Give it up, Allan.
 

You've been around playing with the Japanese toys---some of it doesn't even the North American shelves. So I'm asking, what's your favourite hand-held, or the one you think is best overall? Huh? Come on..., give it up.

Single chippers: I haven't seen anything better than the Optura100 (in terms of video quality).

JVC color is too flat for my taste. Sony is too bluish and/or yellowish for my taste.

HD1 DOESN'T turn me on (no matter what the experts say).

For 3-CCDs, GS100K (the black beauty), XV2 (the black GL2). I do not consider the 2 to be of same level, but I would very much love to have both.

What about you Frank?

Allan,
So are you saying that in your opinion, the GL2 is a good alternative to the GS100K ?

Nick

Actually, it's the other way around for me.

The GL2 is my dream cam, but may be an overkill for my application. For the most part, I'm just an ordinary home video guy, although I want the best video quality that the wife will give consent to buying.

Allen- The trick is, to get the go ahead on a lower model. Then, go shopping WITHOUT the wife, and buy what you wanted originally. When you get home, tell her they were out of the lower model, but you got THIS for just a bit more...

She'll be miffed, and you'll sleep on the couch for a while. But she will forgive you eventually... sort of. You WILL hear about this, and many other things, for years to come. But, you get what you want!

All of this works really well if you have a very comfy couch. If not, you may want to get that first :)

Great advise Keith. Our sofa bed is very comfortable so I should be ready in case.

But actually, we are a family of shooters, including my soon to be 10-year old daughter (otherwise, I will never be able to appear in our home videos), so I have to consider that as well. Until she grows big enough to handle poker cams weighing more than 1.2 kgs, I think I should stick with more compact and well balanced ones...she has no problem at all with our Optura100, and she handles the GS100 very well. YES, they allow kids to play with cams in Jap stores.

Cheers

To sum it up,

GS 100K -S OR B tops overall for an average consumer with affordable budget.

Sam

Allan, my 2 favourite 3-chip hand-helds are the GL2 and PV-DV953. But if I could see a GS100, and have it in my hands, I would probably replace the 953 with the GS100. I also prefer black, but neither the GL2 nor the DV953 are black in North America. That's shameful. Canon and Pana should be flogged.

My favourite 1 chip hand-helds are the PV-DV852/MX1000/MX8 (N.A/Jap./PAL) and Optura 100MC. But I found the 852 a bit pokerish and the 100MC difficult to hold. For ergonomics, I like the Optura, Optura PI and JVC DVL9500. But for the most part I think the 100MC and 852 will take their rightful places in the history books. :)

Sofa bed?!? Man I need to get one of those!

I found the GS100K to be pretty noisy looking, especially in the chroma.

For the money and for what you want it for, I would try to get my hands on a new (if possible) or demo or used (and well-maintained with low hours) SONY TRV-900 over that Panny GS100K. You'll get MUCH better looking pix than what those GS100K 1/6" CCD's can output. You will probably pay less too and have some dough left over for a BeachTek and a Wide Angle adaptor. Heck, even a used GL1 would produce sweeter pix and cost you less.

Sheesh, spend a little more than that $1500 and get the SONY PDX-10. An associate of mine owns one and he swears by it. He uses it for all of his documentary work and it does look good. He showed me some footage and also let me look through the lens in a hotel ballroom and you know, I was impressed. 1/4" CCD's - forget about using 1/6" CCD's for your application. 1/6" CCD's are low end. And surprisingly, the PDX-10 even gives you *true* 16:9, not electronically-interpolated 16:9 like all of the other cams in this price range. Built-in XLR too.

Of course, the GL2 is even more affordable than before with Canon's $250 rebate. And you know that the GL2 is one heck-of-a-sweet camcorder with a full 30fps Frame Mode, a 58mm flourite-coated Canon L lens with a full 20X optical zoom (and not just a boring 12X zoom), ClearScan, 1.7mp progressive-scan capture imaging with SD card, image preset control including a fully-sweepable Black Level control, advanced accessory shoe, LANC control and full AVC implementation.

IMHO you are short-changing yourself with the 1/6" CCD's of the GS100K for $1500.

Just my $.02,

- don

I don't know, Don. The MX3000 (& 350/PAL) has better playback footage than the TRV900. And the 953/MX5 footage is even cleaner with even higher resolution. The color saturation is richer with these Panas also. I played with the 953 several times now, and I would say it's a better cam than the TRV900---except perhaps in 2 areas: the TRV900 has the lower manual shutter settings and it is better in lower light. If someone walked up to me with these 2 cams and said, "here, Frank, pick one," it would be a no brainer for me. But if you need a cam with better "low light," I'd pick neither and snag a VX2000 instead (no brainer). :)


PS: depending on that time of the month (when I run out of coffee), I might say, "the hell with all of them," and go with a GL2 instead. (Too bad the black mamba GL2 is only available in Japan...like with Red Rose Tea being only available in Canada, or so they say.) On the other hand, if some bum gave me a TRV900, I'd say, "Thank you, sir. You are a gentleman." :)



-----------------------------
It's all Gothic to me.

Don,

The net cost of the GS100 is less than $1,100 (if you live or visit Japan).

Oh yes, the August edition of Video Salon (a Jap magazine) contains a review of the GS100K-K. Screenshot of widemode is pretty nice!

What is the difference between the black GL2, and the regular US model?

The bottm line is the colour and the fact that all controls and menus are in Japanese. Over here it's called the XV2 and uses NTSC J which is as far as I can tell the same as the NTSC used in the States.

The Broacast system in Japan is NTSC but ever so slightly different; a NTSC cam is a NTSC cam is a NTSC cam---they're all the same.

Would the difference be Japan using 0 IRE instead of 7?

NTSC J and NTSC USA

The color system and broadcast system are the same but the channel system (frequency) differs.

Is the black mamba a deep black or a dull black? Or let me put it another way: is it black as sin or is it the color of 2nd grade coal? :)

Except for the surface where the Pany label is attached, the focus ring and the area around the hood opening, everything is ordinary black (not as deep as the dark side of the force).

Thanks Allan. So it's not as black as black could be. Darn. Oh, well.

Mmmmm, the latest Opturas has just been announced. The horizontal one looks very very interesting:

1/3.4" 2.2 MP CCD (1.23MP effective)
High Quality Wide mode (1.50MP effective)
DIGIC Technology
11x Optical Zoom
RGB Color Filter that is supposed to approximate 3-CCD performance
Manual Audio Control
Zebra Pattern
3.5" 246K resolution LCD
High Quality Canon Lens (F1.6 - F1.9)
Custom Key
Manual Focus Ring

I've got to read more about manual settings...there's a lot below 1/60. It says that under TV mode (shutter speed priority), shutter speed can be set 1/8, 1/15, 1/30, 1/60 up to 1/8000. Holy cow!

I'm very excited. Looks like a challenger to the Pany dynasty.

Sorry don't know where to post this.. now back to Pany cams.

Regards

Wow 1.50MP widescreen mode on the new Optura! Thats more pixels than the lame JVC HD cam.

Can't wait until 2008 when North America gets it! :)

Do you have a link with pics of these new Optura cams? (Any black ones?) =:+)

Here is the Canon site

http://www.canondv.com/optura300/optura300_flash.html

No frame mode, no 3CCD. Not sure if there is implicit zoom/scaling in 16:9 mode. On the positive side, its in English!

The Optura was my first choice replacement camcorder and Canon has always been my preferred brand until the GS100K came out because a) I wanted 3CCD, frame mode and good anamorphic, and b) Canon has been lame in announcing new models and product plans.

Here is another mention
http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content...t-07_29_03.htm

Also note that a comment posted states that the RGB filtering is similar to the original Elura. Not sure if that is accurate but I have the original Elura and its color is definitely superior to later Eluras. I have had the pleasure of combining footage from my orignial Elura with footage from the newer Elura and a JVC cam. And my Elura always has brighter colors - which is why I love my ol'Elura.

Methinks
 

Canon and Sony are about ready to start firing back. They have flagships (XL1s) and (PD-150) and second level cams that are long overdue for upgrades. Prepare for 16x9 everything.

yah!

Just when you think all things are gonna get better:

IXY DV M2 (Optura300): Min lux req't under Auto Mode: 24; EIS

FV M1 (Optura Xi): Min lux req't under Auto Mode: 22

Canon should have the HAD

Hopefully, what I'm looking at are mere typos (but not likely), or, the US versions would be better.

I'm getting more convinced that low light performance is more a function of pixel density rather than CCD size.

>>>>I'm getting more convinced that low light performance is more a function of pixel density rather than CCD size.

- Pixel density is part of the equation. It's the size of the actual pixel(s) used that affect low light sensitivity. In theory, a larger pixel will have a greater sensitivity to low light than a smaller pixel. Hence, a small megapixel CCD packed with a million or so effective pixels will have a greater "pixel density" compared to the same size CCD packed with fewer and larger pixels. Technically, the latter CCD will have the potential to peform better in low light situations.

This will probably change as manufacturers begin to introduce cleaner, more sophisticated gain circuitry into the cameras to compensate for small pixel size.

- don