I have the XLH1 for the weekend

Steve House · September 30th, 2005, 03:55 PM

Things to check? hmmmmmmm. How about checking to see how well it fits into a padded shipping case ... addressed to me! <grin>

Pete Bauer · September 30th, 2005, 05:40 PM

Kako, looks like you already have enough requests to fill two or three weeks, not just this weekend. But I'll add another one anyway, similar to the 16x request...

If you have a standard 3x lens, I'd be very interested to see what sort of resolution results. Unless Canon is quick to add an HD 3x or similar lens, the standard 3x would have to prove itself to be not so soft as some accuse it of being, so we have a wide angle option. A quick rez chart shot should answer that question for both XL2 and H1 users who need a wide lens.

BTW, I'm VERY jealous! ;-)

Michael Maier · September 30th, 2005, 06:09 PM

Since nobody seem to have asked, a low light test would be nice too. A comparison to the JVC HD100 would be awesome. A mini35 test would be also very useful. All recorded in "real world" HDV.
Thanks.

Jean-Philippe Archibald · September 30th, 2005, 06:16 PM

As Peter said, test the 3X lens, but both in SD and HD :).

Kaku Ito · September 30th, 2005, 07:49 PM

with all of your expectation.

This time, I did not get any extra lenses, so I can't do any testing with other lenses, but I will ask Canon for another opportunity to test with the other lenses. I believe they would appreciate all of your inputs here.

The camera is little too heavy to carry around with my mountainbike so I will do the chart testing and FX1 comparison in front of my office first.

I did not see any problem with "flip & rotate" the LCD thing at this moment, but I will change the position and check.

One thing that me and my staff are talking is to test the HDSDI input with Kona 2 and Decklink HD.

Now, we are all fortunate and the sun is out. I'm off to shooting.

Kaku Ito · October 1st, 2005, 02:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barry Green

Kaku, please verify whether the LCD "flip"/"rotate" feature works with the standard 20x lens attached. I was told yesterday at ResFest that it won't allow flipping unless the standard lens is removed; please verify whether that's true or not.

Barry,

I'm not quite understanding the situation.
Is there any parameter to adjust this? It does not do anything electronically when I'm moving the LCD.

Pekka Uotila · October 1st, 2005, 02:38 AM

Just like someones have said before, It would be really nice to hear something about the low light behaving and the sensitivity of this camera and if you could compare it to your HDR-FX1 ...

Kaku Ito · October 1st, 2005, 03:23 AM

I went to shoot some things at the park near by, shooting dogs and few people mainly facing the sun going down to see what kind of dynamic range and the control this camera has. I had owned XL1 before, also tested XL2 briefly when it was available. I was dissapointed with Knee and Blackstreatch features on XL2, so I was not really expecting anthing fabulous.

BUT, this is a big BUT to me, the black streatch feature made a big difference in the facing light and low light situation. This feature is working very good.

I'm still out at my garage typing this using Airport on my PBG5, it is very dark now, and using the minimum lights here and compared FX1 and XLH1 in the low light situation. BBBBiiiiig difference. By setting the F stop and shutter speed the same (full open and shutter to be 60), XLH1's picture at no extra gain looks like FX1's plus 9db. XLH1 seems to be very enable in the low light situation. I went to a sandwitch shop near by (Frederic has visted there before when he was there, if you are staying at Cerullean Tower in Shibuya, it is the place to go for the real Italian coffee and Japanese sytle sandwitches), I shot the guy making coffee in the shop, I was experiencing the ease of shooting video because this cam is very good with low light.

Me and my wife are used to shooting with Sony cams and we noticed significant difference in the auto focus speed. It seems to be Sony is not normal (good), XLH1 was slow to find the right focus, sometimes ended up not getting the right focus, so in many situation, I had to override and adjust manually. So, this cam is certainly not for amatures.

Zooming is smooth but the response in not as quick as FX1's manual zoom ring. I thought FX1's zoom ring is heavy comparing to AG-DVC30 (my favorite zoom ring) but XLH1 is worse. But since the manual zoom ring is working all the time (FX1 has to be switched to use, so if you are using a remote or rocker, you can't use the manual zoom ring), so it is very nice and you can utalize this for quick and flexible zoom job when you set each zoom controller the way you like.

Another thing I noticed was the battery charging time. I'm so used to Sony's lithium Ion batteries and they charge fast and last for a long time. The battery they provided me (they only provided me one) took a long time to charge (at least comparing to Sony). The battery life seems to be reasonable, but the comment could be premature to mention. I will be out to shoot tomorrow with myh bike friends with the battery full-charge, so I will find out how they perform.

I maybe did enough for today and go upstairs and start capturing the footage using LumiereHD.

Kaku Ito · October 1st, 2005, 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Christopher C. Murphy

Kaku, your celebrity has made its way into Canon's corporate procedures!

Christopher,

It is important to note that they value my association with HDVinfo on top of my mountainbiking videograph work and article writing on few magazines.
Because by handing over this cam to me for the weekend, they are getting veru quick and thorough, demanding and very wide variety of test and situation from members here.

I never forget about all of you here and the inputs.

Pekka Uotila · October 1st, 2005, 03:40 AM

The BBBBiiiiig difference sounds very important atleast to me. It will be very interesting to hear if you can tell something about the differences of the lenses when you shoot the aperture wide open. Can you notice any differences in terms of sharpness, contrast or chromatic aberration immediately?

Kaku Ito · October 1st, 2005, 04:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pekka Uotila

The BBBBiiiiig difference sounds very important atleast to me. It will be very interesting to hear if you can tell something about the differences of the lenses when you shoot the aperture wide open. Can you notice any differences in terms of sharpness, contrast or chromatic aberration immediately?

The difference between FX1 and XLH1 in the low light situation will make XLH1 the choice for filmmakers for sure.

I will find out on the details as soon as I go upstairs and start capturing. I had to go get my eats that I realized I did not eat anything because I was shooting.

Can you explain about aberration and how I should test for that?

Pekka Uotila · October 1st, 2005, 04:29 AM

All this sounds good and I highly recommend to eat,rest, think and move slowly when testing what ever. It is very time taking and you should be as accurate as possible.
I am not a master in this chromatic aberration thing myself either but to put it simply if the lense is very bad in that sense it creates unwanted coloreffects to the picture.
The problem is normally more visible when the aperture is wide open.
I'll try to find a link for you where you could see this phenomenom with your eyes.
Or if somebody else remembers where it is here at DVinfo, please help Kaku to get an idea of it.
John Jay says about it on this thread: I would like to see some tests for chromatic aberration. If you could print out a checkerboard pattern and shoot it at 4 zoom settings from wide to long and please arrange exposure to be 100% zebra on the white squares - that would be great.

Take it easy and all the best

Kaku Ito · October 1st, 2005, 04:39 AM

I have to take a bath, too.

Oh yes, I was going to do that test anyway, but can anyone help me to make the file with Illustrator or Photoshop to print that out? I have relatively professional printers like Konica-minolta postscript printer for our internal press purpose. That goes for resolution chart, too. If my printer is good enough (800dpi I guess) to print the resolution chart, I will print them out, so please someone play the part for me to prepare the files.

I did notice some green flare on the facing sun shooting. Is this a kind of aberration?

Pekka Uotila · October 1st, 2005, 04:53 AM

The green flare sounds like normal behaving for the lense, it depends...
But if you shoot from the tripod two exactly equal shots with these two cameras (if I were you I would concentrate my tests on two cameras), and there is a lamp, sun or whatever hotspot or "mainlight source" in the shot. The cameras will very likely create a different flare. It would be interesting to hear (and to see later) more of them.

Robert Niemann · October 1st, 2005, 05:05 AM

It would be great to see a similar picture from a pan in three different versions: 60i, 30f and 24f.

September 30th, 2005, 05:40 PM	#17
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	Kako, looks like you already have enough requests to fill two or three weeks, not just this weekend. But I'll add another one anyway, similar to the 16x request... If you have a standard 3x lens, I'd be very interested to see what sort of resolution results. Unless Canon is quick to add an HD 3x or similar lens, the standard 3x would have to prove itself to be not so soft as some accuse it of being, so we have a wide angle option. A quick rez chart shot should answer that question for both XL2 and H1 users who need a wide lens. BTW, I'm VERY jealous! ;-) __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

September 30th, 2005, 06:16 PM	#19
Jean-Philippe Archibald Trustee Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Saguenay, Québec, Canada Posts: 1,051	As Peter said, test the 3X lens, but both in SD and HD :). __________________ Jean-Philippe Archibald http://www.jparchibald.com - http://www.vimeo.com/jparchib

September 30th, 2005, 07:49 PM	#20
Kaku Ito Trustee Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Chiyoda-ku, Tokyo Posts: 1,382	Canon would be thrilled with all of your expectation. This time, I did not get any extra lenses, so I can't do any testing with other lenses, but I will ask Canon for another opportunity to test with the other lenses. I believe they would appreciate all of your inputs here. The camera is little too heavy to carry around with my mountainbike so I will do the chart testing and FX1 comparison in front of my office first. I did not see any problem with "flip & rotate" the LCD thing at this moment, but I will change the position and check. One thing that me and my staff are talking is to test the HDSDI input with Kona 2 and Decklink HD. Now, we are all fortunate and the sun is out. I'm off to shooting.

October 1st, 2005, 02:38 AM	#22
Pekka Uotila Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland Posts: 51	Just like someones have said before, It would be really nice to hear something about the low light behaving and the sensitivity of this camera and if you could compare it to your HDR-FX1 ... __________________ Pekka Last edited by Pekka Uotila; October 1st, 2005 at 03:09 AM.

October 1st, 2005, 03:23 AM	#23
Kaku Ito Trustee Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Chiyoda-ku, Tokyo Posts: 1,382	it has gotten dark now I went to shoot some things at the park near by, shooting dogs and few people mainly facing the sun going down to see what kind of dynamic range and the control this camera has. I had owned XL1 before, also tested XL2 briefly when it was available. I was dissapointed with Knee and Blackstreatch features on XL2, so I was not really expecting anthing fabulous. BUT, this is a big BUT to me, the black streatch feature made a big difference in the facing light and low light situation. This feature is working very good. I'm still out at my garage typing this using Airport on my PBG5, it is very dark now, and using the minimum lights here and compared FX1 and XLH1 in the low light situation. BBBBiiiiig difference. By setting the F stop and shutter speed the same (full open and shutter to be 60), XLH1's picture at no extra gain looks like FX1's plus 9db. XLH1 seems to be very enable in the low light situation. I went to a sandwitch shop near by (Frederic has visted there before when he was there, if you are staying at Cerullean Tower in Shibuya, it is the place to go for the real Italian coffee and Japanese sytle sandwitches), I shot the guy making coffee in the shop, I was experiencing the ease of shooting video because this cam is very good with low light. Me and my wife are used to shooting with Sony cams and we noticed significant difference in the auto focus speed. It seems to be Sony is not normal (good), XLH1 was slow to find the right focus, sometimes ended up not getting the right focus, so in many situation, I had to override and adjust manually. So, this cam is certainly not for amatures. Zooming is smooth but the response in not as quick as FX1's manual zoom ring. I thought FX1's zoom ring is heavy comparing to AG-DVC30 (my favorite zoom ring) but XLH1 is worse. But since the manual zoom ring is working all the time (FX1 has to be switched to use, so if you are using a remote or rocker, you can't use the manual zoom ring), so it is very nice and you can utalize this for quick and flexible zoom job when you set each zoom controller the way you like. Another thing I noticed was the battery charging time. I'm so used to Sony's lithium Ion batteries and they charge fast and last for a long time. The battery they provided me (they only provided me one) took a long time to charge (at least comparing to Sony). The battery life seems to be reasonable, but the comment could be premature to mention. I will be out to shoot tomorrow with myh bike friends with the battery full-charge, so I will find out how they perform. I maybe did enough for today and go upstairs and start capturing the footage using LumiereHD.

September 30th, 2005, 03:55 PM	#16
Steve House Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5,742	Things to check? hmmmmmmm. How about checking to see how well it fits into a padded shipping case ... addressed to me! <grin>

September 30th, 2005, 06:09 PM	#18
Michael Maier Trustee Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,269	Since nobody seem to have asked, a low light test would be nice too. A comparison to the JVC HD100 would be awesome. A mini35 test would be also very useful. All recorded in "real world" HDV. Thanks.

October 1st, 2005, 03:40 AM	#25
Pekka Uotila Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland Posts: 51	The BBBBiiiiig difference sounds very important atleast to me. It will be very interesting to hear if you can tell something about the differences of the lenses when you shoot the aperture wide open. Can you notice any differences in terms of sharpness, contrast or chromatic aberration immediately? __________________ Pekka

October 1st, 2005, 04:29 AM	#27
Pekka Uotila Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland Posts: 51	All this sounds good and I highly recommend to eat,rest, think and move slowly when testing what ever. It is very time taking and you should be as accurate as possible. I am not a master in this chromatic aberration thing myself either but to put it simply if the lense is very bad in that sense it creates unwanted coloreffects to the picture. The problem is normally more visible when the aperture is wide open. I'll try to find a link for you where you could see this phenomenom with your eyes. Or if somebody else remembers where it is here at DVinfo, please help Kaku to get an idea of it. John Jay says about it on this thread: I would like to see some tests for chromatic aberration. If you could print out a checkerboard pattern and shoot it at 4 zoom settings from wide to long and please arrange exposure to be 100% zebra on the white squares - that would be great. Take it easy and all the best __________________ Pekka

October 1st, 2005, 04:39 AM	#28
Kaku Ito Trustee Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Chiyoda-ku, Tokyo Posts: 1,382	I have to take a bath, too. Oh yes, I was going to do that test anyway, but can anyone help me to make the file with Illustrator or Photoshop to print that out? I have relatively professional printers like Konica-minolta postscript printer for our internal press purpose. That goes for resolution chart, too. If my printer is good enough (800dpi I guess) to print the resolution chart, I will print them out, so please someone play the part for me to prepare the files. I did notice some green flare on the facing sun shooting. Is this a kind of aberration?

October 1st, 2005, 04:53 AM	#29
Pekka Uotila Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland Posts: 51	The green flare sounds like normal behaving for the lense, it depends... But if you shoot from the tripod two exactly equal shots with these two cameras (if I were you I would concentrate my tests on two cameras), and there is a lamp, sun or whatever hotspot or "mainlight source" in the shot. The cameras will very likely create a different flare. It would be interesting to hear (and to see later) more of them. __________________ Pekka

October 1st, 2005, 05:05 AM	#30
Robert Niemann Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Berlin, Federal Republic of Germany Posts: 109	It would be great to see a similar picture from a pan in three different versions: 60i, 30f and 24f.