Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

If it weren't for the reason you mentioned about the size/weight of the cameras starting to become an issue then I would say stick with the EA50s for another season since we are in a transition period due to 4K and I believe that will affect HD camera offerings. Sony is rolling out new cameras already. As the manufacturers move to force 4K down our throats 1080P options will continue to get better. So this time next year there should be better cameras at a better value.....if you don't mind using the EA50s another season. :)

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Thanks David and Steve

(I was hoping Steve would chip in!) That is a good idea actually! I never thought about VG30's light enough not to kill my back and matches the EA50 perfectly ... Funnily I'm quite happy to keep one EA-50 that I designate as my A-Cam ..it's on tripod for ceremony and speeches so that doesn't give me any back issues! It's the bugger on my shoulder that I need to change ...pop on the big Sigma and I'm already at nearly 5lbs on my shoulder and holding that up half the night is the killer ... I think Pete Rush is a lot younger than me and he complains too so it's no just me!!

Gotta take a look on eBay and see what VG30's are on offer. More options to look at ..I have just one EA-50 on eBay at the moment so it's highly likely I might just use one for A-Cam usage and a lighter one as my B-Cam

UPDATE: Woah!! I think I need to move to the USA! VG30's here retail for nearly $3000!! There was one used one for $2,0000 ...In the sub-$1000 category the best you can get is maybe a VG10 camera ...That sadly comes with the same stock lens as the EA-50 (well, 18-200 without the power zoom!) so that isn't going to perform any better than the EA-50 ..just a smaller body really but to work in low light I would be back to using the Sigma 18-35 F1.8 which weighs more than the camera by a LOT!!

Chris

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Chris,

Hold on...it is e-bay. The prices go all over the map. They are always on there used for more than the NEW retail price. I don't know why? Body only there is two of them here for less than a grand and the e-bay "trending price" is listed at $1,049.00. I see them for 800/900 all the time. They will pop up for a reasonable price for you.

I think it is weird that B&H still has them new AND at about the same price as an EA50!

Steve

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Thanks Steve

I still cannot see any "advantage" using a VG30 body sadly ..OK it weighs a lot less than a EA-50 body but really the difference is minimal as it's only plastic and electronics in there. The big issue for me is that to do wedding receptions the EA-50 "bits and pieces" still need a F1.8 zoom to be practical and not use a video light ..that's what is causing the problem for me ..it's the darn lens that adds the BIG weight ...an EA-50 body only is half the weight you need to carry .. the fast lens up front is the other half and it's all hanging off the front too ... no issues if you are on tripod but receptions are 90% handheld and 2lbs of lens hanging from the front of a relatively light body is what kills your arms and back! Using my EA-50 for ceremonies and speeches is a piece of cake ..no stress and no stain as it's always on a tripod ... it's the hand held stuff that's killing me ....I wonder who makes an F1.4 zoom that only weighs 200 grams ???

Chris

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Did you not have a suspension rod that attached to a belt? I thought that took all the weight from your hands?
You say you need a f1.8 zoom for practical reasons not to use a light, why do yo think the f2.8 to f4.0 from the fz1000 will be ok to use instead? I take it you plan to go back to using a videolight then?

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Hi Noa

Yep I have it but as you found the EA-50 is still very bulky ... I wasn't even considering the FZ1000 for receptions ... The only light weight camera for that scenario is the A7S I guess?? I'm simply trying to downsize and the operative word is "SIZE"

Still looking at options and suggestions

Chris

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

You said before that you even found the gh4 too expensive so that should rule out that a7s as that will be even more expensive coupled with a good stabilized zoomlens.

If I was you and had to re-invest into entirely new camera's I"d get a sony ax100 (or a x70 with 4k option if I needed the xlr) and a sony a7s with one f4.0 good wide to tele stabilised zoomlens and then I"d get a sony a6000 with a fixed fast wideangle lens for my steadicam. The a6000 has impressive autofocus which can be very usable in certain situations. I'd then get a Nebula alike handheld stabilizer (which function a lot better then the feiyu type stabilisers) and fit all that in one backpack.

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Thanks Noa

That's worth a look at!! At this stage I still have both cameras so they are going nowhere in the immediate future as I cannot take the risk of selling them off and ending up with not enough to replace them. I have to work it so I can purchase new gear and still keep the old stuff just in case my decision was a bad one!

Being my income I have to have immediate access to gear as I could get a shoot tomorrow for all I know!

So far I haven't found anything that will give me the same results both inside and outside and allow me to have a lighter load (without some serious expenditure) so I'm still looking !!! I really do need a nice fast lens for receptions though that doesn't weigh a ton .... did you ever shoot 25P and 1/25th shutter on yours ..the extra gain in that mode could enable me to use something like an F2.8 prime instead of the heavy F1.8 which would help a lot!!

Chris

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

How can I move smoothly in 25p?
logically at a higher speed should have been move smoothly but do not do it why?
it will definitely be with 25p or 30p

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Chris, have you considered a camcorder with built in zoom lens, say the Canon XA20? F1.8-2.8 20X lens, camcorder format and XLR audio inputs. No lenses to change and balance stays the same whatever focal length you are using.

Just a thought.

Dave

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Hi Serggio

How do you know that video was shot at 25P?? Even 25P will still handle motion reasonably well
If you look really carefully you can see a tiny bit of blur on the car closeups.

Are you talking about the subject moving or you moving??

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Thanks Dave

Simple answer here .. I don't like Canon ... dunno why but their video cameras do nothing for me and they are overpriced. That camcorder also is a handheld off the tripod so one is likely to get wobbles at weddings.

I'm not asking too much from my EA-50's I just want an awesome F1.4 zoom up front that weighs in at 200 grams not nearly 1000 grams.

Any reading Serggio's post above I get get a stack more light into the camera shooting at 1/25 instead of 1/50 plus IF I can find a speedbooster that does Nikon to e-Mount I could easily get away with an F2.8 lens which is half the weight of my Sigma and the balance might be restored.

This entire "changeover" might not even happen this season as I am getting shoot requests now for next month and I cannot afford to be playing around with new gear when I have work to do ... so it might go on hold until next Winter ... no big deal but I still might treat myself to an FZ1000 and play with that in conjunction with the Sony's ... Haven't found anything really that could be classed as an easy replacement and stay within my budget.

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

chris
no offense
probably did not know to stand out in video 25p and 50p see the rims of cars that spin,is 25p or 30p
If the camera you have succeeded in entering the same as in the video 50p to buy your camera
this video is NOT 50p is 25p or 30p I bet about that
and most importantly there is no trace of moire and aliasing
I saw this video, I bought the camera,but others the shows the Sony and another sells
why does not answer the Sony how lens and rec mode speed etc. is this video

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Hi Serggio

Have you tried some footage shot at 25P? Is there a problem???

I have used 25P which defaults the shutter to 1/25th and apart from some blur if you pan too fast I didn't see any problems at all??

Chris

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Chris, there are a couple things you should know about the FZ1000 if you are considering this cam.

1) The stabilization does not work well in 4K. I originally thought with mine that stabilazation was not
available in 4K but was told by someone on another forum that it was. Either way I don't find it helpful.

2) The manual focus ring needs to be turned at such a speed as to make acquiring focus smoothly and quickly difficult. By having to turn the ring at a speed fast enough to engage one tends to overshoot. AF is very fast and accurate but doesn't hold well. With even small movement in the frame it loses and re-acquires.

3) With that heavy lens hanging out there on a small body the cam is very poorly balanced which for me
makes the cam difficult to use handheld combined with the other two issues.

I pre-ordered my cam so have one of the early ones which was made in Japan. The new ones are made in
China if this is a concern for you. Maybe these issues have been addressed in newer models.

Having said all that I really like the cam and actually use it more than my GH4. Great burst rate, excellent
time laspe, good video images, good slow motion. Either or both stabilization/AF very noisy (much more so than the FZ200) so off cam mic a necessity.

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Thanks so much Tom

Roger has already ordered one so he will appreciate this advice too ..he is upgrading from his FZ200!

The China thing is a bit worrying ..I used Panny cameras for 25 years until they switched to China with the AC series and were complete rubbish compared to the Japanese made ones .. I sold my AC-130's after 3 months ..hopefully things have improved.

Roger gave me a manual and yes that mentions operation noise as well as limit to OIS at 4K

I'm sticking with my Sony's for now BUT I want an FZ1000 for my stedicam ..at present I shoot on the Sony and then slow down in post ..doing it in slo mo will be awesome!!

Chris

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Hi Chris
I got the answer for video
The frame rate IS 24fps with Nikon Lens 70-300 -50-and 35 without any picture profile

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Hi Serggio

So what you are saying is you get no moire or aliasing if you shoot in 24P?? I thought that was a sensor issue rather than a frame rate issue?

If it works for you the by all means shoot in 24/24p but just remember the shutter will default to 1/25 not 1/50 so you will get a bit of blur with the slower shutter if you move the camera too fast.

I still shoot with the profile very flat (PP3) as the "no profile" will push the black level way too much ..Guys in black suits end up with no detail at all so it's better to keep the detail and then add a colour curve in post.

Chris

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Am I the only one here that doesn't understand what Serggio is trying to say? :) Not sure what the framerate/shutter, pictureprofile or lens used in that video has to do with Chris his question what replacement camera's to get?

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

I will keep the ea50 on a tripod for static shots with 25p will simultaneously shoot a Canon 5d mark ii (I want to go to Canon 6D) have gh3 and think about buying a more gh4 or Sony A7s

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Hi Noa

Don't worry I have no idea either.. I'm guessing so I suspect it's a language barrier and Serggio speaks better English than I speak his language ... From what I have fathomed out so far is that the sample video he inserted a few posts up done by Sony had no moire and no aliasing in it and Sony didn't say what format it was shot in so he is figuring that the reason must be the format ...he found out later it was shot in 24Pand has now posted that he will use 25P on the EA50 combined with various other cameras including a 5D, GH3 and then maybe a 6D and GH4 and Sony A7 ... Sounds very complicated ! There is another post in my Profiles and Colour Curves one too .. dunno why

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Chris Thank you for the correction does not speak very well English
my another post in (Colour Curves and Pricture Profiles) there was a mistake apologize.

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Hi Serggio

I cannot speak your language at all so you are doing great!! If you are shooting at 25P just remember that in low light the shutter will change to 1/25th not 1/50th so be careful with fast pans in this mode. 25P does also give you the advantage of better low light with the slower shutter ...in 50P a scenario that needs 15db gain at 1/50th only needs 9db at 1/25th so you halve the ISO required.

Chris

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Thank you Chris use manual shutter speed 1/50 with 12db with PP3 I have not tried to 1/25

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

If you shoot in full auto 25P will default to 1/25th automatically until the gain drops below zero then it will change to 1/50th ....1/25th indoors needs a 6db gain decrease so at higher levels you get less noise!!

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

No you're not! And nothing as far as I can see

Dave

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Ok back to the original post now since Serggio has been sorted out!

Stage two will swing into action over this weekend .. I will put the first EA-50 body up for sale over the weekend ... and then see what happens ...the plan is to drop one of the EA-50 bodies first and get a FZ1000 .... if I use this one as an A-Cam what I will do is pop it into a cage so it gives me someone to mount a mic and receivers and I'll also add one of the new DSLR style Beachtek XLR units to sort my audio gear and to also overcome the fact that you cannot adjust audio levels while recording.

I think that something simple like a Rode VM Pro on the hotshoe should be good enough.

With regards to selling I figured that splitting the body and lenses and any other bits and pieces would keep the newbies away so only genuine videographers will consider it! Is that wrong or right or would you sell it as a ready to use setup with a lens??

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

IMHO. You already sold your kit lens. It is not a ready to go camera no matter what you do. Selling it with a dumb adapter and a nikon or after market lens is not going to add much value. You need a buyer that knows and wants an EA50.

Steve

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Hi Steve

Both actually so I will get a better result as a body only .. the FS100 and FS700 can be purchased as body only cameras but not the EA-50 ... I'll see if I can get someone who already has lenses (either e-mount or Nikon) A complete stock standard camera tends to attract amateurs who think a pro camera is going to make them experts ...I would prefer to sell to a videographer/photog who knows what is involved. Extra Nikon lenses are easy to sell on eBay !! Tons of wannabe photogs out there!!

A while back on eBay I wasn't using my rails and follow focus and you wouldn't believe how many people wanted to know what it did and will it automatically focus my DSLR ... trying to avoid those sort of people!

Chris

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

deleted, for good sense

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Aw Steve

You know you cannot upset me and I know how much you love your cameras too so if you want to yell at me... I'm tough and can take it!! They are still awesome cameras I know but I need a change... who knows? they might not sell and I'll stay with them!!

Pete Rush seems to be getting old too! He is doing a downsize as well as it's really a lot of gear to lug around at wedding venues !!! With your more commercial shoots you don't have the pain of running up and down stairs with all the gear. If I was doing controlled commercial shoots I wouldn't change a thing.

Chris

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

haha, common Steve, don't hold back, we all appreciate your brutal honest opinion :)

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Hi Noa

It might be brutal but Steve and I have shared many heated discussions on the forum so I'm sure if anything is said on impulse we will forgive each other.

OK, there is another reason I want to drop the Sony's and that is my weddings shot 2 years ago on my cheap Panasonic HMC82's with it's tiny 1/4" chips to me looks a lot better than my EA-50 footage ...I have used Sony lenses, Sigma lenses and Nikon lenses on both cameras yet the footage still doesn't shine like my Panasonic's shooting 50i at 17mbps .... I'm sure it's a technical thing or might be a picture profile thing but my weddings did drop off in overall quality with the Sony's ... I have no idea why and the footage is sharp plus the EA-50 is a delight to use and has everything that opens and shuts BUT my wedding footage still looks better on the older cameras.

I have never been able to figure out why but that's the sad story! Any commercial shoot I have done however has been pristine and clients loved it ...maybe it's just not a wedding camera but better suited to commercial work??

Chris

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Hi Chris,

I love the look of my weddings from my little Panasonic's, which is why I have kept them for so long and why I will continue down a similar replacement route starting with the FX1000.

Roger

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

I think it's a camera that needs a little nursing to get the best out of it and a fast paced wedding doesn't give us the time to do it - when I use it for an afternoon reception and have a few hours to get guests relaxing and having their photos taken etc it shines, but when I'm using it for the guests all arriving at once etc or the mad and badly lit evening reception I struggle as I'm sure the camera can cope, but I don't have the time to coax it to get the best out of it (am I making sense here?)

Also I think we all are pretty much using it with manual lenses where focus is concerned and whatever anyone says - in a fast paced wedding event autofocus has it's place! If the kit lens had been f2.8 constant it might be a different story.

I'm now looking at using my A7s with a nice Ziess zoom as my main camera of choice - but for next season.

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Very true Pete

I did an all day shoot on a school promo and it was brilliant as I had lots of time and my choices of camera positions too ... 90% was on stedicam so I could go where the light was good ..That doesn't happen at a wedding ..Yeah my receptions are better as well ...also the controlled light helps ..with ceremonies you are placed often in the far from ideal places!!

Even if you don't have AF running you can still half press the shutter on the A7S surely to grab focus?? That's more accurate and quicker than trying to get focus and also toggling the magnify function at the same time. Whatever I have done, the EA-50 has never given me really sharp outdoor footage but that's probably me not the camera!!

Chris

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Interesting comments Chris and reinforces what I always feel. I want to be able to leap straight in and grab a shot as soon as I see it, without having to worry about whether the camera is in focus the exposure is right or if I have to change the lens. I am not embarrassed to say that I use auto focus and exposure a lot of the time providing it is giving me exactly what I want.

My attention needs to be on the day not whether the equipment is functioning correctly or not, so total trust in my gear is paramount.

Roger

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Brides notice that too! I was on a wedding forum and when asked about her shoot she replied "the guy spent more time fiddling with his frigging camera than doing his job I paid him to do" If something good happens you need to be on it in a flash ... Back on the FZ1000 I notice it's startup time is a mere 0.9 seconds which is great when you are caught unwares ! I have often spotted the limo coming around the corner and turned on my camera and by the time it's ready to record the car has stopped ... lately I just leave it in standby otherwise it's easy to miss a shot!

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Perfect sense Peter :)

I took my RX10 with me just to give it a wee go at a wedding the other day.
I haven't had a good chance to use it at a wedding yet.
Anyway I was "futtering" with the ISO, white balance etc when the guests started coming into the reception room.
I decided to put it on full auto and let it record away on a light stand.
Nothing to loose, I was only experimenting with it anyway.
Boy was I wrong, the footage turned out great. and I was able to bang it into the timeline along with my other clips from the two other cameras.

Re: Time to Replace Cameras -where to now?
 

Hey Guys,

What I deleted was just a bad joke that could have been taken wrong. A couple of years ago Chris Hurd published an article I wrote about my career and i make fun of all of us with my satirical humor. But he has limits, and yes, I have been slapped on the keyboard a few times for both my bluntness and bad humor. To be clear on a few things: I don't need to yell at anyone here for anything. I do not fall in love with gear, cameras are just tools to me. I can not be insulted by what anyone says about the choices I make. What we each choose is and should be an important personal choice that meets are own needs. On this forum we are able to help each out by getting real word advice from each other from those who use what we may be considering. I think that is awesome.

Chris, You have said many times you have me pegged as an indoors shooter that works only from sticks. Yes I do work in ballrooms and I do shoot executive interviews and such. In reality I am an "event coverage" videographer to be more exact. What I shoot is not as far from a wedding as you may think. I shoot dark receptions from the shoulder, I shoot jeep tours in the desert, I have worked from horseback, on snowmobiles, from race cars, motorcycles, and watercraft. I have shot reality TV while suspended from a rope 200 feet off the ground for three hours. I worked for NASCAR auto racing for seven years covering a one mile oval track with both stills and video on foot or sometimes from a golf cart. Golf carts don't climb stadium stares : ) : ) :) Bottom line, I never know what I will be shooting next or how I will do it. Sorry, too much about ME.

Back on topic. You guys mentioned AF. Now that I have the Sony 18-105 F4 G lens for my EA50 I can tell you it finally made the EA50 what it should be. It follow focuses and is tack sharp. In fact it is so sharp and the image is so beautiful I can not match it with the old kit lenses. I have to match it with my canon L glass. The more I use it the more I like it. And being F4 instead of f2.8 like my Canons it is light and does not add all of that front weight the Canons do. It really is a dream lens for this camera.

I do not find the EA50 to be too heavy when I am shooting with it (most of the time). But all of the cases and bags and lenses and accessory's I deal with gets to be to much. I can load a truck. I know Noa can work out of a backpack and that blows me away! Here is what I don't get about your logic Chris. I think the ergonomics of the EA50 help save my train wrecked back because it is semi shoulder mount. If you go with a DSLR and just a lens I get it. But once "rigged" with audio, a light, and a cage, how is it going to help your back?

Steve