Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

It depends on the writer, and the audience. If Spielberg wanted a script it would cost him an awful lot more than if it's a screenplay for an art film with restricted audience. It's worth what the buyer is willing to pay. The better the writer, the more in demand their products are, and up goes the price.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Okay, well it's just he said I should buy script that producers and invested would be kicking down my door to want to be a part of. But if the script is that good, that they would be banging on my door, would I be able to afford such a script?

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Not to discourage but as I understand it part of getting investors/funding involves who is attached to the film, including the director. They will need to have confidence that a strong competent director is attached to want to invest, regardless of how killer the script is.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Producers and investors look at the overall package, if it's a commercial package they will want to be convinced that the director is experienced enough, if it's a scheme type production with less commercial funders, they may take the risk if the writer/director can demonstrate they have a strong personal vision for their script. Not the copy and paste stuff from other films.

They also surround the director with experienced people, who ensure that director keeps on course and produces a film that can be cut together, It's unlikely the director will have the final cut.

I suspect that such a script has to be of a higher standard that Ryan is currently producing.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Well I was told to produce a professional writers script, one that will attract a lot, but where can I find these scripts without paying more than I can afford though? Or how do other filmmakers do it when acquiring their first killer script that investors and producers will want to fund, if the director is the one who owns the script?

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Lol I know. Maybe he’s taken my opposite advice... naaaah

This is why many of us don’t think you should make a feature film. First there is all the technical and creative stuff and then there is all this business related stuff. How do you get a good script, how to attract a skillful crew, how do you convince investors to give you money when you’ve never made a feature film... It’s a gigantic undertaking.

But yeah a good script would obviously be the first step in the right direction. I still think a smaller project would be the best choice.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Seconded. Thirded. Seventhed.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Well I am still doing short films in the meantime but still have a goal to do a feature and would still like to search for good scripts though. I am just worried that if I spend so much money on the script, that I might not be able to attract funding for it after, to make the feature, compared to having a script that was free, and I can then use the money to make the movie, instead of buying the script.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Before getting involved in all of this Ryan should do some reading on the business side of making films and the process of development, since it appears he doesn't know much about it. Again, there are books on the subject and if he doesn't want to into that method I expect there are online sites that will give the basics.

It's something that most film courses don't cover and a forum isn't the place to go into those details, because at some point it involves lawyers, assignment contracts and more paperwork than can be found in the script itself.

At the moment, your feature current film budget is on the lower end of the development cost scale for a feature film. If you write the script you hold the rights, if someone else writes the script, agreements have to be in place for their writing fees etc, otherwise they will still hold the rights. All these things need to be in place otherwise you won't get distribution.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Sure I can read more books on it.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Well I talked to a DP, and he says that if we are shooting in locations where we cannot control the background colors, to shoot in monochrome, or make a color tinted movie, where a scene is only one color, like those old silent films use to be. Or just shoot black and white.

What do you think? Would a color tinted movie, decrease the marketability of the movie after?

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

If the colour is of such major concern, pure black and white would be the way to go. However, unless it's a conscious style decision and is integral to the whole film and how the story is told, I would stay with colour. It's a lot easier to market a contemporary story in colour.

The colour of walls isn't key to your story, it may be in your head, but it's secondary when selling your film.

There are some B & W films being shot, but they are more art house in nature than genre thrillers. You would need to set it in the 1920s to justify tinting a film.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Yeah that's exactly what I was thinking. My story is a straight up crime thriller, set in a modern setting, so not sure if black and white or color tinting is the way to go. As long as most audience members do not find uncontrolled color in the backgrounds distracting, like some filmmakers might.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

An audience only worries about what it sees, not what doesn't exist. Unrealistic looking rooms with coloured lighting on the walls is going to distract more than the walls being white. Just keep the light off the white walls as much as possible and they should look pretty oppressive.

I'm surprised you're even asking this, for a director it should be a few seconds of thought before rejecting it. You're not making "The Last Picture Show".

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Well it's just I want to find a creative solution but it seems that so many creative solutions are not good. Like lighting the walls, out, black and white, out.

So should I just embrace the locations being problematic, rather than trying to come up with ways to fix it then?

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

If you're making a realistic crime thriller the creativity is in the interaction between the characters, not the colour of the walls. You don't want the police station to look like at seedy dance hall.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

That's true, it's just when I showed past work to other filmmakers, they found certain aspects of the background distracting that could not be controlled. As long as different lighting will help. But I was also told my story is has a bit of a comic-bookish tone, so maybe being a bit theatrical with the background decisions won't hurt, and I shouldn't have it totally realistic and maybe a bit of surrealism is called for, or at least I was told that by a couple who read the script. Not a realistic crime thriller, but a crime thriller set in mordern times, with more of a comic bookish tone, or at least that is what I was told.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Ok heres the thing...youre not making movies for other filmmakers, youre making them for regular people who dont know crap about filmmaking and cinematography and color theory etc. When filmmakers tell you all this stuff, they notice this stuff because thats what they do. “Audiences” are highly unlikely to notice green cars, the color of the walls or many of the things you are absolutely obsessed with unless you take it way over the top (making the entire movie bright pink or something). I guarantee you they WILL notice the quality of the acting, story plotting, and possibly writing. Seriously focus your energies/obsessions on that. Let all this other stuff come way later.

Also I though we decided to abandon crime thriller and find a better script?

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Ryan you seem too concerned with the superficial and go over the top with everything to put your stamp on it. Concentrate on the basics just tell the story well don’t force things. It’s a bit like sports if you prepare and practice then execute during the game the results will take care of themselves. It is important to be aware of your background but often it only needs to be tweaked, different angle, shallow dof, light the subject so the background is darker. These are tweaks. Like acting when done well doesn’t draw attention to itself it’s natural.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Right. At this stage all your questions should be about writing/plot/character and directing actors.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Oh okay. Well I talked to some others and they said that I should continue working on the same script as well, and still look for other scripts in the process, which I am also doing. I was also asked to co-direct another project, but if that project doesn't get funding, or I cannot find a better script to afford myself, I was still planning on this one either way. But I was told by others that I should stick to the crime thriller genre, since they said I would do better in that genre, directing style wise, if that's true.

As for why I haven't asked questions about directing actors and things like that, this site seemed more geared towards the cinematography and technical side of things, which is why I was asking those kinds of questions more so. But I thought I had to worry about that too, and not just acting and writing only.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

The color of wall is inconsequential compared to other aspects like the acting.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Thats true, this is a more tech oriented forum but I’m sure there are writing/directing oriented message boards out there too...are you posting the same amount of those types of questions on there as you are technical stuff on here?

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

You should know the type of story you're writing, if it's got a comic book style, that's very different to a crime thriller. A stylised comic book film is going to cost more in art direction/lighting than a realistic crime thriller.

Getting good performances in good, simple locations, with a well written script is the most you can hope for and that is tough enough.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

If you are using good actors, the people get immersed in the story.If they distract, they look for other things. you are NOT thinking like a movie consumer.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Well the script is not high budget like a comic book, but I was told it was in it's tone though.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Is that what you INTENDED? Is that the movie you want to make? If not you should change it.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Oh well it's just I was told by some that the villains are comic-bookish in their criminal motives, and I should make them more realistic. But then others who read it told me that that's okay, and there is nothing wrong with that kind of tone.

So intended the script to be what it is, whether it's realistic, or a comic, or whichever. Perhaps I don't know the name of the exact genre, but I know what I intended in terms of story.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

The villains can be comic bookish in their motives, a whole range of such characters exist in films, It's how interesting they are and if they're doing good - in their own eyes.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Oh okay, so maybe it's not a realistic crime thriller if they are comic book-ish in their motives then...

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

An article on deep focus and thoughts on a possible return.

https://www.redsharknews.com/product...t-the-only-way

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Thanks for sharing. A welcome respite from having to hear about breaking the you know what rule.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Oh okay thanks. I don't have to do the project in deep focus, it's just that I thought it would look better to have three characters for example all in focus while talking instead of just one at a time, and taking turns wrack focusing.

Unless taking turns wrack focusing is better, if the locations do not have the most cinematic backgrounds?

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

I literally just finished watching Unsane, which is a 2018 horror-adjacent movie shot on a freakin’ iPhone. The cinematography is cool as hell and there is not a single shallow focus shot to be found. Deep focus can look fantastic. They did what they did with blocking, angle choice, color, lighting and location/set design.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Oh okay thanks, I will check that one out. Since I am not allowed to paint locations normally, I thought I would just color grade them in Da Vinci and use the qualifier to separate the skin tones, like tutorials show. But every time I try to separate the skin tones, there is more noise on the footage, cause I keep failing to get it to separate correctly it seems. Is it possible to do this in Da Vinci resolve? Cause if I could control the color of the backgrounds, it will look better for deep focus of course.

I watched the trailer for Unsane. The deep focus looks good in wide shots, but I wouldn't want it in close ups. If it's a close up of just one actor who need to be in focus I might as well make the background shallow and only have deep focus on wider shots with multiple actors in them I figure, if that's a good idea?

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

That choice is up to up you; but deep focus works with CUs as well, however, you have to think about the cheacters' relationships, framing etc. You don't need a shallow depth of field to direct attention, as you would in a still photograph, since there is movement etc in a film

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Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Oh well it's just I guess I am worried it's a toss up. One the hand a lot of filmmakers and some cinematographers think that deep focus looks like 'home video', or at least they do based on conversations in the past.

On the flip side of that, master shots with more than one person in might look bad, if it keeps wrack focusing from person to person rather than allowing to the viewer to look at who they choose. So I thought maybe it was best to compromise and have deep focus for the wide shots, and shallow focus for the close ups. But it was just a thought.

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Deep focus will look like home movies if you make a film that's shot like a home movie,

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

Okay got ya. So what is the advantage of deep focus in a CU, of just one actor then?

Re: Why do a lot of filmmakers seem to hate deep focus cinematography?
 

it will match in more if the rest of the film is deep focus, however, you do need to think more about the background and what it's saying about the character.