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-   -   Digital Bolex closes shop (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/digital-video-industry-news/532149-digital-bolex-closes-shop.html)

Glen Vandermolen June 27th, 2016 08:18 PM

Digital Bolex closes shop
 
Sad news:

Thank You | DigitalBolex.com

Zach Love June 28th, 2016 03:40 PM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
Sad to see them shutter their doors, but I'm not too surprised.

As mentioned in their post "it still remains the only affordable camera with fully raw, uncompressed 12-bit footage, native global shutter, incredible audio capabilities, and, as of our most recent firmware update this May, color science that now rivals cameras tens of times its cost"

Yes, 12-bit is better than 10-bit which is better than 8-bit, but I've seen lots of amazing things straight out of a camera that is shooting compressed 8-bit videos with rolling shutter.

If you're young & don't have money for your film, you could buy a Digital Bolex for $5k + accessories, or you could shoot with a $500 GH3 & use the other $4,500+ on set design, props, crew, etc. etc. et.

Brian Drysdale June 29th, 2016 01:30 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
I don't think they intended you to buy a Digital Bolex for just one film, rental makes more sense for that, it's surprising the deals that rental house will do for short film makers.

There are now a numberr of options in the $5k or less range, although the Digial Bolex got respect when tested on CML for its images.

Zach Love June 29th, 2016 10:52 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
I think I just always disagreed with the whole "Independent filmmakers NEED this high level, 12-bit, global shutter, etc. etc. etc."

No they don't. Maybe in 2001, when everything was interlaced DV, but in the post HDSLR world, young want to be filmmakers had tons of cheap options.

I think if you don't have a lot of money, it's okay to shoot compressed (or whatever affordable option you have available). Kevin Smith shot Clerks on 16mm B&W because that is what he could afford.

I think their hearts were in the right place, just maybe mis-read the market & what was really needed.

At least they weren't as bad as BMD. I never understood why BMD released a super cheap Hyperdeck Shuttle recorder that needed $$$ SSD drives to record uncompressed video. At the time I thought, anyone who NEEDS uncompressed video can spend more than $345 on a recorder (especially when the SSD drives will costs a lot more than $345). Once the Hyperdeck Shuttle 2 came out that could do Prores, it opened the door to cheaper drives & made a lot more sense.

But all of this is just my opinion.

Jon Fairhurst June 29th, 2016 11:26 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
Yeah, you don't *need* 16mm, 12-bits, global shutter, but it would be a killer cam for greenscreen action footage. 8-bit, encoded, rolling shutter video simply can't compete when it comes to compositing.

Unfortunately, the Digital Bolex industrial design implied that "this is for old-style and documentary film-making." But not everybody feels retro, and RAW isn't necessarily the best solution for docs. I'm afraid that the camera's physical look just didn't match its potential. If anything, it looked like it was for handheld only and didn't look like it would be rugged in the field.

But if anybody has an action compositing project, they might just look for a used Digital Bolex - and hope that it never needs servicing.

Gary Huff June 29th, 2016 01:06 PM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
The Digital Bolex simply never delivered in either usability or image quality. Anyone that says differently also thinks the Emperor is sporting the finest finery known to man.

Brian Drysdale June 29th, 2016 01:41 PM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
A number of people have said otherwise about the images from the Digitial Bolex. The ergomonics is another matter.

Gary Huff June 29th, 2016 01:43 PM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale (Post 1917186)
A number of people have said otherwise about the images from the Digitial Bolex.

Of course they have. They just dropped $5k on a camera that tickles their desires. That they say the images are fantastic is inevitable. But I didn't spend $5k and I saw the same video they posted and they are mistaken.

Brian Drysdale June 29th, 2016 04:31 PM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
These were tests pertormed by Geoff Boyle on CML, who was positive about the results from the camera. It''s a 2k sensor, so not the sharpest around, but not producing a nice image is one thing I haven't heard about this camera, although it has the downside of a low ISO.

Gary Huff June 29th, 2016 05:30 PM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale (Post 1917196)
These were tests pertormed by Geoff Boyle on CML, who was positive about the results from the camera.

What did he say, exactly? Be sure to include a link.

Brian Drysdale June 30th, 2016 12:58 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
You have to be a member of CML to get access to his full comments, but here are camera tests that has some comments about grading the D16.

CML-UWE-Camera-Evaluation-Oct-2015

Philip Bloom also liked the organic pictures, his concerns were about how the camera fitted into the market.

Video review of the Digital Bolex D-16 | Philip Bloom


Digital Bolex D16 Review Part 2: First Footage & D16 vs. Blackmagic Pocket vs. SI-2K Mini Test

Gary Huff June 30th, 2016 04:44 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale (Post 1917206)
You have to be a member of CML to get access to his full comments, but here are camera tests that has some comments about grading the D16.

Then how do you know that there are comments? And a simple "you'll be amazed" within the entire link doesn't exactly go into detail, and could just as easily refer to the editing of cDNG files in Photoshop alone.

Quote:

I've graded the Bolex thumbnails in Photoshop because none of the automated processes I use worked well with the cDNG files
Doesn't sound like he had any experience with cDNG there, so perhaps the first time of doing it that way was amazing? Still not much of a ringing endorsement.

Quote:

Philip Bloom also liked the organic pictures, his concerns were about how the camera fitted into the market.
Philip Bloom is not very well going to trash a camera with this much buzz on his website that is dependent on catering to the enthusiast community.

Brian Drysdale June 30th, 2016 06:03 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
Geoff Boyle is a well known top DP, CML is a site for professional cimematographers and crew members many of whom work on high end productions of which I'm a member. He is extremely robust in his comments and demanding about cameras and there was some discussion at the time about the best approagh to grading the Digital Bolex for these tests.

I know the enthusiasts who own a D16 include a TV broadcast engineer and a Vice President of a well known top camera rental company, who are pleased with the results from the camera.

So far, I haven't read any really negative comments about the D16 images (other than yours), which isn't the case with say the Cion. It's a camera trying to make images which are the digital equivalent of Super 16 film, which may not be to everyones taste and it's not a camera for shooting in low light.

Phillip Bloom did make negative comments about the D16, questioning where it fitted in when there are other, much more versatile cameras in the market.

The D16 is a niche camera.

Gary Huff June 30th, 2016 06:18 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale (Post 1917221)
Geoff Boyle is a well known top DP, CML is a site for professional cimematographers and crew members many of whom work on high end productions of which I'm a member. He is extremely robust in his comments and demanding about cameras and there was some discussion at the time about the best approagh to grading the Digital Bolex for these tests.

Nothing at all which says he thinks the camera excels in any aspects over and above any of the better options out there.

Quote:

I know the enthusiasts who own a D16 include a TV broadcast engineer and a Vice President of a well known top camera rental company, who are pleased with the results from the camera.
None of which pay their rent by the supposed virtues of the D16 over the competition. It's a camera they can play with and it has a different look to it, nothing more.

Quote:

So far, I haven't read any really negative comments about the D16 images (other than yours)
That's because you haven't been looking.

Quote:

which isn't the case with say the Cion.
Definitely not one that appeals to nostalgia.

Quote:

The D16 is a niche camera.
The D16 offers nothing except a look that you can easily emulate from any other camera that shoots to a decent codec. There is not one thing about it that makes it worth owning at all unless the design appeals to your hipster aesthetic. People say it looks good because they want to jump in with the crowd and not appear to be an artless cretin, but it's all an illusion, just like the Emperor's threads.

Brian Drysdale June 30th, 2016 06:52 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
I guess the illusion,depends on what you're shooting gains any advantage from using a CCD v CMOS sensor.

Gary Huff June 30th, 2016 06:54 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale (Post 1917226)
I guess the illusion,depends on what you're shooting gains any advantage from using a CCD v CMOS sensor.

CMOS gives you better dynamic range and low light performance, while CCD doesn't exhibit rolling shutter (which is greatly dependent on the readout speed of the CMOS sensor, so my A7R II isn't so hot, but the C300 Mark II is pretty solid).

Brian Drysdale June 30th, 2016 08:43 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
However, not Super 16 sized sensor, which is this camera's selling point. There's a fair amount of great Super 16 glass out there, which is currently being under used, but could be used on digital cameras.

Gary Huff June 30th, 2016 08:44 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale (Post 1917232)
However, not Super 16 sized sensor, which is this camera's selling point. There's a fair amount of great Super 16 glass out there, which is currently being under used, but could be used on digital cameras.

Plenty of other, more robust cameras, with better controls, better sensitivity, better DR, and better color can make use of 16mm glass.

Brian Drysdale June 30th, 2016 08:55 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
It's looks robust to me, certainly more heavy dury than other cameras I've seen in this price range. Eccentric certainly, but, in the end, it comes down to a matter of personal taste and what works for each film maker.

Gary Huff June 30th, 2016 08:57 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale (Post 1917236)
it comes down to a matter of personal taste and what works for each film maker.

Very true, however, I don't see it being used. It's something that sits on your shelf that you take down to show visitors so they can think better of you, not a tool to be used in actual production work that pays your bills.

Brian Drysdale June 30th, 2016 09:45 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
It's more a camera for suitable music videos, perhaps advertisements that want a left field sensibility, certainly not one for a lot of professional productions.

Gary Huff June 30th, 2016 09:47 AM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale (Post 1917240)
certainly not one for a lot of professional productions.

We certainly agree the camera is not for paying projects.

Peer Landa July 5th, 2016 09:44 PM

Re: Digital Bolex closes shop
 
At least I got their t-shirt out of my sponsorship -- which I now use as a fancy dust cover for my Akai MPC.

-- peer (loves supporting creative underdogs)


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