Canon Removes "Film Grain" from XL2
 

Hooray! See the full story here.

Ahh, interesting explanaition. "Can no longer get the software"??? Who would refuse to sell their software to Canon? My guess is they just realized what a dumb feature it was. Will the switch still be labled? (I am guessing all they are doing is a software update).

I think a handy button would be a "tone" generator button. I know its hidden in the menu, but a button would be nice, just like the bars.

Stationary film grain looks crappy anyway. Maybe with this new button that's now left over, they can figure out a way to make it switch from mic to line on the XLRs.

This inspired a thought process about onboard tone generators, but for once (Chris! I restrained myself!) I'll post it as a new thread in the appropriate forum rather than digress here.

I don't care, but from another very long thread...maybe they'll put a mic level / line switch for the XLR inputs! HA! ;-)

Anyway, even as an amateur I immediately thought that the film grain thing was a cheesy idea. Actually, if they are going to do anything at all with that button, Richard's Color Bars & Tone idea is a good one.

Im not sure about you guys, but I would be rather offended if they added something useful to it after I paid 5,000$. It leaves us with the pretty much "useless" feature and (If they add something) everyone else with a new and possible useful addition.

Well...that's the breaks for being out on the bleeding edge of technology, being the first kid on the block with the newest toy, etc.
Seriously, though, just because they change something doesn't mean the camera you have is any worse. It's still going to produce the same quality image. I read about people who rushed out and dumped their XL1's when the XL1s came out, even though it had only minor improvements. It doesn't matter what you buy or when you buy it, there will always be a new and improved model out.

I never looked back from switching out the XL1 to the XL1s (and not just because I ended up only paying about $300 for the switch!) Having the ability to keep the camera from going into standby every 5 minutes coupled with the 16:9 framelines in the viewfinder were both massively useful, irregardless of the improvements in picture quality, sensistivity etc. It made that camera platform work for me instead of against me.

Hey, I don't know Travis. I think my XL2 will be a rare collector's item now...maybe I can sell it for an HDV cam! (Oooh, did I say that OUT LOUD!?????) ;-)

Haha Nice. Yeah, maybe this will turn into one of those oddball rarities and then we will be instant millionaires. No more filmmaking for me. Consider me retired.

Going from XL1 to the s model for 300 bucks was a good deal. I'd have done that too. But selling an old one cheap and then buying a new one would not have been a good thing, in my opinion.

<< I would be rather offended if they added something useful to it after I paid 5,000$. >>

Relax. They're not about to add anything. The best case scenario, and even this is a bit of a long shot, is that they might map some existing feature to that extraneous button. But add something new? No way will that happen.

eeexcellent-Mr. Burns. *rubs hands*. i'm glad i waited... =).

What's interesting to me is they even publicized this. They must have something they're planning to do with that button. I've never heard of a company bragging about taking away a feature, even if it's a totally cheesy and useless feature.

Well, in all fairness, Canon USA is not bragging about it -- I am.

Haha !

Excelent way to check if you are getting an old stock model or a new released one ! :-)

Frank

when will the new xl2 hit market
 

i am wondering because i would think that canon might also have addressed or refined other items on this camera . just my opinion but to remove something that is from the factory would be major .it would only make sense to make other refinements .thanks for the info Mr. Hurd ............ dp

Has anyone purchased a new XL2 without the film grain feature?According to the updated manual the color bars/film grain button is now just color bars, and then the on/off toggle is still the same. Seems kinda odd that they wouldnt re-assign a function to that button.

At the top of the page of the manual about the feature it reads "recording color bars/audio reference signal." But no mention is made of a tone generator in the text or directions. I was wondering if anyone has had any experience with one of the new cameras. I'm going to be placing my XL2 order here in the very near future and am a little offset by this - not that the film grain feature was useful, but that canon would get rid of a feature at the drop of a hat or because they "can't acquire the software anymore." Makes me wonder if I should wait a little longer to see if they refine the camera further or if I should just bite the bullet...what a pickle!

Devin,

The choice of when to buy any type of tech gear is always tough. A good rule of thumb is;

If you can wait - do so. It will only get better and cheaper.

If you can make money with it NOW- Buy it NOW, this will offset the purchase price, probably more than the difference in a resale and upgrade at a later date.

My XL2 has film grain, and I can't imagine why I would want to use it.

Devin...

<< Has anyone purchased a new XL2 without the film grain feature? I was wondering if anyone has had any experience with one of the new cameras. >>

They only just now announced the intent to change. Therefore you'll have to expect some degree of time to pass before the revised model starts shipping. These things don't happen overnight.

It was just wishful thinking on my part that they'd re-map the now-extraneous button to some other function, but as I suspected, it appears that's not going to happen.

Do not expect any other changes or "refinements."

Hmm, all this seems strange to me. It's odd that so soon after the release they say they're doing this. I wonder if it's something "legal." Did they use film grain effects from another company or something?

Oh well...it doesn't sound like any of us are going to miss it! It just seems odd to me so soon after a release. Surely they did their research before adding it. I bet there is a reason we don't know or may not know about.

Richard, thanks for the rules of thumb. I pretty much live by those two principles regarding equipment purchase anyhow, but it's nice to be reminded of them.

Chris, the press release from canon made it sound like the change would be pretty immediate:

"The technology that produces the Film Grain feature on the XL2 camcorder is no longer obtainable by Canon. Therefore beginning December 21, 2004 new XL2 models available for sale will not include the Film Grain feature."

Or would those sales be to distributors? Didn't really think about it from that angle. Anyways, this is all very interesting, albeit a small nit-pick about this otherwise great camera.

I suspect that the change to the camcorder is in firmware, which can be updated by Canon when the unit is sent in for servicing - that was the case with several items with the original XL1.

Sounds like the technology was licensed from another company and that license may have expired. And the other company and Canon could not come to an agreement over price. It may even have been some thing complex like Canon licensed from company XYZ, which over the years, was ultimately bought by Sony (or JVC, etc.).

Didn't one of the Canon Hi8 camcorders in the pre A1/L1 era have a film grain effect?

xl2 film grain?
 

does anyone know what they are replacing the film grain button on the xl2 with?

Welcome Jason,

To the best of anyone's knowledge here, they're going to do nothing with the button. Here's the original thread on the subject:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...ght=Film+grain

Of course, we'd all like to see a neat new function, or at least something from the menus promoted to "button status" but it doesn't look like that'll happen.

Happy Friday!

thanks pete. pretty odd that canon would take away a useless effect for the camera and replace it with an even more useless button. hehe.

no more grain button
 

if you look at the new PDF manual for the xl2 you will see on page 11 that the new switch is labeled color bars now . dp

Odd, what are they labelling as the old color bars button??

no more grain
 

i will find out in a few days . just ordered one from zotz .dp

The way it works now is that there are two buttons for toggling the color bars. The first is the old "color bars / film grain" button which is now labelled only as "film grain." Pushing this button places the color baqrs on "standby." The second button is as it always was... the actual on / off toggle for the color bars.

Shouldn't that be: "now labelled only as "color bars""

instead of "film grain"?