5D footage coverted via Neoscene won't sync with Z5 native - Page 3 at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Cross-Platform Post Production Solutions > CineForm Software Showcase

CineForm Software Showcase
Cross platform digital intermediates for independent filmmakers.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old July 28th, 2010, 02:15 PM   #31
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: United Kingdom, Edinburgh
Posts: 25
I've not checked how many frames out this is, but yes your description is correct. If i align the audio/video at the start it drifts out of sync, and the audio track is longer than the video track. If i get one frame in sync then its guaranteed the rest are out of sync eventually.
Jonathon Fowler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2010, 02:22 PM   #32
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: United Kingdom, Edinburgh
Posts: 25
CFHD is set to high quality. See atched JPEG for screenshot of Vegas (see audio is longer than video) and you can also see Neoscene settings.
Attached Thumbnails
5D footage coverted via Neoscene won't sync with Z5 native-screenshot-1.jpg  
Jonathon Fowler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2010, 02:37 PM   #33
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,435
...and at the time of CFHD conversion of your High setting, what is the CPU utilization?
Alex Raskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2010, 02:41 PM   #34
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Eugene, Oregon
Posts: 325
I verified and posted this thread back on June 28th raising this very issue.

No matter what setting I used, there are sync issues - I tested a full weekend with various clips and settings from different cameras and source footage - using straight m2t without scene splitting and/or capture and convert on the fly to CF AVI - Low, Medium or high - it didn't matter.

It doesn't matter if it's tape or solid state acquired content - there are sync issues.

This has been a known issue since that time and others are now beginning to experience the same thing.

When I was told to edit native compressed footage by CF Tech support - My jaw dropped.

I no longer use Cineform for all the above reasons.
__________________
Cliff Etzel - Photographer
Website | Blog
Cliff Etzel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2010, 02:42 PM   #35
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: United Kingdom, Edinburgh
Posts: 25
"...and at the time of CFHD conversion of your High setting, what is the CPU utilization?"

Not sure, I'm not doing a conversion at the moment. Why would that matter though? Even a 8 core PC would surely utilize 100%. FYI, i'm using a quad core i7 preocessor with 8 GB ram and windows 7 64 bit pro.

This is a reasonable spec PC, over the minimum spec for Neoscene (I asked Jake about this last November). Even if the CPU is at 100%, it shouldn't cause this issue, should it? otherwise why does every NLE render perfectly synced video/audio, regardless of CPU load? Higher CPU load = longer processing time, it should not mean out of sync audio/video!
Jonathon Fowler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2010, 02:50 PM   #36
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: United Kingdom, Edinburgh
Posts: 25
Cliff, your post makes very interesting reading. Even more so is David Newman's response. David, you are overly defensive of your product and the response you gave to me was very similar - it must be anything and everythign other than Neoscene causing the problem.

This is very disappointing to read.

Cliff, I understand you no longer use Cineform products. I'd be grateful if you would advise how you overcame this issue? What software do you recommend?

Thanks for you input, it's been helpful and enlightening.
Jonathon Fowler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2010, 03:17 PM   #37
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Eugene, Oregon
Posts: 325
Jonathon - contact me via PM to answer your question.
__________________
Cliff Etzel - Photographer
Website | Blog
Cliff Etzel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2010, 03:28 PM   #38
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,435
Off-topic, but I really would like to say that David Newman in fact is the most objective CTO I've encountered.

Of course he is biased towards Cineform :)

But I did notice that he is in fact listening to people. I can speculate that between his extremely busy managerial and technical tasks, direct support via forums may be overwhelming for him - but I see that he is still trying his best... for years now.

Just my experience.
Alex Raskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2010, 03:42 PM   #39
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: United Kingdom, Edinburgh
Posts: 25
Thanks for your input Alex.... any chance of you updating me about the relevance of CPU utilisation that you queried previously?
Jonathon Fowler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2010, 03:47 PM   #40
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,435
You are welcome...

I saw that with CPU utilization approaching 100%, audio does slip out of sync on 5min sequences and longer - but that was with Intel Xeon processors. I know this dates me :)

When I either overclocked or upgraded CPU, with utilization around 70-80%, I did not see any audio slippage.

This may or may not be applicable nowadays...
Alex Raskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2010, 03:49 PM   #41
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: United Kingdom, Edinburgh
Posts: 25
I really think that David should speak for himself. It doesn;t matter how busy you get, the fact is that as a CTO or CEO or whatever, if you are on here representing your company then remember that I am a paying customer and if you are willing to utilise a forum as part of your customer support, you should be even more careful about what you say and how you come across. It is lame in the extreme to come on here and defend someone or a company so much when IT IS IRRELEVANT to what is happening with my workflow.

All i want is a solution. Not excuses or ego massaging for the CEO.
Jonathon Fowler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2010, 03:54 PM   #42
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: United Kingdom, Edinburgh
Posts: 25
OK, can i please ask if anyone has experienced the same issue as me then please advise me how you resolved the matter, if at all?

David, does the CPU issue sound plausible (it doesn't to me but what the heck would i know ;)

I guess it seems that Cliff is the only other person to have experienced this issue - this MAJOR issue, and he doesn't use Cineform at all any more.
Jonathon Fowler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2010, 03:58 PM   #43
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: United Kingdom, Edinburgh
Posts: 25
So, the deal with Cineform is as follows:

You advise Cineform of the issue you are encountering. You are told to search for an answer on this public forum. Not great for me as literally my time is money and i don;t consider this to be good customer service. So i say so on this forum.

I then get David Newman moaning about me complaining. He also advises that my camera may have a fault, my memory card might not be fast enough blah blah blah.

Jake from Cineform then emails me angrily asking why i complained about him on this forum (I didn't complain about Jake - no names were mentioned, though it was actually another David who pointed me to this forum). Jake was most unprofessional at this point, though he has improved since.

I then get asked to provide Cineform with the Z5 and 5D files - these are very large files, however I was happy to do so. Cineform advise me they don't have a working FTP, try using usendit.com and other upload sites. These sites are resticted to 2GB files, no good to me. Suddenly Cineform have FTP working (I use the term 'working' casually) - I try to uplaod my files, however the FTP connection is termiated at their end. Quite useful.

Then Cliff, a fellow forum member, comes on here and enlightens me about the same experience he has had with cineform. I read his previosu post from a month or two ago and what do you know? The same old sh*t has happened to him - maybe it's your camera, maybe it's something else....

Maybe Cineform and their Neoscene product are just sh*t and unfit for the purpose for which it is designed. Maybe, despite all the fluff they spin about theior customer service, the reality is their product isn't as good as they think and, in some user's experience, is utter crap.

Now David and his henchman are nowhere to be seen or heard. Silence in the face of adversity. Better to shut up than keep digging that hole deeper.

Cineform, you suck bawls. Big time. I recommend everyone to stay well clear of this beta software.The worst software and service I have used since back in the early eighties when I got my first ZX81. It sucks bawls. Period, as you say in the States.

Thanks for all your help and belief that a customer, a payinbg customer, was telling the truth. Thaks for talking the talk but not walking the walk. No serviceable FTP - this sucks bawls. No resolutionsince Cliff reported the same issue. Sucks bawls. No further response or acceptance that the software has a fault. Sucks bawls.
Jonathon Fowler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2010, 04:03 PM   #44
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Eugene, Oregon
Posts: 325
Jonathon - I understand your frustration.
__________________
Cliff Etzel - Photographer
Website | Blog
Cliff Etzel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2010, 05:01 PM   #45
CTO, CineForm Inc.
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California
Posts: 8,090
I'm sorry you've had a bad experience, but there nothing more to say, as your manner is simply getting too abrasive to warrant direct responses -- I'm not sure how that is helping you. Calling us names is pointless, we just need sample data, until then nothing can happen to help you. I'll just wait for this data, even 10 seconds that slips a single frame is all we need. We totally want to help all our customers, and a fix for you may also be a fix for others.
__________________
David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com
blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman
David Newman is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Cross-Platform Post Production Solutions > CineForm Software Showcase

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:26 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network