Should I choose Mac or Pc
 

I have been a pc user since I could type, but from alot of comments in and around forums it has come to light that Macs are great at film production i.e. FCP. My question is it worth a indie filmaker as myself to switch from pc, which I've used for around 13years to Mac, which I haven't even spent a day behind. I really need help with this because coming this winter I'll be purchasing my setup, cameras, on t lights, as well as editing workflow station, and I'm not sure what to do. I need serious feedback, which can aide me in my choice. Learning the nw OS doesn't scare me as much as purchasing several Grand woth of equipment and learning that I should've went the other route. Thanks so much for the help.

I think the main question you should ask yourself is; is there currently anything you can't do on your pc, as indie filmaker, that would force you to switch to a mac? Though I'm sure you will get plenty reactions from Mac/pc users telling you that their system will be the best, and just using the search function on this site will give a lot of similar questions and debates often ending in bashing up eachother.
I have asked myself the same question some time ago but reading the forums now it seems that FCP 6 does have stability problems even causing production houses switching back to FCP5 but then again I also read about premiere CS3 users complaining about the stability of this new release.
Switching to a mac is a quite big investment but I'm sure you won't regret it, on the other hand staying on a pc is a bit cheaper and with the right set-up hardware/software you won't regret it either.
One of the reasons to switch to a mac could be that it's a client requirement that you work with fcp, if you got the cash you can buy fcp and premiere on a mac. But then on a pc you can use vegas or edius which both have proven to be very good nle's.

I think the biggest disadvantage of fcp is that you can't try it out on a pc, you must buy a mac first and then see if you made a good choice.

I'm not overly concerned about the switch from pc to mac as price goes, because I need an upgrade of my pc also, for my post production. What I'm thinking is buying a mac book pro at the cheapest level (2gb) and upgrading the ram myself, which would run me close to $1700 +$149 for FCP. And if I got a new PC (laptop) I would still spend close $1200 software included. But I just wanted to know is FCP worth it for a noob at editing or should I take my time and work with Vegas on the PC.

I'd stick with whatever you're most familiar with. Your productivity would only be hampered with learning a new machine unnecessarily.

(And I'm a Mac user.)

Just a word of warning. What Noa pointed out here, will not be tolerated at DVINFO.

Jimmy, I don't think you would regret owning a Mac system. I've had one for a couple years now after being a strictly DOS/Windows guy since IBM offered up the original 'personal computer'. Although I still have both systems in my house, I find the Mac gets 90 percent of my computer usage. I don't have an Intel based Mac, but all the new ones are, of course. There is software that allows you to install and run Windows on the Mac systems these days. Several people have reported good experiences running native apps like Vegas NLE in this mode. Of course you have to buy a stand alone copy of Windows, but you'll get pretty much the best of both worlds in one machine with this approach.

Since there are numerous Apple retail stores around the country now, I'd suggest going to one of them and asking to see FCP demonstrated. This will also allow you to see if the software 'feels' right to you.

Best of luck, whatever you decide.

-gb-

In addition to Adobe CS3, Sony Vegas, Soundforge, Acid, and Cinescore all run on PCs and provide thoroughly professional tools. Just pointing out their equally powerful tools to FCP on the PC, some would even say better. YMMV

A fresh experience
 

No bashing at all, Macs are wonderful machines and FCP is a good NLE.

But on Saturday afternoon I visited a good old friend who's been in video as an expert amateur (sounds like an oxymoron?), shall we call him high class hobbyist... long time Mac person together with his son, also head first into video. They own at least a Mac desktop and a laptop that I know of, and they've been using FCP for years.

I was surprized to see a shiny new PC under the editing desk, so obviously I asked why? They said they needed to upgrade the hardware, did some research... Macs are proprietary this, proprietary that, proprietary everything... the PC came out half price (put it together themselves). They moved to Adobe for software, they love jumping from app to app, integration rocks, there is nothing they were used to doing on the Mac that they can't do on the PC.

As I said just a fresh experience... long live both the Mac and the PC... and you go with whatever suits your production needs and your pocket.

Not to burst their bubble, but Adobe's CS3 Master Collection is also available for Mac. If they want to be editing with Adobe's products, you can do that on a Mac just as easily as you can on Windows.

Furthermore, you can run Windows on a Mac, while also having an OSX partition. So, I don't think their argument is well thought-out.

However, if price is a major issue, then yes, you'll save some bucks on rolling your own Windows box.

If you want to be a professional editor, you might as well switch to FCP and learn it now. If you don't care, then I'd stick with a PC and master whatever NLE you are using now.

Would you mind expanding on that? I don't quite understand what you're getting at. All things being equal (skills of the editor, computer, etc) how does Final Cut make you a more professional editor?

What Mathew said ... If anything, Avid is still the NLE of choice for the studio post houses. The corporate professionals tend to favour Adobe, not FCP, while Vegas is giving all three of them a run for the money with professionals of all stripes. To say that if you want to be a pro you MUST learn FCP is simply not true.

Unless you're spending someone else's money, then money is ALWAYS an issue for all of us regular people, yes, a major issue. I don't see your point with your first line either - if they wanted a Mac, they would have kept FCP, why move to Adobe? Their goal was to do the job without breaking the bank.

To me the hard part is not fighting over which tool is more professional than the other, but to learn professional editing. THAT is what makes you a pro editor, not Adobe or Avid or FCP. Give a professional editor good footage and Windows Movie Maker and he'll cut you a masterpiece!

My personal story was one of having lousy experience with PC laptops. I ended up buying a MacBook and running boot camp with all my PC software, I rarely boot into the Mac OS. It is the most reliable laptop I have owned. MacBooks/Pros are not much more expensive than PC laptops. This would give you the best of both worlds. Now, if you are buying a desktop computer, you would save quite a bit of cash by buying a PC and I have found desktop PCs very reliable. Both OSes will get the job done.

Duane

I agree - it's an issue. Didn't say it wasn't. But let's analyze the true total bill...

If they already owned FCP ($999), then, why would they want to spend that kind of dough to invest in Adobe Premeire Pro? If the primary goal was saving money, this could prove potentially counter-productive. Of course, they saved some money on the new computer being a roll-your-own variety, but they had to spend something near the difference in new software. They wanted to go Windows. That's fine. There are many valid reasons for going that way, and saving money can be one. It's just that there are associated costs with switching platforms, and perhaps not all of those costs were fully explored prior to making the decision. Maybe they were, and I'm not getting the full story. That's OK, too. I'm just pointing out that a savings on hardware necessitated an additional expenditure in software in this case. That's all.

Cutting is something I used to do with a razor blade and adhesive tape. You don't even need a computer to do it. So what is the hard part, then? The hard part is not fighting over a tool (that's easy, and everyone can do it). The hard part is deciding which tool best serves your purposes. That's a decision worth pondering for awhile.

IMO...

A- It's not hard switching to Mac. Though there are some minor annoyances that you have to get used to (crtl and alt kind of flip positions, Mac file system versus NTFS, etc.). But it's not hard to swtch.

If you are thinking of working as an editor, I don't think you can go wrong learning FCP. There are so many people who use it.

For higher-end broadcast work (commercials, TV series, etc.), FCP is also used as well as Avid. This is both for offline and online editing. Though there is probably more Avid than FCP. For online editing, a number of different systems are used. Avid isn't always #1... for onlining commercials, the #1 system is Flame.
However, for that type of work, you also need some experience working an entry-level position like intern or tape op before you know enough to be a decent assistant editor. And then gain enough skills to work as an editor. Working in that niche is not something you can learn at home.

B- If you want to get into broadcast design work, get After Effects Pro. It is a very deep program.

C- If you're just looking at doing your own films, I would strongly consider Vegas for its value. The NLEs out there (Premiere, Avid, FCP, Vegas, etc.) pretty much do the same thing. If you need to get into more complicated stuff like compositing in special effects, then you'd look at something like After Effects.

Vegas is very very good for one man army type of work... you can do all your audio editing in it, and a little bit of effects work in it. And it has good color correction tools. The other NLEs are kind of clunky when it comes to audio editing, so you might look at emporting an OMF/whatever to the bundled audio mixing applications. Which is not as elegant a workflow.

D- If you need/want After Effects, then you might also look at the Adobe suite for its value. Whereas the NLEs don't make a difference on output quality, you can use After Effects to fix problems in your footage, add effects, paint stuff out / remove logos, compositing in matte paintings, etc. etc.

But learning After Effects is only if you want to get into really detailed stuff... it may spread yourself too thin. You might be better off spending your money on other items (other gear, production budget, rent, food, whatever).

It doesn't make you a more professional editor at all, but FCP is probably the most commonly used NLE in small to medium production companies. Most editor jobs are in FCP. You are simply giving yourself the tool that will get you the most work.

Ah, the endless debate. Should I edit on a Macintosh or PC? Should I edit with Avid or Final Cut Pro or Vegas or Premiere? For post-production, the decision should be what software suite you want to run first, and the hardware platform second. Some software suites run on both Mac and PC, so you then have a second decision, others run on only one platform (like Vegas and Final Cut Pro) so in those cases the second decision is already made for you.

I've used both Mac and PC, I've edited with Avid, Final Cut Pro and Premiere, and personally I've chosen to stick with Macintosh and Final Cut Pro, but in the end, it's a religious issue (especially the Mac vs. PC thing) unless you're planning to make your living as an editor. If that's the case, in terms of making a practical decision based on hard statistics you can determine on your own and avoid all the religious posturing, take a look at Craig's List and other job boards, what I've discovered is that there are a number of professional editing jobs that require Avid experience, most independent film and small production company editing jobs require Final Cut Pro, and there's a small contingent of corporate video users who are working with Premiere.

This all reminds me of a back-page column Umberto Eco once wrote, La bustina di Minerva, in the Italian news weekly Espresso, September 30, 1994, you can find an English translation at www.themodernword.com/eco/eco_mac_vs_pc.html

Yep
 

I agree with Dylan on this one. Having worked in L.A. for the last few years, Final Cut is definitely more prominent among pros out here. I've only heard of production houses using Avid or Final Cut and I've never heard of any professional production houses using any PC based editing software. I'm sure they're out there, I've just never personally seen them. I had been using Premiere for years and years but as soon as I got to L.A. I had to make the transition. The good thing is, Final Cut is pretty much just like Premiere, so for me, it was an incredibly easy transition. Now that I've used Macs for the last few years I literally hate life when I have to use a PC for anything.

I found that it wasn't a religious choice for me to use a Mac or a PC - it was more being economical with my time, and retaining my sanity.

For the past two years, I cut and finished on PCs. Before that were Macs - FCP version 1 and 2, but the PC seemed less expensive and therefore, more economical. Despite being technically knowledgeable, I went through two in a short period due to hardware and then software conflicts, and moved back to the Mac. I'm far more productive due to the stable nature of the OS, and it's overlying apps (FCP Studio 1 and now 2). I'm a happier and more productive person using a Mac for all my needs.. and prefer the editing/compositing/audio/dvd/rendering programs of Final Cut Studio as well. Final Cut Studio 2 is a big, nice step up from FCS 1 (which was already great). My little story.

This is the old Ford Vs Chevy debate.

The answer to his question can only come from himself.

No matter what you use, you will make it work.
I think it's more important to have a great story.
I think it's important to get good framming,levels,exposure......

Then almost any NLE will do to cut/edit for the end product.

I use Vegas (cant wait for the new version very soon ) and love it on a PC.

Cheers
Simon

Vegas now runs on both PC and MAC :)

If budget is a concern, this a no brainer. Stay PC and get Vegas. You already have a PC and Vegas 6 is only $99. Vegas even comes with the cineform codec. Fantastic value. without debating the merits of Vegas, no one will argue it's the cheapest and also that it has the best audio features.

No doubt. Hands-down the fastest audio editor out there. I was using Vegas back when it was released by Sonic Foundry for audio editing purposes. Outside of it's third-party plug-in format limitations (which they have since corrected) it was a solid and fast DAW. Vegas Video applies the same speed and ease of the original to the video world with fantastic results.

I use both FCP on Mac and Vegas 7 on PC. I couldn't live without either.

Not all hardware is specific to Macs, especially hard drives and RAM, both of which can be used in either Macs or PCs, so the cost is equal. This is not the case for EVERY Mac, but newer ones (G5's, MacBook Pro's) you will find that RAM/HDs are interchangable. On top of this, newer G5's have an extra PCI-E slot, so pretty much everything you'd want to upgrade is upgradeable. Plus you never have to look at windows, which I'm always okay with. (not a Windows bash, just personal preference of UI's)

ya know, being a sound guy this thread sounds like a debate we used to have on another forum. It first started out just like this, Mac vs. Pc and ended up protools vs. Motu. As a Mac addict, I will tell you they are better, A PC addict will tell you they are better. how do you know for sure? you dont! aint life grand..............

my 2 cents,

I LOVE MY APPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Having been both a cheap-skate and a PC user for a LONG time I was a bit reluctant to fork out the extra cash for a Mac, but I decided to on the basis that FCP experience was more likely to land me editing work down here in Australia than any PC-based NLE that I could afford. So a couple of months ago I made the switch.

And I'm glad I did. Granted, the student discounts I was able to get on both the hardware and software for the computer were an added incentive. But using Apple's Bootcamp on my Mac Pro gives me two computers for the price of one, and anything I'd prefer to do on PC is no further than a restart away.

On that basis, I think it makes a great deal of sense financially - it's gives you two high-end computers (a Mac and a PC) for a much lower price than buying two comparable systems running seperate OSs.

If you like Bootcamp, you will LOVE Parallels which gives you the ability to run Windows and Mac OS X side by side on an Intel Mac running both Mac OS X and Windows XP seamlessly and at the same time.

Post experience
 

Hello

We just fiished a 90 minute doc and our experience when we went to a post audio house we needed to be on a MAC for compatibilty. Now I realize that you can export the audio tracks so they can mesh in PC suites, but it feels more comfortable to take Mac stuff to post Macs.

Cheers

I would say that you should get a Mac because macintosh has this software called Paralel Desktop that allows you to run two opperating systems at once. I would say a Mac with OS X and Windows Vista Ultimate edition is the perfect digital filmmakers tool.

I changed from PC with Premiere Pro to a Mac Pro with FC Studio about a year ago.

Have to say it wasn't that easy to make the adjusment for the first month... not because the Mac is more difficult to use - but because it's easier, and my brain was still tuned in to having to do back-flips to get jobs done on my PC.

But now I'm a fully converted Mac user and I'm glad I did it... I feel I have a much more versatile editing set-up, with amazing support from other users online if I ever need advice. The Mac has a kind of sweetness to it, I guess.

One myth I would like to quash, though... Macs do crash. Not often... but they do.