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-   -   Breach of Contract not Theft (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/taking-care-business/138484-breach-contract-not-theft.html)

Noel Lising November 26th, 2008 10:02 AM

Breach of Contract not Theft
 
Warning for those who rent out cameras. 3 weeks ago we rented 2 guys an EX3 /DSR350 and a bunch of lighting equipment, etc, etc amounting to $ 80K, they paid the rental cost but never returned the gear. We can't locate them, although we know their address, they have not been seen there for months.

We called the cops but they can't act on it because it is not a criminal case and we handed them the camera so basically they did not steal it. So apart from being vigilant please be aware of this for those in the business of renting cameras.

Colin McDonald November 26th, 2008 10:13 AM

Sorry to hear that. I imagine that the stuff is still somewhere relatively near you. Would there be any point in posting a pic and serial number of the camera in case any local guys could help? (Is that something we do on dvinfo?)

Richard Alvarez November 26th, 2008 10:19 AM

Ouch. That's a harsh situation. Most of my experience renting hig-end gear requires a credit check before I'm allowed to haul it out the door. Additionally, often I am required to place my credit card or a deposit for the value on 'hold' while it is in my hands.Might be worth ammending your rental agreements to reflect this practice.

Noel Lising November 26th, 2008 10:29 AM

I agree with the credit card deposit but they look so legit, and they have the brains not to cut off their phone service (again since we can leave messages, still breach of contract not theft).

Posting serial numbers is a good idea. I'll have it posted shortly.

Dylan Couper November 26th, 2008 10:41 AM

Ouch, that'll make me think twice.

I'd suggest talking to a collector, they might have some good tips for you. The longer this goes, the less chance there is of seeing your gear back.

Noel Lising November 26th, 2008 10:56 AM

Hi Dylan,

We hired a PI for this, we are still pursuing this ( trying to make this criminal instead of civil, I guess it's up to the PI to work his magic). Our rentals manager is pissed off big time.

Richard Alvarez November 26th, 2008 10:56 AM

Not sure what the laws are in Canada, but this just might pass from 'breach of contract' to 'FRAUD' - which IS a form of theft. Might want to chat with your local 'lawyers for the arts' council and get their opinion on how to proceed.

Shaun Roemich November 26th, 2008 11:00 AM

Noel: please post what you CAN and we'll keep an eye out. There's a bunch of EX series running around here now but not many 350s...

Jeff Harper November 26th, 2008 11:05 AM

I would create a ficticious job and set up a meeting.

On the other hand, if they lied on the contract at all I would suspect you could pursue "theft by deception" charges as well. In Ohio theft by deception can range from misdemeanor to felony depending on the value of that which was stolen.

Noel Lising November 26th, 2008 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Alvarez (Post 969307)
Not sure what the laws are in Canada, but this just might pass from 'breach of contract' to 'FRAUD' - which IS a form of theft. Might want to chat with your local 'lawyers for the arts' council and get their opinion on how to proceed.

Hi Richard,

We are looking into that angle. I think that's what the PI is working on right now.

Noel Lising November 26th, 2008 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaun Roemich (Post 969309)
Noel: please post what you CAN and we'll keep an eye out. There's a bunch of EX series running around here now but not many 350s...

Here you go Shaun, thanks for the heads-up

EX3- serial number 100513
And actually it was my mistake it was not dsr 350, it was 2 DSR570's serial numbers: 10350 and 10671

Thanks again.

Noel Lising November 26th, 2008 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Harper (Post 969311)
I would create a ficticious job and set up a meeting.

On the other hand, if they lied on the contract at all I would suspect you could pursue "theft by deception" charges as well. In Ohio theft by deception can range from misdemeanor to felony depending on the value of that which was stolen.

Hi Jeff,

They are not answering their phones right now. They did their homework. We checked security camera footage, we saw one guy doing the thumbs up to his accomplice after they made a credit card payment.

Anyway I'll keep you guys posted. I hope we nail the 2 thieves.

Vito DeFilippo November 26th, 2008 12:20 PM

That gotta be rough, Noel. I hope it all turns out well for you guys. Go get 'em!

Adam Reuter March 5th, 2009 12:28 AM

Any updates on this story?

Noel Lising March 5th, 2009 09:34 AM

Update
 
The cops have upgraded the charges to fraud. They have located the last known address of Ray Guiterrez and there is a warrant for his arrest. Prior to this he ripped off Rona using the same modus operandi carting away power tools.

It has been slow, the cop handling the case went on a 3 week vacation & the guy is nowhere to be found.

2008 has been a bad year for us in terms of theft, we lost 2 Christie HD 8Ks, Meyer Sound System, etc, etc totalling $ 800K in Montreal early 2008. The theives managed to pull our 5 ton truck & emptied the contents. There was neglince on our technicians side as well, they should have unloaded the gear but decided to just leave the trailer overnight ( but hey who would have thought they can tow a 5 ton truck parked in the hotel). We managed to save the show. Insurance company gave us a check after 6 months.


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