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-   -   Torn between two lovers... (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/high-definition-video-editing-solutions/31800-torn-between-two-lovers.html)

Lynne Whelden September 12th, 2004 07:41 AM

Torn between two lovers...
Now that Sony's camera is on the horizon, I can start thinking about buying more stuff. (I have the HD10 but I'm only using it to shoot football games.) Here's the dilemma--I really love the look of the new imac with its big 20 inch LCD screen containing all the computer inside. I'm into simplicity and no cables--as close as you can come to portability without using a laptop. However, I also like the Sony Vegas software--partly because it can edit footage of any resolution (which we'll all be doing with our DV footage for the next few years, I imagine) and partly because Steve Mullen in the latest issue of "Video Systems" was able to describe how to use it in a mere 17 paragraphs. My kind of editing program!!!
But Sony and Apple don't mix. Especially at the processing speeds necessary to edit HDV2. What to do?

Christopher C. Murphy September 12th, 2004 08:03 AM

HDV2 doesn't exist. It's something that Mullen made up or heard someone say off-the-cuff somewhere. We haven't even scratched the surface of HDV yet...and that's an official standard and proper way of saying it. It could confuse a lot of people reading these forums...and a lot of people do!

I'd go with a Mac - that's my opinion. The support is there, and it's only going to get better.


Eric Bilodeau September 12th, 2004 08:06 AM


I do not understand why Sony and Apple wopuldn't mix. We've been using FCP with Sony cameras for years with excellent results. The G5 are more than enough in terms of processing speeds for HDV. I would recommend a dual processor but I am sure than a single processor would do fine (though a lot of RT would be lost). The G5 are much faster than the G4 mainly because the bus speed was the G4's problem, too slow, witch is not the case for the G5. Still the imac will be slower than a equivalent desktop computer in order not to overheat.

If you want maximum performance, your bus speed must be half your processor speed, witch is the case for the dual G5. For example, the Imac has a 600mhz frontside bus for a 1.8Ghz processor (1/3rd the processor speed) but a dual 1.8 has two 900mhz frontside busses (each half the processor speed), this is a major gain in processing speed and ability to play/edit HD material. I would recommend a dual G5, I work with those and editing HDV is not a problem in that environment, I doubt HDV2 will be a problem since I can play two simultaneous HDV streams without drop frames on my G5.

Eric Bilodeau September 12th, 2004 08:08 AM

HVD2, as a matter of fact, has been announced at NAB by sony but the FX1 uses HDV. Sony likes to put up his own type of format.

David Newman September 12th, 2004 10:02 AM

The never was an HDV2, that was a misspelling of one the spec's two formats HD1 and HD2. It is funny that JVC use the spec name in their first product name. Both formats where defined ages ago, HD2 is not a newer very of HD1, it is just 1080i vs 720p in the HDV spec.

Frederic Lumiere September 12th, 2004 11:25 AM

David is absolutely correct.

This is from the latest HDV naming guideline from the HDV org:

Currently, the following naming is defined in the “HDV Format”:
“HD1 mode” to specify the 720p/480p/576p recording specifications
“HD2 mode” to specify the 1080i recording specification


Lynne Whelden September 12th, 2004 12:14 PM

Well, if one's advice is to go with Apple and FCP all the way, can FCP incorporate any format (DV and/or HDV) of any resolution into the timeline? Or is Vegas currently the only software that pulls that stunt off?

Eric Bilodeau September 12th, 2004 01:01 PM

FCP can, absolutely transparently, but it remains of the original definition unless otherwise specified (720X480 will be displayed at 720X480 in the timeline, it will have to be "zoomed" to fit a HD definition, putting HD in a SD timeline is the opposite). But it works just fine in any definition.

Lynne Whelden September 13th, 2004 06:44 AM

So if I understand you correctly...with FCP you can drop a DV clip next to a HDV (720 30p) clip next to a HDV (1080i) clip and it will play back just fine. You just have to "zoom" (???) or designate what resolution you want each clip should play back at? Do you foresee any problem editing with the next-gereration imacs?

Eric Bilodeau September 13th, 2004 04:44 PM

You understood correctly, any definition in a compatible frame rate will be usable in the same timeline and you can "zoom" in or out to match the timeline's definition.

I have not tested an Imac but it should work fine though it will not offer the performance of a desktop G5. Still it will be enough for HDV since the dual G4 are enough with much less frontside buss speed than the new Imac. I doubt that much RT effects will be supported though.

Kevin Shaw September 17th, 2004 07:01 PM

I'd say that if you plan to do any significant amount of HDV work in the near future, you're much better off going with the PC platform for now. Apple hasn't even shipped their HDV solution for FCP yet, but there are already at least four editing applications supporting HDV on PCs. Adobe Premiere Pro with Cineform's Aspect HD allows real-time HDV editing with an efficient workflow on mid-priced PCs, and even works in real time on high-end PC laptops! In November, Canopus will ship a hardware-based HDV editing solution which is going to have some every impressive features (including mixing formats with real-time upscaling and downscaling), and maybe even give a few Mac users a reason to think about switching over to "the dark side."

None of which is to say that people won't do fine HDV work on the Mac platform and enjoy doing it in Final Cut Pro, but for now and the foreseeable future the best HDV options are for PCs.

Lynne Whelden September 17th, 2004 07:44 PM


Mark Paschke September 17th, 2004 10:37 PM

Vegas is real hard to beat and it just gets better all the time , I just finished a project so fast that looks like it took me a week and I spent like 4 hours and it really shows off HD even on DVD using TMPGnc

P4 Hyper threading + Cineform + Vegas + TMPGnc = unbeatable speed and quality in the HDV realm in my recent experience

Lynne Whelden September 18th, 2004 07:14 AM

TMPGnc is what exactly? I'm blanking.

Mark Paschke September 18th, 2004 07:24 AM


I finally got around to putting my last 2 HD projects on DVD using TMPGE and was seriously blown away at its fabulous job compared to Mainconcept and DVD Architects yucko

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