Speeding up SSDs
 

I formerly used the fastest HDD available, the Cheetah 15.7K SAS drives and switched to SSD drives. I'm am now using SanDisk Extreme II drives.

Disappointed in the poor performance while editing. When I hit "undo" during multicam editing the wait time is like 15 seconds or more. Playback is about same as before, it's only the undo thing that is lagging. I use undo a LOT while editing so this is a real inconvenience.

Any of you performance geniuses (Kim!) have recommendations on things I should check to see if my SSDs are being held back?

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

I don't think it is an SDD problem. What should happen when you use a feature the first time, is that the code that runs the feature should load from the SDD into system RAM (your NLE process' working set) where it gets executed. Unless memory is really tight, it won't be pushed out of the working set. Even if memory is tight, the stuff that gets pushed out is the stuff that was least recently used. If you are using the "undo" command a lot, it's almost certainly in your working set continuously.

Even if your system has to recall that undo code each and every time you use it, 15 seconds is an eternity (as you well note) to a computer. I suggest you start monitoring your process with the resource monitor to see if you can catch any spikes occurring anywhere in your system when you're using the undo command. I'm thinking in particular that you might have some paging going on (to a HDD maybe).

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Well Bruce, great minds think alike! At the time of writing I had just turned off paging, disabled cache flusing, disabled pre-fetch and superfetch.

I'll report back soon. Thanks for your suggestions.

I did try an undo command and it appeared about 50% faster, I'll do a reboot, keep editing and see what happens. I think your idea of the paging thing might be on target.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Since taking the above steps it's smidgen faster Bruce, still too much lag though.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Where are your temporary files (i.e. the "undo" files) located?

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

I'd recommend testing your SSD to see if it is performing normally.

Atto Disk Benchmark
ATTO Disk Benchmark Free Download

For your drive you should be seeing around 500MB/s read and write.

My only other thought is if you're using Windows XP, you will need to manually TRIM the SSD to restore any lost performance.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

@ Edward: I don't know, wherever they are at by default.

@ Jody, I don't use Softonic for downloads nor do I use Cnet or similar sites, but I appreciate the recommendation.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Hi Jeff.

I am sad you have some problems with your new SSD's.
I dont know how you have started the setup with your SSD's, but Iam going to describe my way to handle the installation of new disks to your system. This is the way I correctly do it, based on other users problems, and therefor I have never had any problems by my self so far.

Never clone your old HD to your new system SSD. Dont trust the manufactures software to do all the hard work for you. This is an easy way, but not an reliable way to do it.

You should format your new SSD, do an fresh install of Windows and reinstall all your applications/plugins one by one.

This is time consuming, but you will be pleased when you can editing nonstop, rather than trouble shooting time to time...

Remember, remove ALL your drives from the motherboard when installing Windows on your new SSD. Dont plug the SSD's and your HD's in to your motherboard until the installation of Windows is completely finished. Only your system disk (your SSD) should be plugged in when installing Windows.

There is some great benchmark apps for testing your SSD's, but it doesnt sound like that kind of a problem you are having. By the way, what operating system are you using Jeff? And do you use your SSD's in some kind of raid? Are you using any new generation motherboard? I dont remember how SSD's was inserted either, are all inserted to a 6gb/s port?
Normally like me, I have three 3gb/s ports and three 6gb/s ports... With the 6gb/s ports, you can use all of your SSD's write/read speed (500-600mb/s). If connected to the 3gb/s port, only half of it...
Maybe you have some extra controller installed?


And by the way, when stated that an SSD has an write/read speed of 500mb/s, that doesnt really apply "read" an videofile in various formats encoded in what know... The SSD have various read/write speed dependig on what kind of data it reads/writes. sometime it read some data x10 times slower. But again, I dont believe the problems originate from "slow speed" from your SSD, but either, it doesnt hurt checking their health.. Because I dont know your Windows version, be sure to set windows auto defrag to OFF.

Update me Jeff...

/Kim Olsson

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

if you have ist - intel storage technology / fast transfer, or similar, try uninstalling it....

my ssd system used to take as long as the old hd it replaced to boot up and do other ops. removed intel software and bingo, boots in under 30sec and programs load / work at lightning speed.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Thanks Kim. My installation was by the book, done it hundreds of times. I did not clone drive. I am using 6gb ports. Your advice was excellent but think I installed it properly.

I forgot I had HDTach. I installed it and benchmarked my OS drive is over 500 mbps, the other two SSDs are around 350. I think it's a controller issue, will have to rearrange things.

Leslie, good advice, I have Marvell Storage manager but my sytem boots up in like 10 seconds, but I'll unistall it. I am pretty sure I have it disabled anyway, but will double check.

Will report back!

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

You can download it from the official site:
Disk Benchmark | ATTO

Or use any number of benchmarking tools to get the same results.

TRIM may also be something to look into, depending on your OS:
http://lifehacker.com/5640971/check-...e-in-windows-7

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Jody, thanks for the link very nice!

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Not a problem.

I've had a similar issue in the past. If TRIM isn't enabled, your SSD performance will degrade over time.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Well, thanks everyone for your help.

Learned a couple of things. I have two sets of 6gb sata controllers, one set is clearly much faster than the other.

The drives run at rated speed, about 500 on one controller and about 350 on the other.

At any rate, the issue is definitely not SSD related. I'm looking at my overclock to see what's wrong there. I feel the issue is related to cpu usage and turbo boost. I thought had I have a constant overclock at 4.1, but I suspect now it's not so.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Jeff, you did not OC the fsb?
That will OC all aspect of your motherboard.

You just raised the multipler?

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Just so you know... alot of people have had slow speed on their
6gb/s marvell controller... just as you have. The Intel controller have never had any issues. Be sure to use your intel controller to the ssd's you want the best speed. And the marvell to the HD's, dvd and maybe if you have many ssd you can use it but at half the speed which many states it only give...
Somehow the 6gb/s marvell is only running in 3gb/s. (maximum 350mb/s)

Check your motherboards manual to see what kind of 6gb/s ports you have so you can locate where they are placed. I use my three intel controller to my systemdisk, scratch disk and media disk. They are indeed reliable.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Thanks Kim. I tested the dirves on the different controllers and I have moved my two video file drives to the faster controllers. In my case the Marvell are slower, strangely.

I have three sets of controllers. The first set of Intel 6GB ports are the fastest by far, according to my tests. Then there are two 3gb ports, then there is the set of two Marvell 6gb ports, and they are slower than the Intel by 150mbps.

Has not resolved my issue but at least I know the video drives are on the fastest controllers!

Now if I can figure out why I lose my overclock when I disable Turbo Boost on my MB I'll be set.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Jeff, open Vegas, go to File - Properties, and change the temporary folder. Make sure you check to box to make this the default for all new projects. By default, it is inside "My Documents" which is probably the worst place it can be. Before you change it, make note of where it is so that you can check that folder and remove all the temp files there.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Thanks much Edward, I'll try it!

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Tried it Edward, no change. I am sorry, I should have specified it only happens with Ultimate S multicamera undo action. I switch cameras as it plays and very often see it was a mistake so I stop and hit undo and then the wheel spins. This did not seem to happen in the past except when I used slow hard drives. This is really adding time to my workflow.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Jeff, why would you like to disable turbo boost?

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Kim, I would prefer a constant, set cpu speed rather than variable. It seems with my MOBO very difficult to achieve an overclock without Turbo Boost.

It might be of no benefit to disable Turbo Boost, but I would like the option and to try it. When I disable Turbo Boost on my mobo I lose my overclock, it's very weird. When I go to set up the overclock again then Turbo Boost is automatically reactivated. It's just a control issue of mine, I guess!

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

When your CPU is given instructions, it will use it full power when turbo boost is activated. But as soon you are in idle, it will clock down to save on your electric bill and also give it a longer lifetime...
Your CPU cooler will also need to run full at power constant to cool it down, which gives your more noise 24/7 and also a shorter lifespan on the cooler itself.
Having the function turbo boost activated, does not neglect the full speed of your CPU you want, when you really need it.

A question: How did you OC you system Jeff? Did you OC in your BIOS? or did you use your motherboard software to OC it?

Have you find any solution on your wait time when editing?

you stated the problem occur when using "Ultimate S multicamera undo action"...
That for me sounds like the software is the reason for the problem. I never used Ultimate S, but I guess its a plug-in for Vegas...
Have you tried doing something similar in Vegas without the plugin?
Sorry if I ask you a question you might not can do likewise, but as I said, I dont really know how Ultimate S is working.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Kim, OC in BIOS using settings.

The software is certainly most of the issue, but with slower hard drives or processor speed it is much worse. I have experienced the issue while using many different hard drives and CPUs so I know the faster my system the less the issue it.

I have asked Vasst about the cause a couple of years ago and I did not get a response. They have always been great with support, but on this issue they did not respond.

I think I just might go to Vasst and ask them about it again.

I appreciate your help, Kim.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Well, I might have found the cause of my problems. I am currently editing a project where I did not use a particular camera that normally I do use, and everthing is flowing much better. It would seem the 60p footage from that camera really bogged things down.

I am currently doing a three camera edit and it's all 60i and the difference is like night and day. My undos are instant and the whole project is more responsive.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Glad to hear it wasent a hardware problem. Sometimes a clip can be corrupt. It is not usual but can happend when the camera is written data to a faulty media card or to a bad harddrive.
Glad you sorted it out Jeff!

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Thanks Kim. I still do prefer the performance of my SAS drives. Maybe it was the controller that made the difference. It was an Adaptec hardware RAID controller, so I don't know.

Regardless, aside from my OS booting much faster since I removed the SAS controller, I've certainly seen no improvements. I do enjoy the quiet of the SSDs and in knowiing that I'm using much less power. The fast bootups are SO nice. Bootups using the old controller took an eternity!

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Actually Jeff, you will not notice better performance using SSD's as media disks, what I know of...

The only time you will need the speed of a SSD when using it as a media disk, is when you have different videoclips on the same SSD in multiple video/audio tracks at the same timecode...

An regular harddrive will have to change the position of the acutator arm and head back and forth like crazy trying to catching up with reading the media which is spread out on the platter...

When reading data from a singel track on the timeline in your NLE, the NLE will only read the amount of data which is being played at time. Lets say you have a 40mbit/s clip on your timeline, the harddrive/SSD is only reading 5 Megabyte (MB) per seconds while its playing on the timeline. Thats no problem for even a lower ends harddrive.

Heavy VFX, when using many tracks (audio & video) at the same time, is the only way I can think of when you can benefit that kind of setup.

But I could be wrong, Im not really an expert, just an philosopher =)


Hard for me to explain corretly because as you already know my native language is Swedish. But I hope you got my point Jeff.

Re: Speeding up SSDs
 

Well, my philosphical friend, as you say, I did notice an improvement with faster drives (SAS) when using for 4 lines of 1080p footage. When editing from slower SATA drives, like 7200, things would drag. For single or two lines of video not much if any difference.

I spend money on these SSDs that I did not need to, but overall I do like having them.