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Old December 31st, 2008, 12:29 AM   #1
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Cheaper alternative to Sennheiser MKH-50

I had anticipated getting the Sennheiser MKH-50 to record interior speaking vocals (typical "living room" setting). At this point, I'm needing to save some money. I'd like some suggestions on lesser expensive mics for recording interiors. I'll be recording sit down interviews, narratives as well as short films all mounted boom style (maybe a little on camera stuff very rarely). I'd like to avoid the "hollow" sound which I believe is caused by using a long shotgun on interiors. What do you guys think about the Rode NTG-2? Is it a correct mic for interiors? Other suggestions are more than welcome!

Thanks!
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Old December 31st, 2008, 12:31 AM   #2
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Cheaper alternative to Sennheiser MKH-50

I had anticipated getting the Sennheiser MKH-50 to record interior speaking vocals (typical "living room" setting). At this point, I'm needing to save some money. I'd like some suggestions on lesser expensive mics for recording interiors. I'll be recording sit down interviews, narratives as well as short films all mounted boom style (maybe a little on camera stuff very rarely). I'd like to avoid the "hollow" sound which I believe is caused by using a long shotgun on interiors. What do you guys think about the Rode NTG-2? Is it a correct mic for interiors? Other suggestions are more than welcome!

Thanks!
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Old December 31st, 2008, 02:06 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyler Franco View Post
I had anticipated getting the Sennheiser MKH-50 to record interior speaking vocals (typical "living room" setting). At this point, I'm needing to save some money. I'd like some suggestions on lesser expensive mics for recording interiors. I'll be recording sit down interviews, narratives as well as short films all mounted boom style (maybe a little on camera stuff very rarely). I'd like to avoid the "hollow" sound which I believe is caused by using a long shotgun on interiors. What do you guys think about the Rode NTG-2? Is it a correct mic for interiors? Other suggestions are more than welcome!

Thanks!

All of the interference tube design shotgun mics, including the NTG-2, experience that hollow-sounding response pattern in a reflective interior space to a greater or lesser degreee. Hypercardioids are usually preferred over shotguns indoors for that reason. An exception is the Sanken CS3 shotgun, not an interference tube design though it looks like it is, but that doesn't help your budget woes any, costing as much as or a little more than the MKH50. You could save a couple of hundred, perhaps, by going to the MKH8050. For deeper savings versus the Senn you might consider one of the AKG ULS C480/CK63 or Blueline SE300/CK93 hypercardioids or an Audio Technica AT4053a.
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Old December 31st, 2008, 06:18 AM   #4
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it's wider than a 416. I think you'd be disappointed.

Try an Audix scx-1 HC, or Audio Technica 4053a if you can't afford a Schoeps cmc641

Regards,

Ty Ford
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Old December 31st, 2008, 08:43 AM   #5
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Anyone have a $500 option?
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Old December 31st, 2008, 08:45 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Steve House View Post
All of the interference tube design shotgun mics, including the NTG-2, experience that hollow-sounding response pattern in a reflective interior space to a greater or lesser degreee. Hypercardioids are usually preferred over shotguns indoors for that reason. An exception is the Sanken CS3 shotgun, not an interference tube design though it looks like it is, but that doesn't help your budget woes any, costing as much as or a little more than the MKH50. You could save a couple of hundred, perhaps, by going to the MKH8050. For deeper savings versus the Senn you might consider one of the AKG ULS C480/CK63 or Blueline SE300/CK93 hypercardioids or an Audio Technica AT4053a.
Steve, which of the options you just mention would better match the sound recorded in exteriors with a Sennheiser 416?
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Old December 31st, 2008, 08:48 AM   #7
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Anyone have a $500 option?
AKG Blueline SE300B/CK93 modular combo
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Old December 31st, 2008, 08:57 AM   #8
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Steve, which of the options you just mention would better match the sound recorded in exteriors with a Sennheiser 416?
Hard to say - I'm going to suggest one of the Sennheisers. But is that really important? In some circumstances it might - such as where you're intercutting wideshots done outdoors with closeups done indoors for some reason but then your closeups would most likely be shot on a soundstage or in-studio where you could use the 416 indoors without any issues. If you're trying to match exteriors on the 416 with interiors shot using a hyper, the viewer would expect the timbre of the sound to change along with the obvious change in location and so getting an exact match is less important.
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Old December 31st, 2008, 09:39 AM   #9
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Two separate threads merged together

Tyler had two threads going with the same title so I merged them together. We get the occasional hiccup with the board and have duplicates of threads when they are posted. We normally remove the duplicate before separate follow ups get started.

Just wanted to note this in case the conversation looks a bit out of continuity. The software performs the action by time stamps.

regards,

-gb-
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Old December 31st, 2008, 11:11 AM   #10
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One may also consider the Oktava 012. Not a Schoeps, but a decent mic for the money. However there are issues with this mic in terms of quality control, Chinese knock-offs and modifications.
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Old December 31st, 2008, 03:02 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andres Montana Duret View Post
Steve, which of the options you just mention would better match the sound recorded in exteriors with a Sennheiser 416?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve House View Post
Hard to say - I'm going to suggest one of the Sennheisers. But is that really important? In some circumstances it might - such as where you're intercutting wideshots done outdoors with closeups done indoors for some reason but then your closeups would most likely be shot on a soundstage or in-studio where you could use the 416 indoors without any issues. If you're trying to match exteriors on the 416 with interiors shot using a hyper, the viewer would expect the timbre of the sound to change along with the obvious change in location and so getting an exact match is less important.
Agreeing with Steve that a match is rarely important.

When it is important, consider using your hypercardoid on the exteriors as well as the interiors. There's nothing wrong with a hypercard outdoors. You just mic a little closer, as you would indoors. Use the same wind protection you use for your shotgun.
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Old December 31st, 2008, 03:16 PM   #12
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A little cheaper, not by much is - the Sennheiser 8050. It is certainly newer and offers the ability to go pure digital in the future if you're interested.

Hear the 8050 and the other family of Sennheiser's at Microphone Polar Patterns - Video Examples to learn from at DVcreators.net

The mics used in these examples are:

Sennheiser MKH 8020 - Omni
Sennheiser MKH 8040 - Cardiod
Sennheiser MKH 8050 - Super-cardiod
Sennhieser MKH 416 - Shotgun

These were fed into a Sound Devices 302 and recorded in 48kHz mode on the Panasonic HPX500.

If you go for the 8050 - do more research, there is quite a bit of low end rumble, so you'll need a good shockmount. Google is your friend.
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Old December 31st, 2008, 03:43 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Seth Bloombaum View Post
Agreeing with Steve that a match is rarely important.

When it is important, consider using your hypercardoid on the exteriors as well as the interiors. There's nothing wrong with a hypercard outdoors. You just mic a little closer, as you would indoors. Use the same wind protection you use for your shotgun.

Is great to know this. I recently got my first mic, a Sennheiser 416, and I've already experienced that "hollow sound" when using it indoors. I was totally convinced that having mics with matching sounds was a big issue; I was somehow worried because it will take me a while to save money to invest in something like a MKH 50, but I don't want to keep getting the effect of the interference tube in my indoor recordings. Now I will consider one of the less expensive options suggested by Steve.
But anyway, is there any situation in which you really need to have mics with a "similar" sound?

Best regards,


Andres.
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Old December 31st, 2008, 04:40 PM   #14
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For indoors and a sit down interview, can a large diagram cardioid be used and still kept out of the frame? Some people sound great with these mics, but I've never tried one in a position to keep it out of video.
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Old December 31st, 2008, 09:24 PM   #15
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For indoors and a sit down interview, can a large diagram cardioid be used and still kept out of the frame? Some people sound great with these mics, but I've never tried one in a position to keep it out of video.
Not a good idea. Large diaphragm studio condensers are engineered to sound best when used very close the talent. Close as in in frame. That's why shotguns and hypercardioids were invented.

I own the Neumann TLM-103. It's a killer mic but not on-camera.

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