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Canon EOS Full Frame for HD
All about using the Canon 1D X, 6D, 5D Mk. IV / Mk. III / Mk. II D-SLR for 4K and HD video recording.


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Old September 17th, 2008, 11:48 AM   #46
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Just one question though. Who wants to take a stills camera to a video camera party?

It is pretty cool that it can do this. But I cannot honestly see myself going on a stills trip/job and also using up all my cards with video. You could never take stills and get enough footage to make a decent video edit if you are doing both at the same time.

Stills cameras with video capability and vice versa belong in the consumer market IMHO. professional equipment requires specialist function that is of real use. Not cool gimmicks.
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Old September 17th, 2008, 11:49 AM   #47
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I am hoping that Canon will soon release the XL-H2 that has all the features and video format flavors including Canon's version of a 4K Red RAW codec and high speed. The 5D is cool, but I would rather spend my money on a platform based around a camera engineered for motion pictures.
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Old September 17th, 2008, 11:54 AM   #48
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Who wants to take a stills camera to a video camera party?
Photojournalists and wedding / bridal photographers. They're going to *augment* their existing photo business with HD video on the side. I don't think anybody expects a D-SLR to replace the videographer using a real video camera.
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Old September 17th, 2008, 11:59 AM   #49
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Photojournalists and wedding / bridal photographers. They're going to *augment* their existing photo business with HD video. I don't think anybody expects a D-SLR to replace the videographer using a real video camera.
That's the theory yes. But have you ever tried covering a high pressure event like a wedding doing simultaneous stills, with all the guest control etc involved, and video at the same time?

Its a nice idea, but I do not think that it is possible to multi-task in that way and get a result that is worth paying for as a service. A stills camera doesn't have the ergonomic platform to create professional looking video anyway. So anything that comes out of it will look pretty amateurish. Especially when you consider that most lenses on stills cameras are not controlled manually, and exposure is catered for in set clicks.

Photo journalists will have problems too. Get the photo of a lifetime that pays a lot, or miss it with comparatively low resolution video that appears as a sideline on the newspaper website?

Further you will have to keep changing the camera settings. The shutter settings for stills are totally different to the requirement of video. So you can forget about quickly switching from stills to video mode and have a setting that works well.

Not going to work. Though I will amuse myself watching people try! :-)
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Old September 17th, 2008, 12:04 PM   #50
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The way it'll work in the bridal market is to have two shooters, one doing photo and the other video (and I think that's the only way it can work on a practical basis). The appeal to these photographers is that there's only one model of camera to buy and learn and accessorize, and it's in the familiar form factor of an SLR. The folks in that market will be drawn more toward the idea of an extra SLR body that can shoot HD video than they will to an HD camcorder.

I think an experienced photojournalist might be able to pull off the multi-tasking of shooting photo and video without an assistant... I know of some who are doing this already with consumer HD camcorders.
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Old September 17th, 2008, 12:11 PM   #51
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I think an experienced photojournalist might be able to pull off the multi-tasking of shooting photo and video without an assistant... I know of some who are doing this already with consumer HD camcorders.
More power to them then. But I still think it is a mistake. Rates are being squeezed as it is without doing twice as much work for even less money. I only hope they are charging accordingly.

Regardless, I think to purchase two cameras the same just to avoid learning is also a mistake. If you can use one camera you can generally use another after a couple of minutes of familiarisation.

Multi-tasking is one thing, but doing both 'well' is quite another. Could they, for example, produce stuff that is of the standard that is often posted in the Wedding video forum? If they are just getting clips to bung on a CD-ROM then perhaps it is fine.

But a fully fledged video?
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Old September 17th, 2008, 12:31 PM   #52
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It's a limitation of the camera, not the CF cards. From the press release:

"The EOS 5D Mark II will record video up to 4GB per clip or a maximum continuous movie capture time of 29 minutes and 59 seconds, whichever comes first. Depending on the level of detail in the scene, a 4GB memory card can record approximately 12 minutes of video at full HD resolution or approximately 24 minutes in standard definition."

In my opinion, they're confusing things a bit by referring to the capacity of a 4GB card in the sentence immediately following the statement about the 4GB clip limit.
Could it be the 4gb limit is a result of the FAT32 format?

I am a complete amateur in both video and photography so I mostly lurk this site to glean what tidbits I can. Been following along for at least 6 months now.

Since I am not a filmmaker the DSLR + video doesn't mean much to me at first. The big difference in regard to camcorders I haven't seen anyone really talk about is how the large sensor contributes to the ability to take HD video indoors and during the night with minimal lighting. All of the small sensor format camcorders anywhere close to the price of this or even the D90 don't seem anywhere near capable in terms of low light performance (based on D90 footage I see - who knows what the Canon footage will show).

That makes me interested in the DSLR + video revolution unfolding before our eyes. I want to take high quality nighttime/indoor HD video and DSLR seems the best way to go (not to mention the other benefits like shallow DOF,interchangeable high quality lens, etc.) for the price.
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Old September 17th, 2008, 12:38 PM   #53
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... I think to purchase two cameras the same just to avoid learning is also a mistake.
I didn't say "just to avoid learning," but perhaps I should have stated "one model to learn" in a different way. If the goal behind purchasing gear is to expand business, the quickest way to do that and return a profit is to get up and running as quickly as possible. Having only one camera model to learn, and then to instruct assistants how to use, is much faster. A single camera model offers a convenience that's easier to embrace and an accessory path (batteries, chargers, etc.) that's lighter on the budget than two different camera models.
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Old September 17th, 2008, 01:29 PM   #54
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Just one question though. Who wants to take a stills camera to a video camera party?
This will revolutionize wildlife imaging with a flood of video. The only trick will be to get proper audio. Nature shows cover that up with a narrator.

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Could it be the 4gb limit is a result of the FAT32 format?
An easy fix is to split the files into smaller files during recording. Sony is doing this on the EX1. I just hope Nikon allows you to set the size to something less than 1 GB to make the files more manageable in video editors.
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Old September 17th, 2008, 01:36 PM   #55
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I don't think the party is over... if you compare the new 5D MKII to the Canon flagship
1Ds MKIII, both being 21.1 m pixel, then the 5D actually is a better camera spec wise....

Canon wont let the 5D take away the 1Ds sales... There should be two more cameras
coming soon....

The 1D MkIII and the 1Ds MkIII will need to be upgraded also.... then we get to see
just what Canon has to offer...
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Old September 17th, 2008, 01:46 PM   #56
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I'm quite sure some people will learn to handle doing stills and video as part of a small team AND solo as well. This camera represents technical progress and a new avenue of opportunity for some.

Advances in technology are a double edged sword - they increase expectations as well as opportunities. Some of us can remember the cries of "impossible" when ENG crews of 1 reporter and 1 "everything else" first appeared. Impossible and undesirable as it seemed to many at that time, people are now doing events coverage, ENG and other work solo and handling the audio, video and lighting with great success. But of there is still a lot of work for more conventional crews, and the soundman, the boom operator, the mixer and the lighting director still exist along with camera operators and all the rest.

Some of the guys and gals on this list achieve the seemingly impossible at every wedding they cover or short film they make - doing things I would probably have said couldn't be done.
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Old September 17th, 2008, 02:46 PM   #57
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It also gives you more strobing and motion judder from inexperienced handling, and a more pronounced "jello effect" from the image wobble produced by rolling-shutter CMOS. So I think it's mostly a matter of trade-offs.

The question I have is, why not offer both? Why not have 30p and 24p as selectable HD video frame rates in this camera? I'm betting there will be a firmware hack for this sometime not too far down the road once the camera gets into the CHDK community's hands.
I am guessing that they offered 24p because the D90 camera couldn't handle 30p, thus spinning a technical limitation as an artistic feature. Almost all of the movies made with this camera will be seen on LCD computer screens or TV with 60 Hz refresh rates, so 24p can only add a lot of the stuttering judder for frame repeat/add or weird motion blur when converted to 25p/30p or 50p/60p.
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Old September 17th, 2008, 03:24 PM   #58
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Initial posts updated to include link to Canon Japan EOS 5D Mark II Special Site

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Is the sensor windowed when recording 1920x1080 video?
Judging from the official video samples, it doesn't appear to be cropped.
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Old September 17th, 2008, 04:05 PM   #59
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I quite often set up a digital stills camera on a timelapse (350d) while I run around shooting with my broadcast camera. To be able to set up the new 5D on the same full frame timelapse is nice, but to also have the option of shooting it as a b camera or for background plates and so on, not to mention the classic 'CEO Headshot' is a really nice option to have.

I don't see it as an XDCAM replacement, but I do think that it will be nice to have the camera in the back of the truck...
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Old September 17th, 2008, 04:23 PM   #60
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Mark II Has Highlight Alert

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Back to the topic, movie-enabled DSLRs are still cameras at heart and thus lack even basic video camera features, such as zebras, knee adjustment, etc.
Guess what the camera does have highlight alert which is like a blinking zebra but I'm not sure it translates to IRE values. But it does tell you when your going to blow the highlights out. Also I wonder if the exposure lattitude is different on this kind of chip as compared to a camcorder chip. Remember this chip is 1.42 inches x 1 inch. And each pixel site has it's own lens element with local 14-bit digital processing to help maximize the image quality. It will be fun to see how well it does in December 08 when it's available for sale.

Also this has real-time histograms in realtime.
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