover with 3rd-party apps which allow portable recording to flash drives

If SanDisk et al. can do a good one I'd buy it on the spot. The current hard disk drives that exist have not gotten top reviews.

Philip Williams September 16th, 2007 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mats Frendahl (Post 744899)
If nothing happens Canon users will jump to Sony when the EX hits the 4k price - which it will, by time.

Sony isn't going to run their 7K camcorder with 1/2" sensors down to 4K. That'd be nice, but not gonna happen.

Mats Frendahl September 16th, 2007 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Philip Williams (Post 745153)
Sony isn't going to run their 7K camcorder with 1/2" sensors down to 4K. That'd be nice, but not gonna happen.

just wait and see...

"4k GPS systems will never be standard in cars..."


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