Editing in HD With Avid and HX A1 at DVinfo.net

Daniel Fessak · November 28th, 2008, 09:24 PM

Hey all...

So I have decided to get the HX A1 in the next few weeks. When I edit I use Avid, Xpress Pro specifically. Now people here say to shoot in HD, then downconvert to SD later.

What is the best way to do that? Should I downconvert right away when importing the footage to my computer, or should I import and edit it in HD, then downconvert later when exporting when burning it onto a DVD?

Also, the HX A1 works with the latest version on Xpress Pro, right? I checked on the Avid forums and the best I could get from anyone is that they are pretty sure it does, but no one seems to be 100% on it. Can anyone here confirm?

Bill Pryor · November 28th, 2008, 10:06 PM

Avid will not accept Canon's 24f mode. So if you're using Avid, do not shoot in 24F.
I shoot everything 24f, HDV, capture in HDV in a 23.98 timeline, edit in HDV, and convert to SD on final export to whatever I need. Using FCP.

Terry Martin · November 29th, 2008, 01:58 AM

Daniel,

My experience is almost all XhA1 and Avid, starting with express pro 5.2.4, and moving on with the herd to Media Composer 3.0.

As Bill said, don’t expect 24F support, but I understand that may be coming with the next MC update.

I shoot 60i HDV, capture to Avid and then immediately transcode the GOP HDV to Avid’s DNxHD145. Now editing and effects require less CPU but more hard disk. Ultimately I export the sequence in QT reference and use Sorenson or Procoder to produce SD DVD quality mpeg2. I tried all the other methods of shooting SD or HD, and for me the above workflow is reliable and produces the best results.
Terry

Jack Walker · November 29th, 2008, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terry Martin

As Bill said, don’t expect 24F support, but I understand that may be coming with the next MC update.

I am about to buy build a new editing machine, and I was strongly considering MC 3. However, almost everything I am doing now is XH-A1 24f and JVC ProHD 24p.

I also will be using 24p from a Canon small camera, which requires that the 24p be stripped out of a 60i stream.

I am not waiting for the next update from Avid. MC 3 then, right now, is not the editor I want, is that right?

(The last update I waited for from Avid took 2.5 years, and at the beginning of those 2.5 years, it was just around the corner.)

I have CS3, so I guess I'll just try that (and maybe get a BlackMagic card). I have also been strongly considering Edius, but I'm not sure. I don't know if I need Canopus hardware or not. (I have used Procoder for years and other Canopus apps, so I trust the company, and I've used grass valley equipment for 20 years, so they seem safe.)

Peter Szilveszter · November 30th, 2008, 02:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Pryor

Avid will not accept Canon's 24f mode. So if you're using Avid, do not shoot in 24F.
I shoot everything 24f, HDV, capture in HDV in a 23.98 timeline, edit in HDV, and convert to SD on final export to whatever I need. Using FCP.

This only applies to NTSC users, PAL I have no issues at all capturing at 25f in a 1080i HDV project.

Daniel Fessak · December 1st, 2008, 01:27 PM

Does Final Cut support 24f? I'm not a fan of it, but if worst comes to worst can I just edit 24f using FC 5.0.04?

Bill Pryor · December 1st, 2008, 04:59 PM

FCP does support it, but you have to be at at least 5.1.2, I think. I may be off on those older numbers. There was a 5.0 $45 upgrade to get you to Universal, and then the subsequent upgrades were free. If you did that a couple of years ago, then you should be OK. But, I think it's in the 5.1 series, not 5.0. It could be 5.0.4, not 5.1.4. It's been awhile since I did that so I don't remember for sure. You should have an Easy Setup setting called HDV1080P24. If that's there, then you're OK for 24F.

Mark Fry · December 2nd, 2008, 10:22 AM

XH-A1 works well with Avid Liquid 7.2, interlaced and progressive, PAL and NTSC. I'm told that Vegas and Edius are OK too. Final Cut is only an option if you use a Mac.

When editing HDV, Liquid does everything in MPEG2, so no transcoding required, though you have options for higher-quality codecs for anything that is rendered. On the other hand, it's heavy on your CPU. Edius has the option of Canopus' HQ intermediate codec, which I think is a wavelet codec, not MPEG2/4-style block-compare. Apparently it's very efficient. Vegas grew out of audio editing, and has a very different interface from other NLEs. Some love it, others don't. All of them have free trial versions available - highly recommended if you are thinking of changing.

Edius 5 has just been released. Liquid will be replaced by a "new" product (but I'd bet it's still Liquid underneath) next year, probably at NAB.

HTH

November 28th, 2008, 09:24 PM	#1
Daniel Fessak Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 123	Editing in HD With Avid and HX A1 Hey all... So I have decided to get the HX A1 in the next few weeks. When I edit I use Avid, Xpress Pro specifically. Now people here say to shoot in HD, then downconvert to SD later. What is the best way to do that? Should I downconvert right away when importing the footage to my computer, or should I import and edit it in HD, then downconvert later when exporting when burning it onto a DVD? Also, the HX A1 works with the latest version on Xpress Pro, right? I checked on the Avid forums and the best I could get from anyone is that they are pretty sure it does, but no one seems to be 100% on it. Can anyone here confirm?

December 2nd, 2008, 10:22 AM	#8
Mark Fry Major Player Join Date: May 2004 Location: Oxford, UK Posts: 425	XH-A1 works well with Avid Liquid 7.2, interlaced and progressive, PAL and NTSC. I'm told that Vegas and Edius are OK too. Final Cut is only an option if you use a Mac. When editing HDV, Liquid does everything in MPEG2, so no transcoding required, though you have options for higher-quality codecs for anything that is rendered. On the other hand, it's heavy on your CPU. Edius has the option of Canopus' HQ intermediate codec, which I think is a wavelet codec, not MPEG2/4-style block-compare. Apparently it's very efficient. Vegas grew out of audio editing, and has a very different interface from other NLEs. Some love it, others don't. All of them have free trial versions available - highly recommended if you are thinking of changing. Edius 5 has just been released. Liquid will be replaced by a "new" product (but I'd bet it's still Liquid underneath) next year, probably at NAB. HTH __________________ Steam Age Pictures - videos in aid of railway preservation societies.

November 28th, 2008, 10:06 PM	#2
Bill Pryor Contributor Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 4,449	Avid will not accept Canon's 24f mode. So if you're using Avid, do not shoot in 24F. I shoot everything 24f, HDV, capture in HDV in a 23.98 timeline, edit in HDV, and convert to SD on final export to whatever I need. Using FCP.

November 29th, 2008, 01:58 AM	#3
Terry Martin Regular Crew Join Date: May 2007 Location: Palo Alto, California Posts: 100	Daniel, My experience is almost all XhA1 and Avid, starting with express pro 5.2.4, and moving on with the herd to Media Composer 3.0. As Bill said, don’t expect 24F support, but I understand that may be coming with the next MC update. I shoot 60i HDV, capture to Avid and then immediately transcode the GOP HDV to Avid’s DNxHD145. Now editing and effects require less CPU but more hard disk. Ultimately I export the sequence in QT reference and use Sorenson or Procoder to produce SD DVD quality mpeg2. I tried all the other methods of shooting SD or HD, and for me the above workflow is reliable and produces the best results. Terry

December 1st, 2008, 01:27 PM	#6
Daniel Fessak Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 123	Does Final Cut support 24f? I'm not a fan of it, but if worst comes to worst can I just edit 24f using FC 5.0.04?

December 1st, 2008, 04:59 PM	#7
Bill Pryor Contributor Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 4,449	FCP does support it, but you have to be at at least 5.1.2, I think. I may be off on those older numbers. There was a 5.0 $45 upgrade to get you to Universal, and then the subsequent upgrades were free. If you did that a couple of years ago, then you should be OK. But, I think it's in the 5.1 series, not 5.0. It could be 5.0.4, not 5.1.4. It's been awhile since I did that so I don't remember for sure. You should have an Easy Setup setting called HDV1080P24. If that's there, then you're OK for 24F.