Choosing a Solid State Sound Recorder for Film Production - Page 2 at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > The Tools of DV and HD Production > All Things Audio

All Things Audio
Everything Audio, from acquisition to postproduction.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old May 5th, 2009, 08:56 AM   #16
Major Player
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Oxfordshire, UK
Posts: 974
I would add the new NAGRA LB to your list - similar price to the SD 702 (£1,600 in the UK).

Very nice machine.

Though I went for it's big brother the Nagra VI (but that's x3 the price).
__________________
John Willett - Sound-Link ProAudio and Circle Sound Services
President: Fédération Internationale des Chasseurs de Sons
John Willett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 5th, 2009, 12:46 PM   #17
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Bothell Washington
Posts: 174
My vote is Fostex, I sold my Microtrack and moved up to the Fostex FR-2LE. You can hook it up to a extenal power supply and it has a better display. This recorder was made for field recording. Fostex is what the Pro Location Sound guys prefer.
Mark Boyer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 5th, 2009, 12:59 PM   #18
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Honolulu, HI
Posts: 2,053
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nelson Alexandre View Post
- Edirol: The worst preamps of the lot! But it compensates that with the 4 inputs if you need them.
From what I read, the Edirol R-44's preamps aren't perfectly quiet, but according to one user who records concerts the noise floor is below the noise level of the venues in which he records. Also, Oade Brothers offers a modified R-44 for about the same price as a new one, and the preamps are rebuilt to make them a lot quieter.

Ordering for Oade Brothers Audio: Edirol R44 Super MOD- Ground Shipping

For my own work, the situations are generally "real life", and the ambient noise is far above the preamp noise floor of the R-44. I believe it's also lower than my camera, a Sony EX1.
__________________
Dean Sensui
Exec Producer, Hawaii Goes Fishing
Dean Sensui is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 5th, 2009, 02:24 PM   #19
Trustee
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 1,327
THis is for Mr. Willett,

How do you like your Nagra VI? I saw it at NAB and am very interested in knowing how the mic preamps stack up against Sound Devices and THe Zaxcom Deva?

I hope to do a lot of nature audio recording and need the best possible pre amps to work with my neumann and schoeps mics.

TIA,

Jacques
__________________
Jacques Mersereau
University of Michigan-Video Studio Manager
Jacques Mersereau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 5th, 2009, 02:27 PM   #20
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Bristol, CT (Home of EPSN)
Posts: 1,182
Pardon me if this is a dumb question, but if you use one of these recorders, do you still need a mixer (assuming your not exceeding the inputs/channels)?
__________________
Paul Cascio
www.pictureframingschool.com
Paul Cascio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 5th, 2009, 03:04 PM   #21
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 2,070
Paul:

That would probably depend on what you are recording, are you recording yourself while doing other operations, if you have a sound person, how many cameras you need to route your output to, etc.

If you are a sound mixer, yes, you would want to use a separate mixer whenever possible. Better controls, panning, cuts, shelving and or roll off filters, more routing options to multiple cameras besides the recorder, etc.

OTOH, if you are scraping buy with a camera with bad sound quality recording as many of them have, a recorder even without a good mixer would provide a noticeable boost in sound quality.

Depends on you and what you are trying to accomplish.

Dan
Dan Brockett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 5th, 2009, 03:36 PM   #22
Major Player
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Selby UK
Posts: 274
Paul Cascio: That's a coincidence I was just thinking the same thing myself!

Dan Brockett: What if you do have a sound man, can you just use a sound recorder without a mixer? Will a mixer make any difference?

Previously I thought of just controlling levels on the sound recorder and not bothering with a mixer. If you need both that's going to cost megabucks for two decent quality units.
__________________
Stuart Graham
www.magentapictures.com
Stuart Graham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 5th, 2009, 04:39 PM   #23
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Lisboa / Portugal
Posts: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Sensui
From what I read, the Edirol R-44's preamps aren't perfectly quiet, but according to one user who records concerts the noise floor is below the noise level of the venues in which he records. Also, Oade Brothers offers a modified R-44 for about the same price as a new one, and the preamps are rebuilt to make them a lot quieter.
(...)
For my own work, the situations are generally "real life", and the ambient noise is far above the preamp noise floor of the R-44. I believe it's also lower than my camera, a Sony EX1.
Dean, if you record in the same circumstances with it and with the others you will notice the Edirol's noisier preamps. Of course this is in direct comparison with the others. Nonetheless, it's a great recorder and many guys are using them with success.

Oade Brothers are really known for their mods and for what I read they do work. Shame that their export costs are so high for a guy like me living in Europe.

About your EX1, any of these recorders will beat EX1's preamps hands down.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuart Graham View Post
Dan Brockett: What if you do have a sound man, can you just use a sound recorder without a mixer? Will a mixer make any difference?
Yes it will. Remember everyone here saying that SD has the better preamps of the lot? SD mixers - for instance - are dedicated preamps, so you can imagine that SD has put all their experience and know how in those boxes!

In that respect, I'm a lucky guy. I have an SD 302 borrowed from the guy I told you in my previous post just because he has bought a newer model for him.
I have to say that the SD 302 in front of my Tascam makes a big difference, one that you will notice on every sound recorded. Even so because the Tascam preamps don't like 24bits a lot, and the SD in front makes all the difference preamping 24bit files.
Nelson Alexandre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 6th, 2009, 04:18 AM   #24
Major Player
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Oxfordshire, UK
Posts: 974
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacques Mersereau View Post
THis is for Mr. Willett,

How do you like your Nagra VI? I saw it at NAB and am very interested in knowing how the mic preamps stack up against Sound Devices and THe Zaxcom Deva?

I hope to do a lot of nature audio recording and need the best possible pre amps to work with my neumann and schoeps mics.
The Nagre VI pre-amps are the best there are - they are superb - I would say certainly better than the SD (and still saying that the SD is an excellent machine and the SD better than the Deva). The ADC and DAC in the Nagra VI are also superb state-of-the art.

Nagra have been #1 in portables ever since Stefan Kudelski won the first ever International Recording Contest in 1952 with the very first Nagra recorder.

I am absolutely delighted with my Nagra VI - it was a lot of money for me as I'm only semi-pro and only use it in my spare time - but it was worth every penny and I like it more every time I use it. I have set it to automatically back-up to CF while recording, so at the end of the day I have a complete back-up of all the takes on a CF card that I can carry separately from the recorder.

I do mostly classical music recording and need the highest quality and quietest pre-amps available - these are already in the Nagra VI and I don't have to go out and buy esoteric expensive pre-amps as the Nagra ones are equal or better.

I did go for the high-capacity battery option, which will run the Nagra VI for 12-15 hours, so I can use it all day with no fear of the battery running out and I can then charge it overnight to be ready the next morning.
__________________
John Willett - Sound-Link ProAudio and Circle Sound Services
President: Fédération Internationale des Chasseurs de Sons
John Willett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 6th, 2009, 04:22 AM   #25
Major Player
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Oxfordshire, UK
Posts: 974
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Boyer View Post
My vote is Fostex, I sold my Microtrack and moved up to the Fostex FR-2LE. You can hook it up to a external power supply and it has a better display. This recorder was made for field recording. Fostex is what the Pro Location Sound guys prefer.
Although the Fostex FR-2LE is an excellent little machine, it is not a patch on the Nagra LB or SD 702/722.

I reviewed the FR-2LE (and the original FR-2) for a broadcast magazine.

I actually bought the original FR-2 when it came out (though now upgraded to the Nagra VI).

My take on the FR-2LE was that it was excellent for the price and was the cheapest machine that I would call "professional". If this is all the money you have, then it's the best option.

If you can afford more, then the Nagra LB or SD 702/722 will pi** all over it.
__________________
John Willett - Sound-Link ProAudio and Circle Sound Services
President: Fédération Internationale des Chasseurs de Sons
John Willett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 6th, 2009, 10:11 AM   #26
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 2,070
Hi Stuart:

All of the sound mixers I work with already own mixers, most use the Sound Devices 442 and two of the main mixers I work with also use various SD recorders, one has the 744T and one has the new 788.

I own my own mixer but don't have an SD recorder, I have the Zoom H4N. My mixers mic preamps are of a superior quality to the ones in the H4N.

Do you have to use a mixer? Of course not. Will using a mixer help you to obtain better quality sound? Of course. Will using a mixer make a difference? Definitely.

Dan
Dan Brockett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 6th, 2009, 10:44 AM   #27
Major Player
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Selby UK
Posts: 274
Thanks Dan, I'll take your advice. I'm going to get a mixer rather than a recorder now, probably the SD Mix-PRE which looks pretty good from what I've read and it's a good budget(ish) price.
__________________
Stuart Graham
www.magentapictures.com
Stuart Graham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 6th, 2009, 11:03 AM   #28
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Lisboa / Portugal
Posts: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Willett View Post
The Nagre VI pre-amps are the best there are...
They are really impressive but (and sorry if I'm not totally with you on this), the AATON Cantar has the best preamps of the lot, even better than Nagra's
Nelson Alexandre is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > The Tools of DV and HD Production > All Things Audio

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:04 AM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network